Kilmar Abrego Garcia will not be returned to the US

Just don't wear a hoodie. People get shot for that.

Chicago Bulls gear implies MS-13.
Tattoos imply Tren de Aragua.

I warned everybody that if the Convicted Felon was elected that ... a bunch of yahoos in pickups would be rounding up "illegals" based on nothing more than "vibes" ... and ... that no one should leave their house without proper documentation that they are US citizens. I was being a bit hyperbolic ... but ... unfortunately not to far from the truth.

 

See, you didn’t need to dance and evade for 8 posts. It wasn’t that hard. You think Trump didn’t know. Itty bitty baby steps.

 

I have to unpack your vague comments.
Did Trump (himself) intentionally target Garcia or was Garcia flagged in the system and rounded up with all of the other amigos? If you think the former, IDK what to tell you other than offer me some proof. Its a bit absurd to think the POTUS himself is spending his time to harass random people in this country. But wilder things have happened.

The ONLY thing that matters in this very specific story is the flight from wherever to El Salvador. Nothing else matters. It doesn't matter if he was wrongly detained. It doesn't matter he is locked up in a prison. He is an Salvadorian citizen in a El Salvador prison at the mercy of the countrys president. NOBODY in the United States or its rule of law applies the moment the plane entered El Salvadorian airspace. Its that simple. It really is. I don't have to trust Bukele. Its his citizen, not the United States. Deal with it. Move on.

I respect our Constitution and its rule of law. I also understand in our short history, many atrocities have been committed by US authority. It has always happened, it will always happen and we should do our best to reduce it.

What are our options? Throw Trump in jail? Invade the one of the most peaceful countries? Or just faux rage on the internet?

 

True or false: Trump calls Bukakke. Tells Bukakke, heyo buddy, send back Garcia. I’d appreciate it and will say something nice about you in the press. I’ll help you out w something in the future. Bukakke immediately sends Garcia back with a bow on his head.

 

Jesus -

No, Trump did not target Garcia in particular.

Trump wanted all of the illegals removed and he didn't care what the laws are or what laws are broken if he gets what he wants.

The Constitution is nothing but an impediment to what the President thinks he should be able to do.

THAT is the problem - and that is why he can say that he intends to send US citizens to a foreign country, to prisons that are ran by other nations.

These are the things that should be troubling to Americans - as they have a President that is openly defying the SCOTUS, and has made it clear he intends to go deeper in breaking the protections of the Supreme Court.

MAGA supporters and some Republicans will make excuses for it - but short of our Democracy falling, there will be a liberal lead government in office at some point in the next 3-7 years - and based on history, that liberal President will adopt the precedence of Trump when it comes to unfettered Executive power and MAGA will not find it so wonderful --- and at some point, we risk someone coming into office and deciding that they will just rule without elections.

 

This time it's not the intent but rather the moves to cover it up.

 

So the guy is living in Maryland with a girlfriend and her two children that he cares for. He works as a day laborer, so he goes to Home Depot in the mornings looking for work. While there along with 4 other people (that he didn't really know) looking for work, the police approach and accuse them of being gang members because he is wearing a Chicago Bulls Hat. They take the guys to jail for loitering outside of Home Depot. Separate them and question them individually telling them that if they point out another person as a gang member, they will be released. So apparently another person claims that Garcia is a gang member. This is the totality of their evidence.



https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/abrego-garcia-and-ms-13--what-do-we-know

"Abrego Garcia was asked if he was a gang member; when he told police he was not, they said that they did not believe him and repeatedly demanded that he provide information about other gang members. The police told Plaintiff Abrego Garcia that he would be released if he cooperated, but he repeatedly explained that he did not have any information to give because he did not know anything."

"The GFIS explained that the only reason to believe Plaintiff Abrego Garcia was a gang member was that he was wearing a Chicago Bulls hat and a hoodie; and that a confidential informant advised that he was an active member of MS-13 with the Westerns clique. ...
According to the Department of Justice and the Suffolk County District Attorney’s Office, the “Westerns” clique operates in Brentwood, Long Island, in New York, a state that Plaintiff Abrego Garcia has never lived in."


More on that flimsy evidence:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/cop-behind-ms-13-dad-164456463.html

In Abrego Garcia’s complaint, his attorneys wrote that they were never able to cross-examine the police detective who wrote the report because he was suspended soon after he interviewed Abrego Garcia. His allegation is the only evidence the government has ever produced to support its MS-13 claim.

 

I think he might be dead, and that they can't bring him back, this will blow up in MAGAts faces.

DD

 

LMAO False.
Bukele hates the establishment and leftist judges. With a passion. Do some unbiased research on the man. He is not returning Garcia regardless. He will put Garcia up in a mansion and bring his family over before he kowtows to some dumbass leftist judge in any country.

 

Never said I don't care about enforcing that law. However, that doesn't mean you waive the right to due process. Numerous judges, including all 9 on the Supreme Court, have said he can stay.

It's interesting how interested you are in allowing the executive branch to dictate to the other branches when, legally, the executive can't dictate to a court what to eat for breakfast. Why are you so interested in this becoming a dictatorship? Why are you so interested in flouting numerous amendments of the Constitution?

 

Wait, did I say “leftist judges” or “the establishment” were going to call Bukakke?

Are we having trouble reading? Or are we gonna do the refuse to discuss issues and evade questions thing again?

 

It is both - they did not necessarily intend to target Mr. Garcia, but they did intend to scoop up as many illegal aliens as possible and have them be deported as fast as possible, with circumstances being secondary.

This is a pattern with this administration - we have seen the same thing with DOGE, they are reckless and attempt to work as fast as possible, with no oversight, and whatever mistakes are made are the cost of doing business and when the media or people complain - they gas light and claim they are not in anyway limited by the Judiciary.

It is the attitude and approach that is going to lead to devastating loses for MAGA at some point, we have seen past administrations on both sides of the aisle think they understand the will of the people perfectly - and then get slapped back to reality come election time.

 

Was the guy here illegally or not? If he was, he was subject to deportation. That's been clear since DJT's campaign...it doesn't matter if he was an intended initial target, once it was discovered he was illegal, that was it.

 

Trump didn't target Garcia in particular.

Trump however is using individuals like Garcia to test the waters of whether he will be able to get away with labeling American citizens as illegal immigrants in bad faith who have gang affiliation and be able to ship them out to CECOT and then tell the Supreme Court that would hypothetically order the citizens to be returned that "it's too late, it's a foreign policy issue".

So no the Trump administration doesn't have a personal vendetta against Garcia. They are using individuals like Garcia who aren't gang members and seeing how openly dishonest they can be by saying outright that he is a gang member when federal courts have been explicitly asking the government for this evidence and the government deciding "nah, we'll just skip that part and just ship him off to CECOT".


I think we need to not buy into the trap that these actions are for the purpose of immigration enforcement. The purpose of these actions given how obvious their lies are to test the limits of what they can get away with.

Fascists don't have a logical consistency to their plan and will cover every angle even if contradictory to cover all their bases. When Donald Trump suggests he wants to send American citizens to CECOT that is him covering all his bases. Because his goal is to send Americans there and if that requires bad faith claims of American citizens being illegal aliens and gang members or that just requires a acceptance by the public that we will send US citizens without the fake pretense to CECOT without even needing the fake claims of being an illegal without an ability to challenge the government's claims in court before being black bagged, what matters is the end state...which is his desire to send Americans he doesn't like to a foreign concentration camp.

 

I answered your question. It was false. Why would Trump call in a special favor and burn up brownie points to make the irrational left happy

 

I believe he doesn't want Garcia out of CECOT because he doesn't want a first hand witness of a concentration camp to be free out in public rather than having issues with "leftist judges".

My assumption of this is based on....

Every single one of the 40,000+ humans who have been sentenced to CECOT never have left the camp alive. There is no sentencing. It's all indefinite detentions because it's a concentration camp. Leaders of countries that have concentration camps typically don't want vocal first hand witnesses out and about with access to international media.

That's just my guess.

 

None of it matters. Garcia is back in his home country under his country's jurisdiction and Bukele is unwilling to send him back. Its that simple.

If El Salvador finds him innocent, he will eventually be returned like the others.

 

Bukele loves the support - both politically and financially from the Trump administration. If Donald Trump wanted to get Garcia back - he would be back. El Salvador is a very small and weak country with a massive debt and small economy.

Trump doesn't want Garcia back - he doesn't want to show the SCOTUS he will bend to their will - this is a litmus test... and he proverbially through his nuts on the table when he told the whole country that he will send Americans to foreign prisons.

As for the popularity of Bukele - he is indeed popular in his country. The country was overran with gang violence and people are happy right now to just not have to worry about some local gangster murdering them. There are concerns, he now has an incarceration rate that is two times higher than the next highest country in the world - and he can never release these people. However - he is an authoritarian leader, and they can be quite popular for awhile, we saw it in the Philippines as well wirth Duarte and with Hugo Chavez too.

 

91% approval rating. I mean he got Kim Jung Un levels of popularity in El Salvador.

I always trust the expressed popularity of a political leader of a country that does mass dragnet operations and mass incarcerate humans based on things like tattoos without a semblance of due process. Those are the places where you can trust the local population to express sincerity and be open.

 

He had 84% in the last election - I do not doubt he is popular right now. Duarte was and so was Chavez for awhile. People in despair will give up their liberties and powers to a leader, it is only later that they regret it.