Lol here you go again with the random all star appearances. Pippen didn't make the all star team in 1997 cuz he was injured and didn't play the first half of the season. He still finished top 10 in MVP voting, made all defensive first team and all nba 3rd team. That's not in his prime?? Cmon, how do you not see your double standard.. Just cuz you only decided to read DPOY didn't mean I didn't mention the all nba first team and rebounding leader multiple times in this conversation. I don't even think you can definitively say this. They didn't keep all the stats in Bill Russells time. We know Jordan scored more, but Bill Russell's defensive stats could be astronomical. This is the one that will hurt Lebron the most. Definitely should have won that, but Dirk is better than anyone Jordan faced in the finals. Which is what? Its actually very close between them. If we look at some advanced numbers Pippen had a much higher VORP and BPM for their careers.
Yes or no.....was Pippen in his prime in 1998? If you didn't want "DPOY" read, then you shouldn't have written it. And Rodman never made an all-NBA first team. They tracked points, rebounds, and steals. Zero chance Russell's blocks/steals would've compensated for Jordan's scoring dominance. Nonsense. Both Malone and Barkley are ranked ahead of Dirk. It's an ironic comparison because Dirk's ranking is elevated due to beating the Heatles, but Malone/Barkey's rankings are negatively impacted because they were unable to beat Jordan. Ewing averaged more points, more rebounds, was the focal point of the Knicks offense, was their defensive anchor, and his Knicks beat Pippen's Bulls. Ewing was a franchise player. Pippen was not.
The answer is clearly yes. Just cus he missed a few games doesn't mean he wasn't in his prime. He finished top 10 in MVP voting how is that not a prime? And he was only 32. How are you soo wrong? All you have to do is google Dennis Rodman. Just look at 1995-1996.... https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rodmade01.html Good chance he is the all time leading shot blocker is all I am saying. Ewing averaged 21 and 1.9 assists a game as the focal point of the offense. Pippen averaged 16 and 5.2 assists while really only being true number 1 one time. Looks to me that Pippen actually generated more points for his team. The fact that yall discredit him is crazy. Even phil jackson said he's the best all around player in the game.
So what's your argument? That his prime ended as soon as Jordan left? How convenient. Do you understand the difference between an all-NBA team and all-NBA defensive team? Doesn't change a thing. Ewing was the focal point of the offense. Do you think all the points he generated are reflected in his points and assists? I think we can all agree that's nonsense. No one is discrediting Pippen. You've simply made a bad comparison.
My bad that was typo in the most recent post. Meant to say all defensive team. Like the previous ones.
I know LeBron is currently the best, but man, watching Jordan was a thing of beauty. Hakeem was better than both.
Jordan would never lose a game being up 5 with 12 secs left. Gettin J’d by Josh Giddey he would never
Michael Jordan is the greatest basketball player ever - and it really isn't close. LBJ is an all-time great - but he is more Kareem than Jordan.
Actually Dirk would have been regarded as an underachiever in the playoffs if not for beating Lebron James, so James DIRECTLY helped Dirk save his reputation (8x first round exit, 4 before title, 4 after title). Dirk is also not better than Magic (1991 Finals). We quib here "if not for Curry-KD Dynasty" (also "if not for refs,etc"), Harden would have got a Championship. In the same way, Jordan thwarted them all from one: Malone's, Barkley's, and to an extent, Drexler's too (he went to two finals before winning with Hakeem on 3rd try). A championship run would have elevated their reputation from "perennial all-stars" to the top of the all-time list. And then there's the robbing by the refs: 2002 Webber & Peja's Kings, 2006 Dirk, 2007 Nash, 2018 Harden. Come to think of it, Shaq got two extra rings cos refs. The absence of Jordan-like dominant player also allowed people like Giannis, Joker, Tatum, to each get one. If Malone & Stockton or Barkley played in a "wide open" era like today, I think they'd get one too! < Is Jordan not the GOAT anymore? > ►Jordan was considered the GOAT in the 90s because he faced so many all-time great players, and he beat them all. ►Today, Jordan is not the GOAT anymore, cos Jordan only won due to weak competition, no one was skilled back then other than Jordan
dream "the hakeem" olajuwon is the goat. has unlimited packages on d and o. jordan had the shoes and nike to build him up.
A wash, Jordan was basically a meaner Guard version of Hakeem without the Nigerian and Muslim aspect. Anything else is just subjective to every fan's craving. Both could have used Curry's Shot and range.
One reason Curry had to practice long range bombs like he did was cos he grew up small. Likewise, the knock on Curry is you can tire him out, and when shots are not falling, he can't bring you home like other more physically gifted all-time-greats can. That's the reason why Curry got 1/4 FMVP instead of Jordan's 6/6 FMVP or Lebron's 4/4. For instance, game 7, 2016 Finals, all Curry needed was to make one more open shot in 4th q, and he'll own the best season ever of any player. But no, he shot a meager 6/19 FG, 4/14 3FG. Whereas Lebron shot similarly bad 9/24, but he had the hustle plays and chase down block. Same for 2015 Finals, even though GSW beat Cavs, the FMVP went to the guy who guarded Lebron. That's actually just a tacit agreement that LBJ was the best player in the series over Curry. After Durant got the 2017 FMVP, at that point Durant probably just wanna let Curry get his in 2018, and Curry is seemingly on verge of finally doing it, but no, he had to go 3/16 FG, 1/10 3FG in game 3... and he's not nuclear enough in game 4 to make up for it, nothing else in his game can make up for it. IMO Curry deserved the 2017 FMVP, Curry's gravity was what enabled Durant's good stats from the constant one-on-one plays, that's cos the Cavs worried about Curry way more, everybody chased after Curry instead of Durant. Playoffs are grind-it-out games, and Curry can't really handle it as well as others. Hence Curry would actually be less great (like in late playoffs) if he had played in the 90s. Now, Larry Bird was actually someone with a bit of Jordan, bit of Lebron, and a bit of Curry! Hakeem OTH might have a 3-point shot if he played today.
Not a curry fan obviously but in fairness the 2015 FMVP is one of the biggest jokes ever, he should've won it unanimously. Giving it to iggy was just pure trolling.
I actually disagree. It should have been Lebron. Should not have matter that his team lost. That always feel like the worst fallacy for those kinds of MVP's.
Lebron also would never quit basketball 3 times. He played 21 seasons straight despite going on deep playoff runs.
