Rockets acquire Suns picks, return Nets picks to Brooklyn

This makes a lot of sense for PHX. I have no clue what the Bucks are doing here, dismantling their team to fit Bradley Beal seems insane. I didn't think the Suns would be able to get out of this mess, and somehow the Bucks are going to bail them out to an extent.

If this trade goes through, I think the value of our 2025 draft pick could decline. They still have a tough schedule once February starts, and still running KD and Book crazy minutes (both top 5 in mins played), I have the same amount of faith in the later Suns picks as before a trade. Adding Jimmy may give them a temporary boost though.

 

He isnt trading Maxey unless its for 6 draft picks and 4 prospects. Morey asks for ridiculous demands. He wanted Andrew Wiggins, James Wiseman, the 7th and 14th lotto picks and 2 more future picks for Ben Simmons.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/42...-ben-simmons-were-never-really-alive-sources/

 

You know in the past to accept Baron Davis' bloated contract the Cavs received a top 8 lotto pick.

I HIGHLY doubt any team would be dumb enough to take Beal and his no trade clause for the worse among Cleveland and Utah picks.

 

Nah they made this trade because the 2025 pick and swap just doubled in value. Even if the 2027 pick is just a low first rounder they still benefitted as they got an extra swap and pick.

If we didnt make the trade Nets would also be a playin or even playoff team now in the weak East.

 

Strange as it sounds, it might be that the Bucks also think change is essential to contend, and see Beal as an upgrade to Middleton, and a better backcourt partner for Dame.

Middleton hasn't looked good for them this year.

 

Beal is making 20M more than Middleton. Bucks themselves are a second apron team so yet another team would need to be involved.

Basically for Suns to get Butler:
A) Heat would have to be paid enough assets to trade Butler
B) Bucks would have to be paid enough assets to take on Beal
C) 4rth team would have to be paid enough assets to take on the salary balance between Beal and whoever Bucks trade

Maybe I am wrong but I dont think a Cleveland frp is good enough for B and C. Moreover, Beal has 3 yrs on his deal and a no trade clause. Bucks would be crazy to do this just for a shakeup. Bucks have even won 4 in a row and are 7/3 in their last 10.

 

The better question is how do we c*ckblock this trade for Butler? Butler is an over-38 player in the making. He is picking up his option of over $52M and by the end of that contract will be 37. He is never getting the max again or more than 2 years outside of desperate PHX. He would also be tradable next year without costing assets. I proposed a trade for Butler before because it could help us without damaging our future assets and maximize our expiring assets. Now it has extra value to us in protecting our future PHX assets.

The Suns are going to have to jettison all of this out and maybe still be left with Nurkic. Who would they target outside of Butler? That's what we need to know because I think ALL of their eggs are in the Butler basket or stand pat and those moves have a 2/6 expiration date. They are a perimeter team with no defense or rebounding. They need the playmaking they thought they were getting with Beal. I think all of their promises to KD are we can get Butler. That is why they offered the max extensions. Riley HATES Butler. What are the assets Miami is actually going to get for doing this Pick 28 and some fluffer? Butler is an expiring for them right now. I proposed Brooks, filler and 3 2nds. Eat a bad 2026 cap with complete future flexibility and assets and all of the youngins.

I know the Rockets want Booker, I have soured on that option. I actually want KD and this could all happen next week. If you get Butler then PHX is dead and you cannot give them 2025 but you can sell them 2027 and another pick and some filler with FVV. Again, most future assets protected and not giving up youngins. 2027 Butler and KD FA with Bird rights and few options outside of S&T. If we want to keep KD we can. Butler's market is diminished. We could recoup our assets.

History doesn't wait on you to strike. That's a small price to pay to maximize assets, compete fully this year and next year, and keep the future intact.

 

If we were planning to cockblock PHX we should have outbidded them for Tyus Jones and Nick Richards. too late to do it now we can only watch PHX succeed or fail.

 

In my view, outside of this year, the future PHX picks are still looking good. They still have an aging Durant, may end up with and old Butler, it is still looking fine to me.

 

I’m right there with you. I don’t understand/believe how PHX has enough value to send out to incentivize the 4 team trade.

MIL is taking on the worst contract in the league for what’s essentially a great second round pick?

Pat Riley is giving in and letting Butler win the test of wills for one pick in the #25-30 range?

TOR are eating Middleton’s $35M of dead money next year (it must be dead money for MIL to entertain trading it for Beal) for just a #25-30 pick?

All of these seem wrong value-wise, when these other teams have all the leverage. Maybe I’m the one that’s wrong. But also maybe PHX put the cart ahead of the horse here.

 

I wouldn't mind if the Suns traded for Butler. I never really bought into the idea that they were just going to completely implode this season absent injuries. With this trade for extra picks, the Suns can go one of two ways - use the picks to surround Durant, Booker, and Beal with depth via smart trades like the one they just pulled for Richards. OR they can make a run at Butler. The former approach may screw us as it potentially extends their runway into 2027. The latter, though, has the chance to make our 2027 and 2029 picks quite valuable.

 

Jones wanted to start. No way to block without doing something stupid.

Nick Richards is a backup center. Rockets aren't going to carry 4 centers and aren't getting rid of Landale's contract just in case it is needed.

 

I dunno for Jones, like if you offered him 3x his salary or 9M maybe he'd be ok coming off the bench? Him saying he wants to start is just a rationalization on his part cuz he is only making 3M. Like if he is making only 3M and he still has to go to the bench why did he even sign there? lol.

Nick Richards only cost 5M in salary and he immediately scored 20 pts for PHX. We can carry 4 centers cuz his salary is super low, last year we carried 4 centers Sengun, Jock, Boban, Adams. If ever we trade Jock then having Richards as a 3rd guy would be pretty good.

 

Rockets got Holiday pretty cheap. They weren't going into their MLE for Jones and if they did, maybe Phoenix gets Holiday instead. I am glad the Rockets got Holiday. He's much better than his salary indicates.

The Rockets are focused more on winning. Doing things to help your team is the best. If the Suns had a RFA, maybe mess around with that. I don't see Richards as a game changer.

 

As BimaThug pointed out to me in another thread (or maybe it was this one, don't remember), the Bucks could trade Conoughton (sp?) out in a separate trade, get below the 2nd apron, and then be able to send out multiple players out in a trade. Who takes Conoughton without giving Bucks salary back to keep them under the 2nd apron is the question? Pistons are the only team with actual cap remaining. The Bucks are just over the second apron by $6.5M, so the most they can take back in salary is less than that and then meet that threshold. That means the Bucks are likely trading out assets, to make a trade for Beal work (unless they were trading Lilliard or Giannis, which we know wouldn't make sense). The Bucks then have to trade out assets out to get another team to take on Middleton.

Sounds super complicated to me, so I'm intrigued to see if it happens at all.

 

Its not just if they can do it, the bigger question is why will they do it lol. Like that Conoughton dude they will prob have to pay a 2nd rounder to do that, and then if they send out other players to get Beal they need to pay that other team assets as well.

Suns cant cover those cuz I believe they only have those 3 frps picks until 2032 and then a couple if 2nd rounders left.

 

We are much on the same page but I see that original window meeting an arbitrage point of risk and reward leveling out now. We know what our plans are and so do the Suns. They have a KD problem and their means for solving it have an expiration date. I think right now we could break them. If they cannot get Butler, I think they want to wait and reassess until the offseason. I think they did Richards because of Nurkic. It was a great low hanging fruit trade they would make at anytime but they pulled the fire alarm on that picks trade now because they need to strike on Butler. If we got Butler and then dangled some of the future back to them for KD it is going to be a lot more palatable as they recover from the disaster they will watch as we claim their lottery pick this year. It will have been two years and it failed.

I have been against trading for Butler (for the same reasons as everyone else) until a few issues recently for exactly the reasons you outline. My focus is maximizing assets. Londale, Adams, Tate, Holiday, Green, and even FVV don't serve us moving forward. Jabari over Brooks. I like Adams and would like to reacquire him next year on a cheaper deal. We have rented our cap space (FVV, Brooks) until we pay our core. I changed my mind recently because of the ability to turn the 2025 pick into lottery and acquire pieces to compete fully now without mortgaging our future. Butler and Durant can be acquired, serve us, and then be kept or used to acquire more assets.

Right now, Suns know what we want and they have every reason to screw us over. Durant, Butler, Booker et al have the potential to be a middling team like Miami most likely as we sacrifice the ability to win now for waiting several years. We made good plans and facts and circumstances changed. Brooklyn did this to us and now Phoenix. There is a point at which you have to be able to pivot and the opportunity to me is there while not sacrificing the future. A lot of future plans hinge on IF we can get Fox, Ant, etc but those tradewinds aren't guaranteed. This to me is a window where if you pull it off you get the best of both worlds. We can still do everything we want and go after the prize. Booker or Ant or Fox would have been a mega deal that altered our core. If we have to we have effectively put that decision off to a time of our choosing. If you have a top 2 team remember that Harden OKC team. I thought that team would compete for chips for a long time. I believe we need to strike now if we can. I don't want Cam Johnson. I don't want to just dump assets for nothing. We have about $40M sitting on the bench with virtually little contribution and we have assets we shouldn't keep long term. We can arguably get one semistar and maybe the best star to add to our current team.

 

If Beal is declaring he'll waive his NTC for the Bucks and Phoenix already made the trade with the Jazz with no contingency attached, then this deal is basically done. Probably just haggling over the price of what the team taking on salary are getting from one of the main participants of the trade.

 

One thing you forget is if OKC kept their guys and were just patient they wouldnt have broken their dynasty.

Looking back at OKC salary cap in 2011/2012 it made zero sense to trade Harden just because of financial reasons. KD was the only guy making the max and the luxury tax was set at 70M. OKC paid 68M in 2012/2013 and could have paid Harden's salary with what they paid Kevin Martin and Jeremy Lamb.
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I think Presti or OKC ownership just didnt think Harden was worth the max and so made up the financial reason excuse.

 

I'm not too worried about Butler possibly being traded to the Suns. It affects this year's swap negatively, but our chances at the top prospects were pretty small anyway. Outside of Flagg, Harper, and Bailey my favorite prospects aren't even mocked in the lottery thus far. The 2027 pick could still be promising considering Durant's age and Butler's history of missing regular season games.