If every team is doing that Green is not at a disadvantage with respect to other guards, hence there is not much point in talking about it. My point was, these are rare events, Sengun gets stuck in the post-up sometimes because there is no meaningful off-ball movement. But it is not worth mentioning in the big picture. We don't have infinite attention and we tend to notice some things more than others. But they are not happening quite a lot.
Jokic is probably the fastest player in the game—the way I mean. I don’t have a Synergy account but both Zach Lowe and Ben Taylor noted on podcasts his touches v time holding the ball. I believe Jokic is #1 in the league for touches but like 40th in time w the ball in his hands. He gets the ball and makes a decision. But yes, slow can work on a high level when you have Hall of Famers running the show. Otherwise it’s almost always bad offense.
Which advanced stats? This is part of my concern. He had a +0.8 DPM with DARKO—the best performance projection system—which is probably a starting caliber player, but not much more than that. It's true that being a positive at all at 22 is a good thing, but my concern is that he goes from being the great value 16th pick to an overpaid max money guy—which matters for salary cap purposes. I'm happy for Alpy to make all the money in the world; I just don't want it to **** up the long term upside of the team.
Well, I don't know if there are data that show the correlation between fast pace offense and efficiency. I don't have the time to do the research. My commonsense thinking is that the how good an offense is depends largely on the skills (not speed) of the playmaker. Like you said, if you have a HOFer running the show, it's gonna be good. A secondary factor is of course the skills of the role players and schemes that maximize them. Speed is more about style. And I am not sure if any specific style is particularly more conducive to winning. That said, I do agree that fast decision making is always a positive trait. And I don't think Sengun is weak in this regard.
Here are a few (all from Stathead/Basketball-Reference): He was 17th in the entire NBA in overall box plus/minus last season (youngest player in the top 50, other than Wembanyama): https://stathead.com/basketball/pla...min=2024&qual=mp_per_g_req&display_type=per_g 20th in the entire NBA in VORP (youngest player in the top 50, other than Wembanyama): 17th in the entire NBA in PER (youngest player in the top 50, other than Wembanyama): https://stathead.com/basketball/pla...min=2024&qual=mp_per_g_req&display_type=per_g 36th in the entire NBA in Win Shares (youngest player in the top 50) Hope this helps. When I have more time, I can also debunk your "he makes the game slow and holds the ball for a long time" eye test. I remember having looked at the data, and you couldn't be more wrong.
The modern game tries to find early shots because that's when the defense has not settled yet and you can find better opportunities. So in this case speed increases efficiency for sure. And the decision making is relatively easier. In the half court, moving the ball fast, being able to execute some plays quickly and sharply gets you a lot of advantage. But this is much harder than the early offense. You need much better decision makers and executors, hence why is jokic is so good and unique. I wouldn't call this speed though. Sengun is not bad on moving the ball quickly actually. If he sees something happening he goes for it. Or he makes quick touches far from the basket. Jokic is extra good because of his height, vision, bigger body, and sharp execution in passing. You don't need to be that level to be a top player. Sengun has lower time per touch than anyone in the rotation other than Jabari. It is 2.32 vs Jokic's 2.83. Of course it is not an exact comparison since Jokic brings the ball more but still it is apparent that he doesn't hold on to the ball too much to be a problem. Actually our young guards are not quick enough to give the ball when they don't have an opportunity. Something that will improve with age. https://www.nba.com/stats/players/t...e=Regular Season&dir=D&sort=AVG_SEC_PER_TOUCH
Y’all are a lot smarter than me so I don’t know if this is even what you’re talking about but… Edit: What Alperen Sengun posted above https://www.nba.com/stats/players/touches?SeasonType=Regular Season&dir=D&sort=TOUCHES Jokic: 7782 touches, 2.83 average seconds per touch, 1.53 average dribbles per touch, 0.261 points per touch Sengun: 3867 touches, 2.32 average seconds per touch, 1.13 average dribbles per touch, 0.212 points per touch Sabonis: 7502 touches, 2.45 average seconds per touch, 1.54 average dribbles per touch, 0.344 points per touch Centers-only
It's not surprising that big men have lower time per touch. They typically aren't the primary ball handler and don't dribble a lot when they have the ball.
All these stats are showing show me what a dominant force Sengun already is as a 19-21 year old. I'm super excited to see what season 4, 22 year old version of Sengun will bring along.
3 Pt shooting and free throw shooting. Jokic has never shot under 80%. Thanks! Yeah, kind of encouraging. I have a mixed impression of those metrics. But nice to see. .
