Terry Brown of ESPN Insider used this formula to determine the top 10 ballhoggers of the NBA... Shots+Assists+TOs=the number of possessions per game... 1. Allen Iverson 34.5 per game 2. Baron Davis 31.6 per game 3. Tracy McGrady 31.4 per game 4. Stephon Marbury 29 per game 5. Lebron James 28.1 per game 6. Vince Carter 27.7 per game 7. Paul Pierce 27.5 8. Kevin Garnett 27.1 per game 9. Jason Kidd 26.6 per game 10.Kobe Bryant 25.8 per game Some flaws in that formula I guess, but I've never seen it measured that way so it's kinda interesting. Hopefully someone keeps an individual time of possession stat this season, that would alter these kinds of lists a bit. http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/story?id=1887871
how can assists lead towards being a ballhog? isn't that "giving" the ball to someone else? they're stating that essentially, whoever the offence runs through, they're a ball hog.
Well, obviously McGrady's up there, he had to carry his team. I can't believe Jason Kidd's up there, it seems he doesn't take to many shots, but maybe because he misses so many. They should find another way to incorporate assists.
Why not: [(shots - assists) + TO] / mins T-Mac: 0.516 Carmelo: 0.496 Iverson: 0.494 Glenn Robinson: 0.494 Vince Carter: 0.479 Amare Stoudamire: 0.476 Zach Randolph: 0.472 ----------------------------- Tim Duncan: 0.456 Chris Webber: 0.452 Michael Redd: 0.451 Paul Pierce: 0.450 Kevin Garnett: 0.437 LeBron: 0.418 Kobe: 0.415 Baron Davis: 0.414 ------------------------------- Cassell: 0.317 Franchise: 0.287 Starbury: 0.281 Andre Miller: 0.231 Kidd: 0.227 Reggie Miller: 0.184 Jason Williams: 0.170 Nash: 0.140 I'm sure there's more, but hey. The stats skew once you include players on the court less than 30 mins a game. An even easier way is to just go with the shots/min approach. Evan
A true ballhog formula would be more like: [Shots+"Free Throws/2"- Assists+Turnovers] / Possessions This would incorporate free throws (although it would need to be tweaked because of "And 1" situations), and give bonus points for getting assists.
I like the "/ possessions" that they do in the article, because some teams play at a different pace than others, hence Melo's big jump in your rankings.
What I like even better is to weed out shot-chuckers from the scoring leaders. How good does it really do your team if you get your 25 PPG by firing up over 30 shots to get there? I weight PPG by multipling it by FG%. From the top ten scorers: Code: Player PPG FG% WPPG Rank McGrady 28.0 0.417 11.7 3 Iverson 26.4 0.387 10.2 7 Garnett 24.2 0.499 12.1 2 Peja 24.2 0.433 10.5 5 Kobe 24.0 0.438 10.5 6 Pierce 23.0 0.402 9.2 11 B Davis 22.9 0.395 9.0 12 Carter 22.5 0.417 9.4 10 Duncan 22.3 0.501 11.2 4 Dirk 21.8 0.462 10.1 8 Redd 21.7 0.440 9.5 9 Shaq 21.5 0.584 12.6 1 Evan
Sometimes a pass that leads to a score but not an assist, is a lot better than a pass that leads to an assist. Doesn't make much sense, but to me that gets your teammates more into a game and is the best way to describe how assists can translate to hogging the ball.
Someone in **************** . net posed an interesting debates: # assists is not a good way to gauge unselfishness, especially for PGs. PG's role is to faciliate the ball movement. Guys like Marbury and Francis have ball at hands all the time and keep dribbling until they find an opportunity that leads to assist. They may have high assists but are not unselfish. A better gauge is #assists/ # passes for PGs. Lower is better because it means a PG passes the ball even if it won't lead to assists. You need enough assists to qualify though.
The guy's top 10 in assists and only averages like 13 shots per game. He's really not that much of a ballhog, you people just got mad at him for not giving Yao the ball enough.
I should have added a smilie to my post. I was just joking but there are some people in the Rockets forum who are seriously mad about him not being on the list. Its funny because I just noticed that thread and I was going to come back here and edit mine to make sure people knew I was being sarcastic. I agree with you.
DA! I just questioned you because Tracy shot more than anyone last season but somehow he was still top 3. Peja shoots as much as Tracy and he would be on higher on the list because he actually shot 48% last season. Bryant shoots as many shots as McGrady and he would be higher than Tracy too...
The commonsense definition of a ballhog (we know exactly what a ballhog is when we play pickup games) is a guy who holds on to the ball for a long time and then shoot without passing. So the most direct measurement for ballhogmenship is to measure the actual time a player has the ball in his hand relative to his time on the floor, plus the number of times he shoots relative to the number of times he passes (not necessarily assists).
Yeah... Something like that... Who will volunteer to watch every game next season with stop watches handy? I've ALWAYS wanted a stat like that, 82 games dot com has some pretty detailed stats but nothing like that, I'm pretty sure some site will end up doing it one day.
I'll volunterr to do that for Kobe next season. It should be an easy average of 40 minutes of ballhoging fun every night.
