I'm not trying to underrate Kobe, I'm just trying to point out that you can not deny the fact that a large part of his success is due to the triangle, which allows him to go to the hole without the defense being able to collapse on him, and the fact that he's playing with the most physically dominating center ever. He is a great player, but I was talking more about being one of the greats of all time. ------------------
Kobe is only 22 and he is playing great. Yeah he has an advantage of playing with Shaq, but look a Kobe's game. When Shaq had a couple bad games Kobe goes off offensively, and even when Shaq is on he is still hitting for 22-25/night. He is a good defensive player, he feeds his big man (Shaq), he penetrates, & he has a nice jumper. He is the toital package and he is only 22! It also helps that he is very well spoken, which makes him very marketable & a good interview. Right now the Lakers easily have 2 of the best 5 players in the league. And they are both young.
Kobe is the best guard in the league. Overall he is better than Iverson, Vince, GP, JK and sorry, Stevie. But I would start my team with Shaq, Duncan or Garnett first over any guard, including Kobe. McGrady has more still to prove before I would build a team with him over Kobe, but I might change my mind if McGrady improves next year even slighlty over this years form.
I don't care what anybody say's! I still can't stand Kobe and his Jackass coach!!!! ------------------ TheMugg
i think scoring over the twin towers at will should warrant some respect. But thats just me. ------------------
Kobe is suck a cocky young idiot i dont understand why all you fools lord him so much!? ------------------
its not about loving but respecting. Even charles had to give kobe his dues and mike was his good friend too. ------------------
You guys are so quick to condemn him on the fact that he has shaq on his team. Hardaway had shaq on his team too and where is he now? To have this discussion about a player who is the second option on his team should let you know he is better than most. Everybody that you mentioned as better than Kobe is the first option on their team. Last time I check with shaq out the lakers have a winning record. Everyone always talks about MJ fighting through double teams but the fact is that MJ didnt get to God-like levels until Pipen started being a scoring threat so the double teams who come but then they paid for double teaming so they had to think twice about it. and that same Triangle that required so much spacing that makes Double teams hard to execute is the same one that Kobe is benefiting from. Kobe shoots at a higher percentage than anyone mentioned on this post, avgs more Rebounds and assists than these other young stars. Give credit where credit is due, by your definition none of these other teams have carried their teams to a title so they havent proved anything but they can carry a team to the playoffs! Big deal. ------------------
Actually Kubac, MJ won 2 MVPs without Pip, he just had to get a second scorer. Without Pip, he actually had a higher PPG than with Pip. He just learned how to get his teammates better once Phil and Pip came. ------------------ "See they pick and pick and pick. Man they picked me to death." -Steve Francis on the Utah Jazz
Yeah, MJ won his first MVP in Pip's rookie year, but Pip wasn't a big part of their team that year. He averaged 7.9 ppg. So pretty much MJ won the MVP on a team with no stars kinda like Iverson did this year. And the rest of his MVPs came in the Bull's glory years. But Jordan was routinely averaging low to mid 30s in PPG, including an amazing 37.1 PPG in only his 3rd year in the league, and 35 PPG his 4th. I would say that is pretty god-like. ------------------ "See they pick and pick and pick. Man they picked me to death." -Steve Francis on the Utah Jazz
And of course Kobe is shooting at a higher percentage than Mcgrady, Iverson, and Vince because he has Shaq to divert the attention from, and when he gets up in the air, instead of having to force up a bad shot he can dish it to the monster in the paint, Shaq. So he gets lots of assists instead of missed FGs, just because of Shaq. ------------------ "See they pick and pick and pick. Man they picked me to death." -Steve Francis on the Utah Jazz
That is exactly the point. Hardaway was a great player with Shaq. I remember him going crazy, just like Kobe, in several of the finals games. Guess what! He was called the "next Jordan". After Shaq left, his production dwindled. I feel that it is the same situation with Kobe. ------------------ The Protrolls.com message boards! Protrolls.com! And his ghost can be heard as you pass by that billabong: "All I did was steal a bloody sheep!"
Hardaway would still have been a superstar without Shaq IMO, just not as good as he was with Shaq. The thing that hurt Hardaway the most wasn't Shaq's departure, it was the constant rash of injuries. ------------------ "See they pick and pick and pick. Man they picked me to death." -Steve Francis on the Utah Jazz [This message has been edited by LiLStevie3 (edited June 02, 2001).]
And I think that Kobe would be a star without Shaq, just not at Jordan's level. ------------------ "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning how to put food on their family while being put to death." It's back... Protrolls.com!
agreed ZRB ------------------ "See they pick and pick and pick. Man they picked me to death." -Steve Francis on the Utah Jazz
