At all costs get Lively

He was about the team when he talked about being the head honcho. I dunno what mental ish you were talking about all the guys played bad that's why Rox got one of the worst records.

 

Mental ish.

- Completely checking out of plays.
- Refusing to sub out.
- Arguing with the coach.
- Bad decision making attempting hero ball.
- ETC...

Anything he does when he puts himself above the team. I was high on Udoka for many reasons including that he seemed like the only dude that might be able to get through to this dude. So far no one has. This should and probably will be the last chance for him as a Rocket. Tilman can say all the positive things he wants to media, but his contract structure proves even the team is not convinced. If he doesn't change it's not guaranteed and he'll be gone. Just like last year at this time, I'm hopeful he'll be different, but I'm not betting on it.

 

Oh I'm a hater. Oooh Burn.

You speak about everyone with a "bias" about Porter. It's true. That's what happens when fans see a dude on their favorite team put himself above the rest. Whether it's bone headed decision making, selfish play or quiting on plays, HE did that. NOT the fans that have to watch the ish on their team. And yes, he did all of that THIS year.

While you're preaching about other's "bias" towards your boy, keep in mind it goes both ways smarty... You have a bias for Porter and a bias against almost every other dude on the team. Great fan you are sir.

 

Sorry to go back to this post, as the thread is not about KPJ...But I had to, because IMO this is one of the more realistic takes on him that I've read here.

I was so high on him after his first year with us (both RGV and Rockets), but he regressed and relapsed last season. This season he's shown improvement, and his raw numbers looked good. His immaturity and volatility is what's scares me, and why I think that he's more likely to flame out than succeed. It's a shame because he's got the talent to be a star, but there's just too much red flags with him.

 

If Wemby could play next to Sengun, is it possible that Lively could as well?

 

1 through 6 are all true. What happened to Lively? Is he immature? ;-)

Seriously, Lively looks intriguing. You might be on to something with the tall kid, DD. I wouldn't select him at 4, of course, but if we were able to move up considerably from 20, he's certainly worth a good look, in my opinion.

 

He was ranked number 1 in his class for a reason. His height, length and shooting capability and shot blocking is one thing. But it's rare to also get speed to accompany that package. I really hope we find a way to get this kid.

 

Unlikely to be at 10, if we were able to move up there, or is that a possibility?

 

According to the rumors Dallas may be willing to trade out of 10 for "win now" pieces. It may take a 3rd team but I'm hopeful.

 

I heard about that and I hope we're able to do it. We have KMJ, who might want to go where he can get more minutes and a bigger paycheck. I would hate to lose him, but you have to give to get. Same with Tate, although I'm less attached to him, but healthy, he's a very solid player.

Both could be seen as valuable depth, with KMJ still having some potential to grow his game. There's other possible pieces on the roster if it takes more to move into the lottery. We'd have to have some salary dumped into our cap space, but we have loads of that.

 

I probably already posted something in this thread (too lazy to look), but I think I'll be a Lively contrarian. Though similar to my stance as the Jarace Walker hater, I can see the upside with a guy like Lively.

I'm just not 100% sure I buy the shot, and I think because of that, he'll be super limited on offense (primarily just a lob threat...albeit a good one). He'll be a beast on defense most likely. Might take some time, but I could see that happening.

I think I'm just not in love with the fit with HOU. Maybe because I'm a Sengun guy, and I'm not sure I want to spend a ~#10 pick on somebody that ultimately is just a back-up center most likely (I view Jabari more as a PF, especially if Tari snatches the SF spot long term). Would he be useful? Sure. But could you maybe get a decent portion of that production via another (much cheaper) method? I think...maybe so?

As it is, it seems the Rockets want to sign Brook Lopez. If he gets a 2-3 year deal, I'm guessing Lively wouldn't get a ton of minutes. I'm not necessarily advocating for this, but maybe you can get a James Nnaji with a pick around 30-40. And you can probably keep him overseas for a year or two so the roster isn't so crowded.

I'd probably spend that theoretical #10 pick on someone else (anyone who falls from the consensus top 8-9 or so, maybe a Bilal Coulibaly, Leonard Miller, Jordan Hawkins, Kobe Bufkin, Cason Wallace, etc), try to get Brook Lopez, try to get Nnaji somehow, and/or maybe even look at centers in future drafts. This draft seemed pretty weak in terms of centers, but I think there might be some decent ones in the next 2-3 years. And again...if Sengun is the guy, he's going to be getting 35-40mpg, and you can probably swap in bigs via FA fairly easily over time.

Now if Lively fell to 15-20 range...I feel much more comfortable taking him there.

 

why does it matter if amen will take 2 years? are we close to winning a championship and lively will get us over the top in 2 years? I'm sorry to say that our team chose the scenic route. our best players are 20 years old. most nba players don't get good until 22-24, and most don't begin their prime until 26-27. we have a long way to go.

that being said I really like lively. I've had him lottery since the beginning of the draft cycle, and would be happy to trade up for him as long as it doesn't cost us amen, jalen, tari, jabari, sengun.

 

Good points, and I'm a Sengun guy as well. So there are hints that we might try to sign Brook Lopez? The Bucks say they want him back. Of course, he wants a raise.

Brook's last deal looks like a bargain now, 4 years/$52 million, averaging $13 million a year. The most the Bucks can offer is $54 million over 3. That's averaging $18 million a year. We can beat that, but should we? Lopez is 35, but was healthy last year and had the best season he's had since 2016-17, playing 78 games, 30 MPG while averaging 16 PPG, almost 7 boards, and shooting 37.4% from deep. That is impressive. With Sengun presumably getting a lot of minutes, how Lopez would fit is definitely food for thought.

 

Lively was shooting 3's in high school. He has always had good form. Duke didn't allow him to shoot. He isn't just getting hot in workouts. His ability to stretch the floor is why was mocked in the top 5 on most boards before the season. Then he disappeared. Everyone dropped him to the 20's. I thought it we could get him at 20 he would have been the steal of the draft.

Then he re-emerged later in the season and put up historic defensive numbers. The shot was always there. Everyone is just recently waking up to the value that he can bring.

Remember that Ime likes playing 2 bigs. He can back up Sengun or maybe play with him for stretches. He covers for Sengun and Jabari could slide to the 3. In a few years who knows.

 

Well now that Sengun is 7' tall and Jabari is 6'11" and if you add 7'2" Lively you can keep 2 on at all times.

 

Cleverly disguised "I hope Portland or Charlotte take him before our pick so we get Scoot" thread