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University Instructor Fired for Showing Islamic Art

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by durvasa, Jan 8, 2023.

  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I'm highlighting the key point that I see in this situation.
    Yes Academic freedom doesn't exist in a vacuum and yes teachers should treat students with respect and respect differences but in this situation it sounds like the teacher did that. She warned students ahead of time that some might find some subject material offensive, she explained the academic reasons for showing the subject material. I've seen no evidence that the teacher took it out on students that were offended by grading them poorly.

    From what Hamline is saying is that the teacher shouldn't have shown this material at all. I don't see how that fits in with academic integrity and that seems like it would be shortchanging the students by not teaching actual factualy material just because some students might be offended.
     
    #101 rocketsjudoka, Jan 13, 2023
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2023
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  2. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I don't believe any account unless it is from the teacher themselves or the students.

    That reads 100% as a CYA press release.

    DD
     
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  3. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Yes I understand the student is upset. I'm not saying she shouldn't be but it's the expectation that then the university, and really the rest of society, should just cater to that. Whether she feels she is saving others frankly we hear that argument regarding things like we shouldn't have Gay Marriage because it threatens the institution of marriage in general. I think most understand that isn't the case and one reason why even a fairly conservative USSC recognized that marriage is a right that should be extended to same sex couples.
     
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  4. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Same paragraph you highlighted:

    "At the same time, academic freedom does not operate in a vacuum." --> Absolutely.

    "It is subject to the dictates of society and the laws governing certain types of behavior." ---> Yes, on laws, but dictates of society? Just no. She might want to remember that society once approved of slavery.
     
  5. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Still makes no sense.
     
  6. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I'll say it. She shouldn't be upset.
     
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  7. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Being upset over what an instructor says it does is a common part of college life. Most people approach the instructor, shrug it off or talk about it with other students in a group setting.

    What I'm not happy with is leadership enabling snitch culture and they didn't even bother to put the instructor and snitch in the same room to discuss what happened or why the material is legit.

    Instead they wussed out despite divisions we're seeing in the Muslim community about it. By "divisions, I mean debate, you know the stuff that sparks academic discourse.

    It feels like a double standard we never totally hashed out. If that female student reported that kind of **** in a Muslim country, the common response would be entirely different.
     
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  8. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    This is frequent problem in our society that people are upset and expect them to cater to their outrage but also that people think people shouldn't be upset and that their outrage is irrelevant.

    I don't think dictating to people what they should be upset about isn't the way to go. Given that we live in a diverse and pluralistic society this is about tolerance and accomodation. A lot of the hot topics we are debating now such as things like "woke" and how do we live with differing views. For example, some might say you shouldn't be upset when someone doesn't address someone with their preferred gender pronouns. Some might then say you shouldn't get upset that someone wants to be addressed by a gender pronoun that isn't their biological gender. Those two are mutually opposed positions designed to cancel by belittling the view of the other. As we seen just belitting the view of the other person doesn't really resolve or advance the situation.

    To bring it to another very hot button topic this is really the essence of why free speech is important in a diverse society. There are a lot of things that people find offensive in this society and there are a lot of people offended by those getting offended. Free speech is the understanding not just that people can say things some might offensive but that people can also express that offense.
     
  9. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    My position is simple. She was taking a university art history course with other students who mostly don’t share her views. She should have understood that the purpose of presenting this work of art was not to cause offense or to somehow elevate Muhammad to status of God. So, what is she upset about? Can she explain it? If not, then she shouldn’t be upset.

    I understand that her emotional reaction is somewhat outside her control because of how she’s been conditioned. Having racist feelings may also be outside of someone’s immediate control. Doesn’t change my view that people shouldn’t have those feelings. And if they have them, they should use their reasoning faculties to decondition themselves from having them.
     
  10. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Honestly that sounds like Thought Police.

    People can be offended for a variety of reasons sometimes having to do with purely internal matters. I don't think we can or should expect people not to be. What matters is how you act on that. In a pluralistic and diverse society I don't think we should tell someone that they shouldn't hold a deep seated feeling, you do actualy have a right to think racist thoughts and even say racist things, but it's about tolerance and accomodation.
     
  11. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    But I wasn’t arguing against her “right” to have her feelings or be a petulant jerk as a result of those feelings.

    Some feelings are toxic and divisive in a diverse, pluralistic society. I would include in that feelings that lead to one thinking they are justified in censoring important historical works of art in an art history class.

    I don’t agree with this notion that we must always validate or respect other people’s feelings, no matter where it leads them or what conflicts arise from them.
     
  12. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    Just here to complain about the improper use of the word WOKE


    Rocket River
     
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  13. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    It's not validating someone's feelings. You don't have to agree but you're saying someone shouldn't be thinking that way. That is asking what should be happening in someone's mind. That is getting close to being thought police.
     
  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    Or, put another way, what shouldn’t be happening in someone’s mind. The difference between what I’m saying and thought police is significant — I don’t think people should be punished for their inner thoughts. But it doesn’t follow that all inner thoughts are appropriate, or that none are inappropriate.

    I guess you’re saying that we shouldn’t judge how another person views things internally, only what they do or say outwardly that can actually affect others. But one directly leads to the other. Bad beliefs (like artistic depictions of an important historical figure is an unconditional, egregious moral sin) can lead to outward harm. If “bad” beliefs mean anything, it means people should give them up (voluntarily, of course).
     
  15. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    You can certainly disagree with how someone feels but saying they shouldn't feel that way? Not something that can really be controlled other than through things like thought police. Also not really helpful or convincing. Consider how many hot button topics we debate everyday. How often does telling someone they shouldn't think a particular way just causes people to harden their views..
     
  16. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I agree, in general, that it's not meaningful or useful to argue that someone "shouldn't" do something that is beyond their control. I alluded to this earlier. To the extent we have an ability to regulate how we react emotionally to a situation, we should do so if such reactions are harmful (both to ourselves and others). I hope this student who complained reflects on the situation, hears the arguments from many sympathetic Muslim scholars who are explaining that this was not Islamophobic, and she arrives at a place where she realizes this was not something worth being upset about. Because it wasn't.
     
  17. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Maybe she will reflect on this and change her mind. There are though several Muslims older than her who feel she was right so she might not. She can feel offended but I think the more important message is that it's wrong to expect that the school and society should cater to such a narrow view. That while her feelings and those of Muslims should be respected, and it sounds like the teacher did respect them by giving fair warning, it's not in the interest of academic integrity to then not teach factual information just to protect them from offense.

    It's the same issue as those who claim schools shouldn't teach things that make white people uncomfortable. Yes slavery and institutional racism are very uncomfortable topics. It doesn't mean we shouldn't teach them.
     
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  18. Xopher

    Xopher Member

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    She also said she was "blindsided" by the image.

    The professor included in the syllabus this was going to happen and if there were any issues to speak with her directly. The student didn't. The class was warned before the image was going to be displayed and had an opportunity to leave. Had the student approached the professor beforehand I am sure some accommodation would have been made. The student was in an art class. Art is controversial. It always has been. There isn't even a consensus in the Muslim community about showing Mohammed.

    Now had the professor just displayed the image with no warning in the syllabus or in class I might agree with the student, but she can GTFOH with her bullshit.
     
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  19. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    There is a lawsuit, and the University is now acknowledging that they shouldn't have said professor was being Islamophobic. Student's heart is still broken.

    Art professor sues after firing over Prophet Muhammad images | AP News


    Art professor sues after firing over Prophet Muhammad images
    By MARGARET STAFFORD

    ST. PAUL, Minn. (AP) — Attorneys for an adjunct art professor said Tuesday she is suing the Minnesota university that dismissed her after a Muslim student objected to depictions of the Prophet Muhammad in a global art course, while the university admitted to a “misstep” and plans to hold public conversations about academic freedom.

    In her lawsuit, Erika López Prater alleges that Hamline University — a small, private school in St. Paul — subjected her to religious discrimination and defamation, and damaged her professional and personal reputation.

    “Among other things, Hamline, through its administration, has referred to Dr. López Prater’s actions as ‘undeniably Islamophobic,’″ her attorneys said in a statement. “Comments like these, which have now been published in news stories around the globe, will follow Dr. López Prater throughout her career, potentially resulting in her inability to obtain a tenure track position at any institution of higher education.”

    In Minnesota, a lawsuit can be started by serving a summons and a complaint to the party being sued. Attorneys for López Prater said the lawsuit was served to Hamline University on Tuesday and will soon be filed in court.

    Hamline University President Fayneese Miller and Ellen Watters, the Board of Trustees chair, released a joint statement Tuesday saying recent “communications, articles and opinion pieces” have led the school to “review and re-examine our actions.”

    “Like all organizations, sometimes we misstep,” the statement said. “In the interest of hearing from and supporting our Muslim students, language was used that does not reflect our sentiments on academic freedom. Based on all that we have learned, we have determined that our usage of the term ‘Islamophobic’ was therefore flawed.”

    The statement did not address the lawsuit, but said the university strongly supports academic freedom, which should co-exist with support for students. The university plans to hold two public conversations in coming months, one on academic freedom and student care and another on academic freedom and religion.

    Last October López Prater showed the 14th-century painting depicting the Prophet Muhammad in a lesson on Islamic art. For many Muslims, visual depictions of the Prophet Muhammad violate their faith, which López Prater knew.

    According to the lawsuit, López Prater’s course syllabus included a note that students would view images of religious figures, including the Prophet Muhammad. The syllabus also included an offer to work with students uncomfortable with viewing those images.

    She also warned the class immediately before showing the depiction of the Prophet Muhammad. She said in media interviews last week that her goal was to teach students about the “rich diversity” of attitudes toward such imagery.

    López Prater has said she and the department chair were discussing her teaching a new course, but after the student’s complaint she was told “her services were no longer needed.”

    Hamline’s president previously said the professor’s contract was not renewed following the fall semester.

    The lawsuit alleges that instead of Hamline recognizing López Prater showed the images with a proper academic purpose, the university chose to impose the student’s religious view that no one should ever view images of the prophet on all other students and employees.

    On Friday, the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a national civil rights organization for Muslims, disputed the belief that López Prater’s behavior was Islamophobic. The group said professors who analyze images of the Prophet Muhammad for academic purposes are not the same as “Islamophobes who show such images to cause offense.”

    At a news conference last week organized by supporters of López Prater’s firing, the student who filed the complaint said she had never seen a depiction of the Prophet Muhammad until the October class.

    “It just breaks my heart that I have to stand here to tell people that something is Islamophobic and something actually hurts all of us, not only me,” said Aram Wedatalla, president of Hamline’s Muslim Student Association.

    The university said on Tuesday it has learned much about the complexity of displaying images of the Prophet Muhammad and understands differing opinions on the issue exist within the Muslim community.

    “Higher education is about learning and growing. We have certainly learned and continue to grow as we generate new knowledge to share with all of our Hamline community,” the statement said.

     
  20. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Hamline is backtracking and shows that the original decision and rhetoric they had wasn't well thought out. I don't know though how much chance Lopez Prater's suit has because as an adjunct Hamilne can choose not to renew. I'm not an expert on this but I don't think Minnesota has very strong slander laws so them calling her "Islamophobic" while they are backtracking not sure how much that means her suit will be successful.
     

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