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Joe Biden's America

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by SuraGotMadHops, May 12, 2021.

  1. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet
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    They have already come across the border when they are encountered. We don't have a line of border patrol agents standing shoulder to shoulder right on the border line that the immigrants are trying to red rover their way through.
    If they are expelled and come back, that is another illegal border crossing. It doesn't matter if it is the same illegal immigrant you have expelled five times before or a new one. What difference could that possibly make?
     
  2. foh

    foh Member

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    Lol the argument is whether politicians should be saying "millions of immigrants are flooding in" (to stir up the hate and get the votes). Let's assume for sake of argument that border patrol stops all crossings (100%!) and then turns them ALL away, would politicians be justified at saying "millions of immigrants are flooding in"?

    Do you see what I'm saying here?
     
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  3. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet
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    They aren't stopping crossings. They are catching people that have already crossed. Many of those people then claim asylum, get a court date a couple years out and are let free to roam around the United States. If the Border Patrol was stopping all crossings, there would be zero encounters with illegal crossers and no one would talk about immigrants flooding in.
     
  4. foh

    foh Member

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    I'm using your numbers and articles to disprove use of fear mongering quote that you decided to substantiate.
    That quote implied that "millions" are getting into the country, which doesn't seem to be "fact" as you had claimed it. Could be a million though.
    Whatever. Enjoy sounding smart with your articles and numbers. I think it's more important to understand if it's bad for economy or not. It certainly makes life for advance degree immigrants much more harder than it should be given our economic/industry needs
     
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  5. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    It will always be impossible to stop all crossings. The best and most cost effective solution is stopping the pull. Go after the employers hiring undocumented employees.
     
  6. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    A. You are inflating the number of people as it makes it look like there are 1.7 million people entering the country illegally.
    B. They aren't getting in if they are being intercepted.

    Fact is that it's a lie that people are coming in through the border and we have an open border policy. Most illegal immigration today - by far - is through people overstaying their visas. But you NEVER hear the GOP complain about that.

    Why is that?
     
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  7. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet
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    Why would advance degree immigrants be at all affected by a push for stronger border enforcement? They are not sneaking across the Sonoran desert, they are coming in lawfully on a visa.
    Actually you should do both. For one thing, enforcement against employers would only affect immigrants that are coming across specifically to work. Human trafficking, smuggling, terrorism, etc. would not be impacted by enforcement against employers, because those problems are unrelated to migrant laborers.
    I'm not inflating anything. I am the one that provided actual links to articles and studies. They are being caught after they are already in, they are not being intercepted at the border. So yes, they are getting in, and 1.7 million is the number caught in a single year and doesn't count those who avoided detection, which could be as many as 1.7 million more, though an estimate of 500,000 is also within the range predicted as I posted in the article above.

    I don't know why the GOP complains or doesn't complain about things. Why do Democrats always deflect to something else when discussing the issue? I think both illegal crossing and visa overstays should be enforced swiftly and decisively. Immigration courts are far too ponderous. Most cases should be able to be handled in a single appearance where the person is asked to provide proof of their citizenship, permanent residency, or valid current visa and if they cannot do so are on the next transport back from whence they came. Instead, they are dragged out for years. It also shouldn't require a judge to sit on the case in a courtroom and rule, that creates bottlenecks. A hearing officer from CBP should be able to handle it in a custodial setting without much difficulty.
     
  8. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    You would have to elaborate on this and be more specific on who is a hearing officer at the CBP and what are their qualifications.

    As long as it satisfies their constitutional rights to due process as stated in the Constitution as the bill of rights applies to all peoples within the United States.
     
  9. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    if you stopped the pull you wouldn’t need to increase the budget and would only need to focus on minor repairs and upgrades on the fence. The “bad hombres” are not the majority.

    Anyways, great point. We should legalize weed too.
     
  10. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet
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    They would be people specifically trained to conduct such hearings, like DMV officers who conduct hearings on license suspensions.
    The law defines what process is due. The courts would decide if whatever law was passed was sufficient. As there is a clear rational basis for controlling immigration and no fundamental right to enter the country, any due process should not need to be very expansive.
    I am all in favor of reducing government spending.
    Not just weed, whatever you want to consume, especially federally as there is no power given to Congress with regard to what people ingest.
     
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  11. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    I agree.
     
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  12. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    They are being made at the border: https://nypost.com/2022/02/04/us-made-record-1-9-million-migrant-arrests-in-2021/
     
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  13. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet
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  14. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    You understand that the vast majority are made at the border, not the interior right? You can always find outliers, but either the NY Post is lying or you're wrong.
     
  15. ROXRAN

    ROXRAN Contributing Member

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    Maybe an FBI lawyer will falsify an email like they did to justify continued surveillance of former Trump campaign aide Carter Page to “prove” who’s wrong..
    @rocketsjudoka
     
  16. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    You're gone down the rabbit hole friend. Lost in a mix of conspiracy theories and half-truths.

    You can't see it, but Trump is horribly corrupt.
     
  17. ROXRAN

    ROXRAN Contributing Member

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  18. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    If you’re talking about the Horowitz report it sis find fault with the FBI but ultimate concluded that the surveillance was sufficient cause for surveillance.
     
  19. ROXRAN

    ROXRAN Contributing Member

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    And yet that still does not justify falsifying an email..
     
  20. ROXRAN

    ROXRAN Contributing Member

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