Breaking 1-06-21: MAGA terrorist attack on Capitol

Yep. Either he is a bold faced liar or dementia has set in full force. I'll say bold face liar with signs of dementia and a whooping dose of crazy/ sociopath. She was just a few feet away from his office and was around him all the time.

 

This is such a great point. Either he was a coward who left his people out to dry, or the "deep state" obstructed a presidential order. Both things can't be true.

Honestly though, the MAGA believers know that had he shown up and was able to be in the room even after the dust settled and the rioters were violent anymore, his presence in the Senate or House Chamber would have impacted the day, and Mike Pence almost surely would have caved if Trump took to the podium, and gave a speech declaring himself the winner while all the House Republicans cheered like Rockets fans winning the Finals in 2023.

I keep thinking about the story of Mussolini doing pretty much exactly this, and his mere presence with his blackshirts caused King Emmanuel to cave to Mussolini in order to prevent violence. The Trumpers and his strategists know that had Secret Service had driven him there, and let him in the back door, Mike Pence caves and gives the floor to Trump in the House or Senate chamber, and we are pretty much done here. So to them it's like us saying we were one Chris Paul Hamstring away from the title.

 

Well, this is interesting. This Abraamson guy points out that Ornato is a trump loyalist who left his secret service detail to go into planning things like Trumps Lafayette Square upside down Bible photo op, and Biden transition team was sufficiently concerned about Ornato loyalty to trump that he got sidelined. Maybe this is a lovely trap to see if Ornato will ever come testify. Trumpers never testify, they tweet, they leak, they rumor, they personally attack people like Hutchinson and Vindman. I never thought Ornato would testify, before reading this. It reads a bit like a spy novel (gotta hit his “sub stack”, whatever that is, to get the explanation. But hey, trumpers assume crazy things are true to satisfy the agenda. This seems much more plausible than trump world q anon nonsense.

click on this and follow the thread. It’s fascinating to consider.

 

Further to my post above, if this stuff about Ornato is true, how is he gonna come testify? Deny the trump story about attacking the secret service agent, but how does he deal with questions about Lafayette square and other shady stuff he did or might have done when he left detail. What else might they ask about? Does he risk perjury himself if others will cooperate with the commission? How credible is he ultimately if he denies the story, but is clearly established as a trump loyalist who then magically has no recollection of Lafayette square or anything else like that.

it is much cleaner to say he will testify, but then never do it. That’s enough to satisfy trump world and they can run with the Hutchinson liar liar pants on fire defense of the story on the SS agent.

not that there will be any defense to the real story — old Trumpy knew there were weapons in the crowd, didn’t give a crap, and knowingly set them on to the capitol, and didn’t give a sh-T about pence because he deserved to be hung.

edit: hey @Commodore - would it be ok with you if I go ahead and assume that Ornato and the SS agent are complete liars? I just want to make sure I am doing this right.

 

If the driver and/or the agent testify under oath that Trump didn't lunge at anyone, I'll believe them. If they don't testify it's just more Fox News character assassination.

 

What's the breaking point with the MAGA people? It doesn't seem to be when anyone who was previously loyal to Trump turned coat because they witnessed something bad, they immediately become someone that is just out to get him. I legitimately think Trump himself could get on the stand and just admit to everything, say he intended for a riot to happen and helped try to make it happen, and you'd have the crazy MAGA people saying he was blackmailed into saying that and then the "reasonable" ones writing or sharing think pieces about how none of that was actually a crime so it isn't so bad

Is there literally anything that could be said that would convince them that maybe, just maybe, this guy did something bad?

 

As long as it owns the libs. A billionaire who eats his steak well done has become the angry face of a big chunk of this country. Although its been fun watching him spank guys like Ted Cruz. Trump operates as sort of an extreme version of what people think politics and/or business operates like. So they respect him. Every other institution has done a great job of spoiling their reputation so they trust him and him alone.

 

The parallels btwn here and Turkish politics under the AFP are striking btw. A lot also built off similar resentment by rural and more religious people towards the cities.

 

oh where is the fun in that? Why not be Trumpy and just believe what you want to believe? (I know we’re not gonna actually do that and the adults need to set a good example for the children, but it’s a little fun to act like we are morons too)

 

I'm not sure how things are set-up in Turkey, but it's highly unfortunate that basically our whole representation system in the US is set-up to give less say to people in cities/population centers and more say to those rural areas between the Senate and Electoral college + giving state governments the power to redistrict for the House.

I'd even be ok with a compromise that maybe removes some federal and state powers so cities and counties can decide on their own, moving to another county is significantly easier than moving to another state, but Republicans across the country and specially in Texas keep doing the active opposite of that and taking power away from cities and counties, because it's really about "owning the libs/cityfolk" in the end I suppose over functioning governance

 

Oh for sure. A lot of cities/metro areas should be into seperate states. The problem is no one wants to give up the income cities and suburbs provide. Id redraw state lines completely. Areas that had things in common in the 17-1800s dont anymore. Plus politics, even local, is increasingly nationalized. Go to a Board of Ed or town hall meeting. People are repeating what they hear on TV. Which suits local and state politicians just fine; they dont have to do anything. And because they dont do anything, people get frustrated and polarized and elect extreme politicians on a premise of never compromising.

So nothing gets done. And people get mad and so on and so forth.

 

Accountability is a mechanism for breaking away. The 1/6 rioters who have faced prosecution and will face jail time break away from Trump... I think. Once Trump is held accountable in a serious way, the MAGA people will "move on".

Outside of that, it's Time. The comfortable MAGA sitting at home watching Newsmax or Foxnews will one day need to find something else exciting and meaningful. Unfortunately, that "disease" of needing something meaningful but destructive isn't healthy for society... so while it can be a breaking point away from Trump, it's likely to mean it's being replaced with something or someone that might just be as bad.

 

I'm confused. It is trying to show the person in the hoodie and mask is Margie. But why is that a bad thing for Margie or Trump?

I'm sure it is. I'm just not sure why

 

LOL, I was thinking exactly that. I was surprised that Trump and co didn't go there.

I didn't abandon you. I was always going to be there if not for those pesky agents (who love me btw so I understand they are just doing their job). We were going to have an awesome time, going to the Capital and talking sense into Mike Pence. Because I wasn't there, Antifa and Dem instigators started the riot and so many of you, loving people (I LOVE YOU), went into the building peacefully. Now you and me are being prosecuted for stop the steal. Raise up, standby, be ready. We will win.

His game is down. Or perhaps, he's so freaking guilty he couldn't think straight anymore.

 

That's the person on the FBI list who placed pipe bombs near the Capitol.

 

It's not much of a surprise that CPAC is having its annual conference in Budapest, Hungary, celebrating the hard-right authoritarianism of Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban. He'll be the keynote speaker.

So what parts of the Orban playbook is America's right-wing already following?

"Its alliance with the evangelical movement, its alliance with the militia movement. And all of these Oath Keepers, and Proud Boys and so on."

"All of that means that in addition to the Republican Party, you've got a whole civil sector that is mobilized to bring autocracy back."

https://www.wbur.org/onpoint/2022/05/18/why-is-cpac-holding-its-annual-conference-in-hungary

 

That's an assumption.

He wouldn't be right in the middle of a riot. He could just give another wonderful speech and go back home and watch TV.

 

I thought the claim is that Trump wanted to march with "his people" right up to the steps of the Capitol

 

Sure, he goes there, gives another wonderful speech about taking back our country with strength, goes home, and watches TV.