I am at the point where some people need to have their Thread making ability taken away from them and they need to earn it back because "Trading for Killian hayes" who is one of the worse shooting guards in the NBA is a really dumb idea and thread... the pistons are TRYING TO GET RID OF HIM because he can't fit next to cade.
Hell no Killian Hayes has been trash, most Detroit fans don’t even want him so why should we trade any valuable assets for him. Plus I would think KPJ trade value is high enough to get us better than just Killian Hayes.
KPJ and Green are our backbone. KPJ has made massive strides, and he and Green looked amazing at the end of the year - people are too sensitive about young men maturing. **** like him leaving happened all the time in the past, but we weren't so thin skinned and it wasn't reported..... KPJ is fine, and his game is unique - even Lebron thinks so, enough to take him aside and tell him that the sky is the limit for him. Social media sucks, people all think they are psychologists..and want to crucify kids for their moody behavior. Ridiculous. DD
If Green is going to be the actual leader of this team he will do it organically and it does not matter who else is on the team, I have no idea why KPJ is considered me first and Green is not. We don't owe Green **** it's that kind of thinking that will doom us into becoming the Kings or the Magic always in play in purgatory. Its amazing that you know Killian would be the better playoff guy when he can't get significant minutes on a bad team after being a top 5 pick.
Not just lebron, KD and Steph have praise him. They must see something that some of these guys can't see
So are we cutting him or getting a lotto pick for him? Or are you implying KPJ has the value of a lotto pick because if that were the case he’d be gone. The kind of love for a guy who scored 16ppg on .415 from the field gets is astounding. What other team in the entire NBA is going to let him chuck literally 7 threes a game? Rockets suck and KPJ isn’t without significant blame. And yes, his silly season numbers against B teams inflated his stats. People forget how bad he was all year prior but what else is new. KPJ averaged 12ppg on .42 from the field through March. He was also a minus -717 up until that point. What a great player. His toxic attitude and iso play is certainly a great fit next to green and exactly what is needed in a franchise signal caller. This is not about Hayes. However, Anthony Bennett has no basketball IQ. I tend to have faith in high IQ young players. The amount of people calling 20 year olds busts is silly. Let’s let Hayes play a full season before jumping to that conclusion.
If both reached their ceiling, he’d be a better fit. Green is a shooting guard. KPJ is a shooting guard we are forcing to play point guard. Do you pay him long term money to play a position he doesn’t thrive in or do you let him walk and pay an actual point guard to slot next to Green? That is a perfectly valid question. He’s talented but no one here is even sure he’d accept a 6th man role. What does that tell you? As a point guard Porter JR needs to be a more willing passer. On a good team he won’t get to do his extremely inefficient James Harden impression every night. This is the whole reason I like the fit with Paolo. If we are content starting 2 shooting guards as the plan moving forward, having an elite playmaker out of the post is one of the only logical ways I see going forward.
If? Porter is much farther along at reaching his ceiling and Hayes is much farther along too being a huge bust. I don't feel KPJ has to accept being the 6th man for this team to reach its potential and I am not sure he would not accept whatever role he is called on its obvious you just don't like KPJ and you can only look at worse case scenarios. I am more than willing to let it play out and I think he could net at least a mid 1st rounder instead of a bust like Hayes.
If he takes a 6th man role I would pay to keep him on the Rockets. I’ll have to see it to believe it. If we draft Paolo, the fit isn’t so bad either if he can play more off ball. He’s talented but I don’t like his feel in a lot of halfcourt situations and his passing leaves a lot of be desired. I just don’t see him as a point guard on a winning team. I don’t know that a team trades a mid 1st for a shooting guard that scores that inefficiently. He scored 16 ppg doing literally whatever he wanted and he was garbage at it before late March/April aka silly season. There are also rumors that agents of young players don’t want them around him. I take that with a grain of salt but it’s out there and doesn’t exactly help his value. What you are hoping for KPJ is that he improves his value enough to be worth a 1st. I don’t believe he has any value at all and Hayes, as bad as he’s started his career is more value than I’d expect. Both players need significant improvement. KPJ has played more years in the league and wasn’t hampered by significant injuries. The injury thing with Hayes has been a serious impediment. Maybe that means he’s injury prone but I don’t think it’s fair to expect a 20 year old to be a superstar coming back from a labrum tear and playing on a completely busted hand that eventually shut him down for a second consecutive season. Whether he’s ever half as good as KPJ remains to be seen but I’ve seen the flashes. If Porter JR isn’t the answer long term, it’s not the worst idea to extract whatever value you can get before letting him walk. Paying him big money to be your floor general is a mistake. I know it’s trendy and safe to call 20 year olds busts. I’m going to call it how I see it regardless of consensus, the safe thing to say or how people view me. I think Paolo is the best player in this draft and I do not believe Hayes is a bust. He’s 20, has dealt with significant injuries from the jump and still, I’ve seen flashes of a great playmaker and very good defensive instincts. His jumper is not broken the way people think. Considering everything, there is a very high chance I’m wrong but I don’t mind arguing from a deficit. I watch too much basketball and have 0 social life. I’m going to call it how I see it regardless of the general consensus. That’s the most you can ask for. Clutch fans changes their mind about things almost daily. 3/4 of the forum was ready to cut KPJ mid season last year and now we want to pay him big money as the PG of the future because he had a nice month beating up on B teams in silly season. Outside of that stretch he averaged 12 ppg on .42 from the field while attempting 7 3s a game. KPJ is clearly ahead of Hayes but I wouldn’t consider either to be “good” at this juncture. I’m not even convinced Hayes becomes good, I just think Porter JR is valued among Rockets fans way more than anywhere else and it would be a mistake to offer him a contract and build a team around him.
I think he was being sarcastic. Clutch and others have talked about KPJ extensions. The fair number seems to be under $10mil. If KPJ is willing to accept. That's still a pay raise for him. If KPJ gets a salary bump say above 10 mil, I don't think even the Pistons would trade Hayes, because now KPJ costs more. Hayes 2022-23 - $5,837,760 2023-24 - $7,413,955 2024-25 - $9,942,114 (qualifying offer). I'm not a fan when people talk about Stone/KPJ Seattle connection, or KPJ dating Lucas' god daughter. It's like now if you want to trade KPJ, extend a contract, or cut loose, some of this perceived nepotism just gets messy. Personally don't think these play a factor in Stone's judgement. Him being a lawyer and all, should be fair and mindful of personal biases.
No way they trade KPJ for a mid lottery pick. Maybe top 4 if they are indeed really high on Ivey, but KPJ is an up and coming star. Ivey is at least 2 years away of being his equal if ever. I hate amateur psychologists, and I rarely use that term. He didn’t kill anyone he had an immature moment or two at less that 22 years old. Get over it all you holier than thou assholes.
KPJ for a top 4 pick. And you wonder why people think Rockets fans are delusional. Attitude aside, he put up trash stats for most of the year starting for the worst team in basketball. Top 4 LOL
Great post. If we can get him for that price (I highly doubt the market would be higher) and he can play a 6th man role, I’m all for keeping him long term. He certainly has the talent to make that signing a bargain.
A star shooting guard or a star point guard? Hope you are right. His overall passing feel and game awareness leaves a lot to be desired. And that’s if he can score more efficiently on less usage. The kind of usage he had this year to put up mediocre at best numbers… That’s not going to work on a good team.
