Breaking 1-06-21: MAGA terrorist attack on Capitol

There is no equal but anyone can justify anything to themselves. It's a special human ability.

Even if you take it seriously, they haven't made any inkling of a reasonable argument to support their ideas of them being equal. Regular protests and riots happen in this country all the time. Unless there is gov power pushing for that in their quest to overturn an election result, they simply are not about overturning democracy.

Now, if for example, Biden loses the 2024 election, refused to accept the result, insists that he actually won when people around him told him that's BS, and urged his hard-core supporters to go to the capital to stop the certification (in the larger context of pressuring states to find enough vote, pressuring the VP to do the "right thing" - to reject the electoral college vote, had a plan in place for State to send alternate electoral college vote and for Democratic member of Congress to accept those, and so on), then they would be equally guilty of trying to overturn democracy.

 

Seriously? 140 officers were injured protecting those legislators, but you don't think the legislators would have been harmed had any of the rioters had come within striking distance?

 

He wants to believe that so bad. LOL
Like they were going to sit down and have a civil conversation with Pence and the rest after crushing a cop in the door and injuring all the other police trying to stop them from getting to their targets.

 

"There is no escape Pelosi, Schmer, Nadler. We're coming for you. We are coming in like white on rice for Pelosi, Nadler, Schmer, even you AoC. We're coming to take you out. We'll pull you out by your hairs. How about that Pelosi? When I get done with you, you're going to need a shine on top of that bald head."

 

you have to be a special kind of stupid to still be equating BLM protests (with a few that had some rioting/looting) to the storming of the capitol during the January 6th insurrection.

 

That's a really dumb argument and you know it. The guy that didn't kill Kavanaugh was charged with attempted murder. I guess he was never in danger. You can't have it both ways.

Security had to shoot someone to keep the mob away long enough for Congress to escape. There were pipe bombs. Many weapons were found. Cops were beaten.

 

some of them are stupid and some are doing it deliberately as a deflection tactic. sadly, it works as we end up arguing these false "whataboutisms" instead of the actual issue.

 

Some of it is just ignorance, some is deflection, and some of it is just plain blind loyalty to either the GOP and its supporters or just racist bias. You start seeing a pattern with some when they always point out a crime by a black majority over a white majority, regardless of the crime. Some of these guys defending the coup also defended Chauvin slowly and deliberately choking a man to death, even when people screamed over and over he wasn't breathing.

 

Those officers were just clumsy and had a bad day.

 

Have you watched the movie 4 Hours At The Capital? It has more video of the riot than I have seen other places, including: showing that people broke into the House chamber while there were still Representatives inside, that a single officer outside the House chamber just talking to the people without meeting them with force was able to direct where they went and he was not met with violence, the House members were streaming past the crowd within a few feet and none of them were attacked. Additionally, how many of the rioters took guns into the building? If their goal was actually to hurt or kill members of Congress, wouldn't firearms have been helpful? Instead they were armed with flags. Why?

The crowd was fighting with the officers that were fighting with them. The officers that just spoke with the crowd were not attacked. There are dozens of videos of people talking to the cops, taking selfies with the cops, being directed around by the cops. Why were they not beating those cops?

See above. You can see that the crowd was not indiscriminately violent, that they were largely unarmed and didn't bring those weapons that would be most effective in doing violence (despite several of them having substantial articles).

No one said anything about the other rioters trying to overturn democracy (though I would argue that the January 6 rioters believed, however unreasonably, that they were trying to preserve democracy). The 2020 rioters were certainly attacking government institutions because they thought something with the government had gone seriously wrong. They were also supported by government officials (in some cases, even financially supported with things like bail funds).

Rioters did come within striking distance and they were not harmed. It is a much different thing to fight back against a cop that is hitting you to stop you from entering a building than it is to walk up to a cowering Congressperson and do them harm. Most people don't just do unprovoked violence to people.

I think it is silly that they are charging that guy with attempted murder. He seems like a confused man that was off his meds. They certainly didn't have to shoot Babbitt, and I would not be at all surprised if her family wins their wrongful death/1983 suit, though they have an uphill battle. The pipe bombs were planted somewhere else by no one knows who. There were no pipe bombs set off or thrown at the members of Congress. On the other hand, there were bombs thrown at courthouses, police stations, police officers, police cars, etc. in 2020. The lawyers that threw a firebomb in a cop car just got a sweetheart deal.

 

You know damn well they would have gotten violent with Pence, Pelosi, or the other targets they had in mind. I've seen video clips of the rioters saying it with their own words. You must have conveniently missed those clips, just like the officers getting crushed, beaten, and sprayed. If they would do that to the police, their targets were definitely in imminent danger.

P.S. You can hang, strangle, or beat a man to death without a weapon like a gun, especially when it's mob force. They made death threats! You are so damn biased dude. You defend **** that is flat out wrong. You acted the same damn way about Chauvin choking a black man to death. I just watched the movie Just Mercy again, and those people in that Alabama town reminded me of you with their warped sense of justice.

 

In some cases. But it isn't accurate to say the law enforcement officers who initiated the violence. The mob came with weapons, bear spray, to use on the law enforcement. Claiming they were only fighting with LEOs that were fighting with them is like saying when a suspect is shot after fighting with the police aren't really dangerous because they were only fighting with the cops that were fighting with them.

 

I'm not aware of this. Maybe my news bubble is to blame. Links appreciated.

 

https://news.yahoo.com/confederate-flag-waving-man-found-231454148.html

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A Delaware man who flew the Confederate flag inside the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, 2021 was found guilty along with his son of the felony charge of obstruction during the storming of the building, the Justice Department said on Wednesday.

Kevin Seefried is to be sentenced on Sept. 16 and Hunter Seefried faces sentencing on Sept. 23. The felony charge carries a statutory maximum of 20 years in prison and possible financial penalties.

 

If not one brought guns, then why are several protestors being prosecuted for brings guns into the Capital grounds and building?

Also, one of the protestors did tweet about putting a bullet in Pelosi's head. I know that sounds harmless to you, but if you storm the capital after tweeting that, I would imagine some people are likely to take that seriously.

 

I don't know that at all. I know that they did things like sit behind people's desks and put their feet up, steal podiums, and write notes.

Yes you can. If you were planning a coup against the government of the most powerful country in the world, is that what you would choose to rely on? How likely do you think it is that people would be able to capture and hang the Vice President of the United States without using any guns?

You mean like chanting "Hang Mike Pence?" or "What do we want? Dead cops?"

I just like to look at the facts that actually happened. To me, this was a disorganized riot. To you it was a coup that was aimed at hanging the Vice President. In support of my hypothesis, I put forward that they didn't bring hundreds of AR-15s and shoot their way through the limited number of police officers opposing them to wipe out the members of Congress they were allegedly trying to kill. Your evidence is that they made death threats that they had no apparent means of carrying out.

I am not even defending them. I said it was a riot and they should be prosecuted as rioters. I just don't see evidence of a coup/insurrection/takeover of the government.

Even the prosecution abandoned the notion that he choked Floyd to death. They had to recognize that he had his knee on Floyd's back. I would not have voted to convict based on the evidence that I saw. It is a well chronicled phenomenon that people high on drugs, especially if they are large in size, can die while restrained. They end up restrained because they fight the cops. The exact same thing happened to Tony Timpa and more recently to a Hispanic guy in California (I don't recall his name). Regardless, Chauvin was convicted and will probably die in prison, so it is a moot point.

I've never seen it, sorry.

Did the mob use the bear spray before or after they were attacked? Honest question, I haven't seen the initiation of violence on video only ongoing fighting. Anyone that attacked an officer either unprevoked or when the officer was in the lawful performance of his duties though should be prosecuted for assaulting a law enforcement officer.

I think one guy had a gun in the building, maybe? One was found with a gun walking around outside that I know of. Several had guns in their cars or homes or hotel rooms. The only gunshot fired, that I am aware of, was the one that killed Ashely Babbitt. Certainly, if there were going to be a forcible coup, one would expect more well armed insurrectionists. For example, here is a recording of a coup against the super power that is the government of Myanmar:

 

the videos that I've seen seem to show the mob attacking law enforcement first.

Do you have video of law enforcement iniating violence with the mob or them using violence not in the lawful performance of their duties? If any law enforcement officer did that, they should be prosecuted.

 

You of all people really should be watching the investigation. There is no doubt Trump should be charged for inciting that coup attempt. When you hear the stories from his own party, his own followers, the police that were attacked, the election officials he tried to get to fix the votes, his lawyers and people he fired who told him he lost, and didn't want to push the lie further, and all the videos and emails and texts and recorded calls, there is no way in hell you would say some of the crap you do. It was an attempted coup! Trump should be charged and convicted of several felonies.

There is no way you could listen to those officers talk about what was inflicted upon them and act like it wasn't as serious as it was. The mob thugs all say the same thing. Trump told them to come. Trump told them to charge the Capitol. They believed his BS propaganda purposely meant to incite them as the Patriotic thing to do. Patriotism has a disturbing meaning when it comes from a man attempting to overturn the election results to stay in power. That's the kind of crap you expect from guys like Putin, or the other fascists/dictator or communist types.

Again, when you have mobs storming in anger and screaming to kill and hang someone that can be done without a gun. Hell, 5 guys could beat and kick one person to death.

Your version of the Chauvin case is disgusting. You obviously didn't watch the hours of testimony from medical experts, witnesses, police experts, EMT's or all the other numerous people who rebutted many of your versions and claims to that particular case.

 

Eh, he doesn't have to. He has his mind made of already, as does most of the country. The rest are too apathetic to care.