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Kevin Porter Jr. - how good can he be?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by ashleyem, Mar 28, 2021.

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What is your prediction on KPJ’s career?

Poll closed Apr 27, 2021.
  1. Franchise player

    93 vote(s)
    35.0%
  2. Borderline Allstar

    150 vote(s)
    56.4%
  3. Role Player

    22 vote(s)
    8.3%
  4. Benchwarmer

    1 vote(s)
    0.4%
  1. Dobbizzle

    Dobbizzle Member

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    He's still new to the position, people really need to learn to be patient and give him time. Playing point requires somebody to make much faster decisions and improvise more than any other position on the court, he needs to learn how to see the court that way and everything will take time from reading the court, making the right pass and knowing when you should be scoring and when you should be passing. As time goes on, the game will slow down for him and then it'll be about whether he asserts himself or not. It's very very rare that a player is a Harden who can hold the ball forever and still be effective. Once he knows how to succeed with the various options available to him, hopefully he'll start to assert himself and you'll see less time stood still with the ball and either faster distribution or a more assertive attack that either leads to a bucket or causes the D to collapse. He has the pieces, but nobody puts it together in an instant.
     
  2. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    For the many he is new to the position folks. I swear that I am not trying to be an ass, this is a serious request. Please provide a list of guys who have come into the NBA and successfully converted to full time PG when being the primary ball handler responsible for initiating offense was not their natural position. I have James Harden and I'm having trouble constructing an actual list. Reason being, people don't typically get converted to PG. It is a demanding position requiring a very specific skill sit. You typically either are one or you aren't. A good example of this is our very own Eric Gordon who the Rockets have tried to shoehorn at times into a backup PG role and it just doesn't really work. The NBA has a lot of combo guard "tweener" type players who can give you some solid minutes here and there, but they aren't good enough play makers to be at that position full time.
     
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  3. peleincubus

    peleincubus Member

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    I am hoping the Rockets are good enough and strong enough down the road where KPJ can have a bench role and be the PG then. I think he would be better as a part time role doing it. Perhaps in the draft they can get another solid big man and then sign a free agent or trade for a PG in two seasons.
     
  4. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Didn’t posters write off Mills after a couple bad outings?
    People aren’t consistent in their application of logic.
     
  5. Dobbizzle

    Dobbizzle Member

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    That's a fair point, and really is what the Porter project is about. If he can make the switch he could potentially be a standout player, if not he'll likely become a solid wing with a much lower ceiling.
     
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  6. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Scottie Barnes
    Nikola Jokic
    Ben Simmons
    James Harden
    Draymond Green
    Andre Iguodala
    Lebron James
    Scottie Pippen

    And a few more I'm sure.

    While not a long list, it is certainly not unheard of or impossible.

    Patience.
     
  7. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    Nah that’s an overly generous list D. I said didn’t come into the league as either a PG or primary ball handler. Made that distinction because technically most of those guys still aren’t listed as a PG now even though they dominate the ball. Several of those guys fit that description.

    Contextually speaking, Lebron has always been ball dominant and essentially the PG. Iggy, Simmons, Barnes and Draymond led their college teams in assists and initiated offense quite frequently. On the flip side, KPJ only averaged a little over 1 assist per game at USC. I don’t know what Pippen did in college, I didn’t watch back then, but I’d be shocked if he didn’t have a role similar to those other guys since he was drafted so high coming from such a small school.

    What we are trying to get KPJ to do is extremity rare. Almost unprecedented. Truth be told, many people were saying Harden was a PG even when he came out. He did it all his sophomore year. Led his team in scoring and was 2nd in assists and rebounds. Just so happened the team that drafted him had an up and coming future MVP already at that position. Lots of people were saying at one point OKC should allow Harden to play PG and move Russ to SG and let him be in attack mode. Just thinking out loud. You know all of this already.
     
    #767 vator, Oct 13, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021
    34to11 likes this.
  8. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Ben Simmons was a PF at LSU.

    Barnes was a point for 1 year in college, hardly qualifies as experienced PG.

    Harden never played PG until playing for Rockets under MDA which was +6 years into NBA career.

    Draymond Green never led any teams in assists until GSW.

    Jokic led the Nuggets in assists last season with over 8 per game, legit point center now. 7 years after he was drafted.

    Keep being an unbeliever but the comps are not as "generous" as you'd like to believe.
     
    #768 D-rock, Oct 13, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2021
  9. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    That’s why I give you Harden. I just wanted to point out that he’s always had PG skills. I’m not even touching the Jokic thing. That’s a different conversation considering the way he generates offense.

    Scottie Barnes led his team in assists last year and averaged more assists than Cade Cunningham with less turnovers.

    Draymond Green led Michigan State in assists 1 year and came in virtually a tie for the lead the next year missing it by .1

    Ben Simmons led LSU in assists. Why does it matter if he was the listed PG when he brought the ball up and everybody was comparing him to Lebron who has technically been a PG from the moment he entered the league, but was only given position credit for it the last 2 years. He’s always been the PG.

    Iggy led Arizona in assists
     
  10. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Porter led Vipers in assists last season.

    And Porter was half an assist short of leading Rockets in assists last season.

    What exactly is your point????
     
  11. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    Point is that the list of players that have successfully been converted from off ball players to primary ball handlers and distributors isn’t very long. I’ve proven that point. Doesn’t mean KPJ can’t do it or that it’s impossible. The point is that it doesn’t happen very often.
     
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  12. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    Seems to be happening with Scoot as well, no matter how much you disagree or it displeases you.
     
  13. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    Now tell me why it would displease me that he succeeds as a PG? I’m not following the logic here. If you recall, I was one of the only people along with you in the RGV thread watching Viper games and following his every move. I was more interested in RGV games than even Rockets games at that point and it was because of Kevin Porter Jr and KJ Martin. Didn’t miss a single second of any game he played in and couldn’t wait for him to be recalled.
     
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  14. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    So I'll rephrase and say you are now pushing back on the position change. Or have doubts.

    Porter is brand new at PG, there will be growing pains I'm sure.

    But either commit or move him to another team that believes in him.
     
    vator likes this.
  15. vator

    vator Contributing Member

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    I'm fine with moth balling John Wall so that KPJ can take over so we can see what we have. There will be obvious growing pains. Lots of games where he looks absolutely AWFUL and then he will have a few where his shot is falling and he looks like a future cornerstone. I'm not trying to call my shot here. I'm just making observations. There are certain things about his game that I don't like in regards to him being our starting PG of the future.There are a few glaring boxes that he doesn't check for me in that role so I just don't know if this is the best spot for him, but we will find out soon. I see him more as a good secondary ball handler like Devin Booker.

    I'm rooting for him. Just like I'm rooting for Jalen Green, but I know you can relate to this because you were a huge draft Evan Mobley guy, any time you bring up something you notice about one of our players, you get attacked for pointing out the flaws you see in their games. Pointing out something doesn't always mean that you don't think they can get better at it. I mean we are here to talk basketball at the end of the day. Not just participate in a bunch of group think where we all project super-stardom for half of the guys on the roster. There are plenty of those types of posters here. Conversely, we do have those hate posters who seem to single out a guy and won't listen to reason.

    I'm just calling things how I see them in this snapshot of time and when the facts change and new data is presented, I reserve the right to change my stance and will be more than happy to do so and be proven wrong. I'll never hang on to an opinion for the sake of not wanting to admit I'm wrong and make myself look like a fool on here arguing for the sake of arguing nor will I root against our players and hope for them to fail. That said, i will always try to be objective.
     
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  16. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    More than fair and apologies if I came off too hostile.

     
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  17. Verbal Christ

    Verbal Christ Member

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  18. NewAge

    NewAge Member

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    Scoot said he'd played PG in Seattle, so it's not entirely new to him. Question is what is your expectation of PG proficiency:
    Chris Paul? John Stockton? Then, no I don't think he'll get to that level of intricate control of the team on the floor. But he's bigger and more physically gifted than these guys.
    Eric Bledsoe, John Wall? Heck, yeah! He can be better PG than these guys!
     
  19. ashleyem

    ashleyem Member

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    Prime John Wall was a heck of player. I don’t think KPJ is close to that level yet.
     
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  20. NewAge

    NewAge Member

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    No question!
    But the discussion is about point-guard skills, Wall was never on the level of the top floor generals. He would just create so much havoc for the defense and then make the right decision. He led the league in corner 3 assists for few years. I think KPJ has the vision to make the right reads too, the problem is that he is still not the type of "problem" (no pun intended) for the defense that prime Wall was... But as a point-guard who would make the right decision, I think KPJ will match and exceed... But then again, I am just a fan, and that's an opinion, so don't bet your house on it. The future is... uncertain. :)
     
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