What will it take to make you seriously consider an EV?

I was assured in this thread that Tesla is getting their lunch eaten by the Mach-e. A whole 1400 in the month of August! Competition is here! LOL

Anybody with a pair of (unbiased) eyes and half a brain could have seen this coming. Cheap (yet expensive) knock off of the Model Y, the only people that would buy it is out of ignorance.

 

The Model Y is hideous.

Saw a Mach-E for the 1st time 2 weeks ago. Definitely way better looking, but I don't think anybody had the high hopes for it. The Lightning is what people people see as a gamechanger.

Tesla has a big head start when it come to EVs, so it will be hard to catchup. That said I was planning on a Model S (or possibly a 3) in 2023 (son turns 16), but am now planning on the Lightning.

 

It almost feels like the Mach-E was Ford's idea of a rough draft as to what they could do with an all-electric vehicle, and the Lightning is their final draft.

 

Model Y is going to be the best selling EV in the world for many years, especially after Tesla Austin and Berlin factories begin production of the Y in October. Or at least until they go down market again and start making the next $25k model.

Looks are subjective but I much prefer the Y over the Mach-e. Meanwhile I prefer the looks for the Taycan over any of the Teslas. But when you factor in price for range, performance, and features, that’s where there is no longer competition, and what I meant by two (unbiased) eyes and half a brain.

 

You guys are going to be sorely disappointed when Ford is only selling negligible numbers for the Lightning. F150 makes OVER 100% of Ford’s profits, meaning they lose money on everything else. Ford will lose money on any EVs they sell, just like every other carmaker besides Tesla. It took Tesla 10 years, and a scale of nearly 1 million units a year to truly turn a profit on EVs.

This means Ford will never produce an EV F150 that is better in features or price for value than it’s gas version, because that would make people choose the EV version, and Ford gets hit with double whammy of losing out on a highly profitable gas F150 while selling a money losing Lightning. That’s a fast track to the automotive bankruptcy graveyard.

Instead, they are going to sell the Lightning at far higher price than a comparative gas F150, only to virtue signalers that want to show off that they are going electric even if they are paying through their nose. This means they will price it to sell just enough to satisfy emissions mandates and not a single one more. Meanwhile rational consumers and the mass market won’t touch it, and will stick to either a gas car or the only EV on the market that gets you value for price equal or better than a comparative gas vehicle - Tesla.

*bookmark this and come back in 2 years when Lightning is selling 50k units a year and is a novelty compared to the regular F150 (or anything out of Tesla, including the monstrous Cybertruck)

 

Honestly, I don't know why they didn't just make it look like a regular Mustang, which is one of the best looking high production cars out there. It is like they are intentionally sabotaging the thing.

 

What you're ignoring is that CAFE standards require a fleetwide fuel efficiency average that requires all carmakers to produce more efficient vehicles. Currently, fleets have to average 37 MPG. Obviously, Tesla has no issue with this but automakers like Ford that rely on low MPG vehicles like trucks have to offset the relatively low fuel economy of trucks with something. Electric vehicles offer the easiest path to bringing the average up because of the generous MPG calculation that the EPA gives them. It takes fewer EVs to bring up the average than comparable gasoline powered vehicles. Plus, states like California have ZEV mandates that require automakers to produce a minimum number of EVs each year.

This isn't purely about profit and loss of vehicles. All traditional automakers produce money losers to meet CAFE averages and ZEV requirements. Going the EV route at least means you're investing in useful R&D down the road.

 

Car sales have been dipping for a few years now in favor of overpriced tanks and mini-tanks everybody apparently thinks they need. I think Mustang sales have been dropping for about 5 or 6 years. With the crossover design, I'm guessing they thought they'd reach more people? Or maybe they needed to do it for how they designed "the electric". I think they're squeezing about 250-300 miles out of a charge on these, aren't they? Meh.

The Mustang name was probably thrown in for ummm... a namesake. I know Bill Ford supposedly gave his stamp of approval to put the Mustang name on it after driving one, but let's face it... it's also marketing.

 

I’m not ignoring it at all, what you are explaining is exactly why they are producing any EVs at all, like I said, only for satisfying emissions standards and will not produce a single EV more than necessary. I’m not saying they won’t sell any Lightnings, it just won’t be hundreds of thousands a year, or certainly not millions a year (like the gas f150) for it to be a “gamechanger” like some are putting it. If they can sell enough Lightnings to meet CAFE and ZEV requirements, great. If too many are needed, they will buy the emissions credits from Tesla like GM has been. The last thing they will do is allow the Lightning to eat into sales of their cash cow. That’s about survival.

To be a gamechanger, 50k Lightnings a year like how many GM was selling Bolts isn’t going to cut it. Tesla is going to push 1 million units this year, and multiple millions in two years or so which will be bigger than the current BMWs and Daimler/Mercedes. The game has already changed.

 

I am not a tesla hater neither am I a ford fanboy.
I tend to buy german cars.

That said, modey Y is hideous. Thats coming from my unbiased eyes. I also say the same of bmw x6, gle coupe etc...
model 3 and model s are decent looking sedans but model y is no way an attractive looking vehicle.

Mach-e is not thaaat much better but I honestly prefer the style of that than the Y.

and cheap expensive knock off?....let's not go there. not like tesla is known for their quality build here..

 

Agree calling it a mustang was ridiculous.

 

That hideous Y is the best selling EV worldwide, and once Austin ramps it will be one of the top selling cars in the US, EV, gas or otherwise. So obviously your opinion is held by the minority. But again, when I say unbiased eyes I didn’t even mean aesthetics, I meant price for value, performance, features, the whole package. Which the market has clearly decided on already loud and clear. Why are we even comparing a car that sells 1400 units a month to it? It’s laughable.

 

I generally like the way Tesla cars look and different things about them etc. The Model Y indeed is hideous someone would have to give me one for free to be my car.

 

I really don't care for how many they are selling.
I am simply saying that thing is hideous. I am not here to argue sales and whether it's the best EV ever. Aesthetics wise it's a hideous car.

And that's like my opinion man.

 

And that’s totally cool, man. I guess there are a lot of people that are blind then. Or you hold an unique opinion.

 

It really is an ugly car. I have actually thought about it several times seeing them in person. It obviously has other things going for it. Namely acceleration and a lot of room. A really cool looking roof/ceiling among other things. The actual exterior lines of the car are not appealing in the least to me though.

 

An opinion so unique nearly everyone on here agrees.

The Toyota Prius was the top selling hybrid, and it was also ugly.

 

The tech and performance I would argue is the best features, also range for price if you are into EVs, although range for price is not competitive with gas.

To me the Y just looks like a bulkier 3. The facia looks identical to the 3 and the body lines are just your standard cuv with some added aerodynamics.

Although if you guys are right (as much as opinions can be right or wrong) I wonder what was the last highest selling “ugly” car. Beetle?

 

There’s like 2 people here on a basketball message board that agrees. There’s hundreds of thousands of buyers who don’t.

Prius topped out at 200k units a year, a decent amount I guess. It was the first car for virtue signaling tree huggers. The model Y once Shanghai, Berlin and Austin are all ramped up will be selling over 1m units a year and be a truly mass market phenomenon, gas, hybrid, ev or otherwise.

 

Also bear in mind, we are in a thread named “What will it take to make you seriously consider an EV?”

So the people on the fence or are ambivalent don’t like the way the model Y looks. Since anyone who already considered an EV likely already bought a Y lol. This is called selection bias, the people left all think the Y is ugly.