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Bipartisan Corporate Welfare

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by DonatelloLimestone, Aug 28, 2021.

  1. DonatelloLimestone

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    Every election we see the same chumps promising to fight for us[​IMG]

    Ted cruz literally came out, ironically in principle, that he no longer will turn the other way when he lets his corporate donors take advantage of tax holes and lobbying for their rights

    Amazon has a great relationship with dems, everyone will say the company line so they can stay in power from the guys who really put them in power, not the votes...we have less than half the population in america even voting, so they know itts about who has the power of infrastructure to get the attention and retain power

    They both pander towards big companies and like the financial bills or dodd frank act, or oil spills, when companies do raelly massively F up they allow them to work with amendments and bills that are slap on the wrist but often put the onus on consumers.

    This is not just amazon, forget the esource from tucker he spews some stupid **** too obviously, its wal mart, etc

    they are privatizing profits, socializing cost we are not just paying for the employees they wont' pay enough while they take insnae margins, we pay for their food stamps, housiong and they are trying to do right and work full time while bezos builds rocket ships and the walton family does whatever they do funding political movements or what really wealthy do....

    and you know how they punt this in public discourse and divide and conquer us? they make it about we need to take all their money away in an extreme way, or that we should have a free market earned without any checks...rather than just pay their ****ing taxes at first and take responsiblity for the wages when they reach that billionaire treshold and have a lot of room...its almost as if Bezos was worth 100 billion rather than 66 billoin and that 66 billion could make it so that his massive employees aren't on our taxpayers dimes.



    CAn these two people on different ends of the spectrum both be right?
    The clintons literally answering american foreign policy to one man, haim saban rich
    the SEcretary of education donation rich level like Betsy Devos
     
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  2. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    Warren wrote a book on the subject. But only Bernie is talking about it.
     
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  3. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

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    Dump your paycheck into stocks, live off spouses income plus company perks, and sell on insider info.

    Yeah, no way that's getting reformed.

    People waiting for mudfight between AOC vs. MTG on PPV.

    Priorities!!!
     
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  4. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    LOL wtf are you talking about. Biden has put Warrens entire anti trust staff in his administration. Biden has put the most progressive anti monopoly as head of the FTC (LIna Khan). This is probably the most aggressive regulator that we've had in literally 100 years. Shes authored many of the argurments that Bernie and others use in their argurments against corporate consolidation. Biden also put Johnthan kanter as head of anti trust at the DOJ. Kanter is the most progressive anti trust lawyer in the industry today and his arguments against google are widely used today when they sue big tech.



    Khan already has moved to ban non compete clauses and is pushing right to repair so that individuals can repair their own things. Biden is the most anti corporate president we've had in 50 years. Biden gets no credit and most people have no idea that hes pushing an anti corproate platform. Americans dont care about Anti trust even thought its one of the most important things that influences every fiber of our life.

    Read the compliant that FTC filed against facebook. We've never had a regulator call out a big corporation like the ftc did this week. "“Facebook lacked the business acumen and technical talent to survive the transition to mobile. After failing to compete with new innovators, Facebook illegally bought or buried them when their popularity became an existential threat.”

    https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/pre...ook-resorted-illegal-buy-or-bury-scheme-crush
     
  5. DonatelloLimestone

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    I liked a lot of WArren, shes just a terrible politician. She has been so aligned with bernies views...I didn't care that she ied about the native american thing, I didn't care she started as a republican, she seemed to really want to protect the consumer and has done so well

    If you paid attention to the primaries when she turned on bernie and basically painted him as chauvenistic. and saying women can't win when he has a history of fighting for that kind of thing. THe proof is in the details, her campaign wasdone before super tuesday as in she ran out of money and had to drop out, but that would consolidate all the votes for bernie since they have similar audiences. But she got an infuesion of 9-14 million dollars from one person, a lady in california whose other major donation was to Sheriff Joe(guy who trump pardoned) That happened in the last minute and she stayed on....All the others Pete and so on all moved out, making the way for biden to over take it despite his disasterous tdebate performances and low energy the whole time...coincidentally they all got some power and positions afterwards...and thats politics...party over principle.

    So regardless of acceptingthat, shes made really strong poitns

    but the Dodd Frank Act was a sham. It was meant to punish those ass holes who played with leverage for the entire community...you steal some **** if you are poor from target, if its enough, you will goto jail. If you disrupt our economy entirely and lose billions to trillions, you get to work with government to make regulation and amendments to make it look like you're punished, but get a slap of the wrist of just paying less then a year maybe a few months of profits in a number that 'sounds good'. No one arrested except one middle man, and that was under obamas bail out(obama also had a deal to publicly finance the election with john mccain, backed out bc he saw he could raise more)-is that his fault? no, just saying almost none of them will stand for principles and point to the otherside and the 'team' will just back him, none of them are bold enough for that change...so while I think bidens execution was terrible and beyond, i give him also credit for non passing the buck for this war. ITs a sunk cost, always has been as 3 presidents lied about it.

    but still the most important part of dodd frank was that it was regulated with bank industry insiders and what happens is the onus now is on the consumer. They made it more restrictive for banks to take risk and now access to capital is to more of those who already have collateral, the rich get access to more capital and more risk while poor people are almost hsut up in tryign to assume some risk, and social mobility is that much more unattainable...

    And we havent even gotten started on the new housing crisis...America will be a renters market by the next decade and how ownership/which is generational wealth is less accessible than ever with corporations and hedge buying up houses without even considering hte market
     
  6. DonatelloLimestone

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    biden has done better. hes done a lot of typical and his history is that one of one I'd NEVER hire someone as an executive with his history of executive decision making, but hes here now, dude i still putting people in his staff firing for mar1juana on something that his own president obaama or kamala or clinton wouldn't pass the test. but heres hoping hes here to influence

    but judging by his chief of staff, his dying on the hill for neera tanden...theres still a lot of bullshit? progress sure though and well take it, but we still deserve better after the **** shows we dealt with. Upward and onward, thats democracy
    https://thehill.com/hilltv/rising/5...white-house-using-identity-politics-to-defend
     
  7. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    Uhh he fired someone for smoking Marjiuana because weed is still a illegal drug at the federal level. Sorry that we have a president that actually respects the law and follows it. Have you seen the outcry the business community has towards lina khan? Google wall street journal lina khan. They are obsessed with her and talk about her non stop. We have never had regulators who are actually going after corporate concentration. Obama was the biggest failure of all of them and allowed facebook to acquire too much of its competetion. Obama wanted to be "liked" by big tech and wanted the ability to access VC money once he left the office. Kamala is the same way as she got more wall street money then any other candidate.

    One thing that people dont realize is that Biden keeps people close to him whom he can trust. He doesnt give a **** about their past history or where they worked at but he wants people whom he can trust which i respect him. The WH has had no leaks and they have a circle of trust. Bidens closest ally Steve Rochetti brother got hired by Amazon as a lobbist for millions yet biden hired the most anti tech regulator in the world.

    If people truly study what the FTC is doing right now its quite remarkable. Anti trust is something I follow along very closely and ive been more hopeful in my life. Lina has already cleaned house at the FTC and is hiring tons more young lawyers who have the same vision as her. Dont forget that Biden is the one who brought together all g20 nations for a global minimum tax which is ground breaking.

    Theres never been a more anti trust/anti business administration in the past 80 years.
     
  8. Xerobull

    Xerobull You son of a b!tch! I'm in!

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    Starting your argument with anything from the GOP demagogue Tucker Carlson instantly hurts your argument's credibility. You could be saying water is wet but if you have a quote from people like that, I'm inclined to think, 'yeah, but why is that guy talking about it? what's the angle or con here?'
     
  9. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    I don't buy "respecting the law" narrative.

    Presidents use executive powers to enforce some laws and not enforce others. This is very common. Do you think cops pull over every individual going 5 over?

    You should be proud of presidents "respecting the law" when it comes to corruption and conflict of interest like respecting the emoluments clause not firing people for smoking some reefer. This is a rather trivial reason to be proud of a president "respecting the law". This isn't the type of "respecting the law" that mitigates corruption.

    By your logic you would be proud of Biden if he went hard on mar1juana dispensaries in states where it is legal at the state level because federal law trumps state law and therefore Biden would be "respecting the law" by putting people back in prison for mar1juana offenses.
     
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  10. Buck Turgidson

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    You say that like I shouldn't have done those things?
     
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  11. Phillyrocket

    Phillyrocket Member

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    Republicans have for decades kept the poor and uneducated as their base by being the party of pro religion, pro 2nd amendment, anti immigrant, pro life, and lambasting higher education as liberal brainwashing. Basically telling the lazy and unambitious that their lack of prosperity isn’t their fault it’s those damn liberals with their open borders and job killing regulation. If all the Liberals were gone coal jobs would fall from the heavens don’t you know?

    All the while time and time again pushing tax cuts for the rich, deregulating everywhere they can, reducing any oversight possible, and on and on pushing laws that hurt that same poor base.

    Now the pretzel logic is just amazing. On one hand the Republicans are the pro business party and Libs like AOC are disasters for not wanting Amazon in their district. Or Tesla moving from CA to TX is a see I told ya those high taxes would drive them away! But the Conservatives have to be careful because they must also hate big tech because of their stance against hate er Right Wing speech.

    It’s just hypocrisy over and over but their base is too damn dumb to realize it.
     
  12. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    okay dude who gives a **** about his mar1juana stance. The fact that he has the entire business community up in arms is something remarkable. Lina khan is the most progressive regulator we've had in literally since FDR's time. This isnt a hyperbole and id love for you to show me someone whos more anti business then her. She just started public meetings at the FTC for the first time in its history and its allowing every day Americans to chime in on how anti trust is effecting them. Its truly remarkable to watch. I was watching the last meeting and we had auto mechanics talk about how repair shops would make them sign anti compete clauses and then give them shitty wages without raises. There was a pharmacist who called in about how PBMs are squeezingg independent pharmacies.

    We are living through some ground breaking times right now nd its sad most americans arent realizing the big fundamental shift thats happening right now in regulation.
     
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  13. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    I agree that Biden has been far more aggressive than his predessors even Obama in fighting against large businesses.

    I do wonder when they are going to actually push a new tax bill. We need to restructure capital gains taxes where someone who made 50 million in capital gains for the year has the same tax rate as household making 50 grand in income that same year.
     
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  14. DonatelloLimestone

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    I hear ya, i say ignore the source.
    I also had AOC there

    I've definitely seen how slimy Tucker can be, and some cases he makes are right. My point this whole total polrazied sides thing is a big problem. Frankly there are rural places where gun laws and access shoudl be different than in cities, and of course all around a proper ID situation or maybe even training, why is not getting done? bc we have politicians pandering to the polarized sides knowing they wont evne try to find effective middle ground, get it done, and then move the goal post further on. Thats why you have such a low congress/senate approval across the specturm, yet some how htey all stay unchallenged.

    Honestly, I've voted for both parties, independents and now the climate has me do away with this right left bullshit that has only helped the news and the incumbants who stay on for decades and feed themselves before people. I'm an American. The issues are complex, they vary from the locations, and the world isn't black and white outside of 'that world, its often grey.

    So yea, I hope we can look at ideas bc the problems are all over rather than people. frankly its a porblem on both sides, someone mentioned biden has done stuff good, he has been progressive than he ever has but it also doesnt change to keep in context of his previous votes that led to trillions of dollars nad millions of lives. I don't worship any politican, frankly they all have a team of staff who do the policy and they take the credit, we just have to keep treating them like representatives who need to do a job. The blindly taking a side angle helped trump as much as anyone and I hope thats a part of the culture that this next connected generation can water down a bit.

    So yea listen to the ideas, all the poeple have flaws, and they also have other bad ideas, but just the merit soley on the ideas...otherwise no one would realize that tucker and aoc agree on this. Lets move those small things we all agree on and then get that part done fast for our countrys sake and then worry abotu the details and isolate these amenmdents the way they package these things up makes everything controverssial. Sadly they say this is how "dc works" but by getting an assclown like trump, or a crazy like bernie both surpassing any expectations...people realize the way dc works doesnt work for them, tis worked great for politicians, news, lobbyist, arms dealers or that sort....
    and hero worship only contributes to that
     
  15. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    Obama never fought big business neither did he even mention the term union. Obama was literally the biggest con of my lifetime because people still worship him as some progressive hack. He bent over backwards for the repubicans and he never stood up to any sort of establishment. You think Obama would have the balls to withdraw from Afghanistan knowing this was the outcome? Of course he was too busy trying to add followers to his instagram and twitter. The nobel peace prize he won was the biggest joke of my lifetime and he didnt deserve a single piece of that. Bombing Libya, syria and Pakistan doesnt deserve a nobel peace prize. Its a fkin joke and Obama forgot what his values once he got into office.

    In my lifetime (im not too young) this is the first time im proud to be called a democrat. Im anti corporation/anti war and every president of my lifetime have been corporate sellouts. Obama/Clinton were complete cons and Clinton started the destruction of our democracy by eroding our institutions. The job of our institutions and government is not to cozy up to big business but rather look out for the everday Joe. Biden literally gave the middle finger to the media, military establishment , and big business. I honestly wish Biden was 15 years younger and i think he would be a top 5 presidents.

    The new tax laws are going to be in the reconciliation bill that dems are pushing in congress. FIrst time taxes will be raised since early 1990s
     
  16. DonatelloLimestone

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    This is the proble, people say "who gives a care about weed" You know its just stoners right?
    No, this is an ECONOMIC policy matter

    Do you know how much we spend to enforce that even in a dedicated DEA enforcing it? hundreds of millions of dollars that could be in our communities

    Then the private prisons profit(even they get subsidies) at a cost to tax payers for 30-80,000 PER prisoner depending on the state and this is for non violent offenders who aren't doing anything worse than having some beer... Hell biden was a champion for them in the 90s, it was bipartisan before you get sensitive about biden...all these hacks need to go, can you imagine hiring an executive whose decision making so far from wars to economic cost cost us trillions in money nad millions in lives? Like I don't give a damn about any of em, if you guys hero worship them put them in a cabinet to us their 'experience' and they live kushy lives, but don't give em final executive power if their history is that wrong. This isn't abotu them, its bigger then them

    Also, so now someone is losing a father, mother, brother, son...you are uprooting the trajectory of their community or circle, you are halting so many propsects for them to tax paying contributing members of society and on the other hand we take that opprtuniy cost and combine it with us tax payers paying somethign that often goges to private prisons,

    -which biden championed until now he doesnt...progress?why bc of pressure and its ok that he got it wrong, but public pressure in a democracy matters. Imagine if we did that for wars and the like, so yea its improtant to not hold any office accountable, but every single public servant who is entrusted with the powers and privelges of american resources...this isn't about them or their bust/legacies, thats like the history book washed tv version...these people don't even write their own policies they have teams and lobbyist join in, it sure would be nice to make sure americans are in the table, not just in the context of PR.

    Then you think of Gangs and crimes, not only would we have more resources to attend to actual violent crime, the community relations with police would be better to stop giving the incentives to do stupid **** like bothering someone walking with weed. Furthermore we cut off the significant legs of gangs since their main income is drugs..

    then this isn't even legalization, this is just what he has the power to do, whcih obama didnt do, trump didnt do, but to decriminalize. to this day there are so many peaceful people rotting in jail away from their families because of this archaic mentality and arm chair pundits say "we TaklKinG abOut WeEd" Furthermore, in legalization we get hundreds of millions of tax dollars....back to the community rather than back to gangs. We also cut off a LOT of smuggling bc the soruce is here and available

    So yea...this is econoimcs nad resources...this isn't weed and its rich coming from a guy who askes for compassion for his drug addict son while continuign to house people who have done less than him but can't afford the privelges. And itwas immoral and unethical for evry president, including obama who chose his legacy, and i like him, but he was able to write and brag about how much he enjoyed weed, frankly him, clinton, bush all have admitted it, yet they were somehow able to "skirt hte law" and enjoy the potential and do great things in society, yet won't afford that to others. This isn't a minor problem, majority of our jails which are theaviest incarceration rate in the world, is for non violent drug offenders.

    Stop trying to root for a personality or hero, think of the content. This isn't a biden hate message before you go bring up trump ,he failed on this massively too for a guy who talks about free market, this is a failure across the spectrum of people passing the buck on. just like the war, obama passed the buck, bush started the bullshit(but don't forget before 9/11 clinton and biden were calling for iraq war and aggression), Trump passed the buck made the dumbest plan ever not just negotiating with taliban, but giving them thousands of violent prisonser who hate america back, and then biden kept the dudmb plan and executed terribly...how about we call em all out and think of our country? And they don't define our country, their public servants...but now more than ever our public servants are out of touch, riding in private jets, wildly millionaires that they presided over rules that have seen income inequality and social mobility drop under their watch,but their still benefiting...go figure

    We deserve better then this right left bullshit[​IMG]
     
  17. DonatelloLimestone

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    lol they are the ones who made laws

    imagine these dudes talking abot respect the law whn tose laws literally hurt women, etc. ITs democracy, that means its a moveable force by the times...respect the law so gays shouldn't have been married

    respect the law during prohibition bc the govertnment said so even though it is literally virtually ****ing stupid?

    No, how baout our public servants go there and represent and do their job and change and upright the laws...just an embarassment

    and as far as respecting the law, then you do realize Obama and Kamala Harris wouldn't have qulaified for jobs under biden's enforcement, but somehow I suspect he ain't gonna apply it to certain individuals

    @astros123
    just like her rightfully said his adminstration will have a better relationship with the press than trump
    -we agree, thats needed
    then he goes to stan for a coprorate shill like Neera tanden saying shes a brown woman who was on food stamps yet her think tank and position has been to cut entitlements, let alone more and more wars. She wouldn't even get confirmed nad let me guess you think its bc of mean tweets and a division between men/women...how baout the guy who said hell have a better relationshiwith the press got himself another Corey L of trump who pushed a journalist away except neera tanden shoved/slugged/punched a journalist for asking hilary a question of war(you're anti war right) and just for that she slugged physically...don't worry she defended herself by saying i didn't slug him, i pushed him) Lol so yea he is going to bat for her, his chief of staff is, and no despite the deomcratic process of being confirmed, he still pushed her throughhttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/05/neera-tanden-bullying-joe-biden-cabinet

    You make good poitns abotu regulation changes and like i said, its not that these are fox/cnn caricatures of all good or bad, he can do good, but tahts democracy we have to keep the pressure on and not make excuses like it jusT weEd.

    And the whole theres never been a more progressive president in 80 years is just a tired arugemnt, its like trumps fans saying hes the most progressive republican ever bc he had a good jail reform and supports gay marriage...the times are different, its just party shilling at this point
     
  18. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    This is the issue with people like you. Politics isnt a zero sum game. Just because you dont get some things means you abondon everything that the current person is doing. Its why i hate people like Bernie sanders who have accomplished NOTHING in senate for 50 years but proudly go around and yell their values to others instead of working across the asile to get **** done.

    Yes biden needs to work on non violent offenders and our drug laws but hes literally been in office for 6 months. Your argurment is fkin dumb no offense. There has never been a more pro union anti corporate anti military president of our lifetime. This is just a fact. No **** theres alot more he can do and that will always be the case but that doesnt mean you dont apprechiate what hes doing and help explain to others what hes doing.

    Funny how you post gifs of Obama when he was literally the biggest disaster con man of my lifetime. I cant even take you serious
     
  19. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    Once again you're literally talking out of your ass again. The biggest thing for Biden is his trust level with his nominees and appointees. He wants to have a air tight circle around him and he doesnt care or judge their past experience. HIs closest advisors all have siblings who are lobbyist yet Biden makes his own decisions regardless of their employment or sway. You talk about Neera tandem entitlement cuts but biden passed the largest food stamp expansion of my lifetime this year while also pushing for free children lunches (its already free for the next calender year) .

    Point is Biden makes his own decisions regardless of the of the candidates prior history or lobbying. For him its all about trust. Genz folks wont understand how important trust is to some people
     
  20. DonatelloLimestone

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    I posted that gif messing with you bc i read your post

    and how is it a zero sum game? I just gave biden great credit for regulatory matters as you mentioned, heck even close private prisoned he championed...change is possible, pressure is important. So just like the war, i give him MAJOR credit for not passing the buck, but he also did terrible in execution, both can be true unless ironically its a zero sum game to you and cnn/fox where i can't say the issues bc to you hes just great and i can't call out the bullshit. For me I can call out the bullshit, give repsect where respect is due, and it doesn't bother me.. a part of the culture where they cant handle criticism along with praise to me is a big issue.

    bernie has a place, but I Agree. You do raelize even biden is not making policy, he has a team to do it and oversees it while reading the country adn giving the final answer. Bernies been a voice for great things, he has 0 tanginble practical plans and for that i would never vote for him to be president, but you must be out of your mind to nto see that bernie has moved the entire party left in hilary and biden. His impact biden will admit himself, and politically that is important. Thats the issue with hilary's whole bernies not truly "Dnc" htey put party over principle, bc if you look at his voting rights hes more aligned with the working class than DNC ever was s by your own statement which biden has been prominent in for over 30 years? Why did he change, the country and pressure changed...so why not continue you that rather than making it a 0 sum game and not accepting my legitmate criticisms bc you like something else he does? So yea that is also stifling of progress as much as you cry abot people not seeing the good hes doing, is people demanding not to express what hes missing and its the same bullshit trump did, crying for good and focus only on the good and making excuses when they don't do it

    they are both living free in the most luxurious of ways...presidents are not a sacrifice, it is a privelge bro. defend the people, always. understand the nuances and details of politics and the timing of it, but keep pressure on otherwise we've seen the same dude supprot absolte Disaster so to pretend his final say is infallible is just dumb IMO
     

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