Because Green has never worked hard on his defense. And it is not only about effort, BBIQ and wingspan are important as well. Green, like Lavine, just doesn't see the defense like they do offense. And Lavine tries his ass off on D but he is limited by short wingspan and expanding all energy on O. MJ and Kobe are legends because they were elite 2 way players.
You act like I'm saying Mobley isn't a top 5 pick. Mobley simply doesn't have Giannis body/frame so it was a weird comparison. Mobley has both a high center of gravity and moves fluidly but gives up positioning and strength. It's an odd combination for a supposed can't miss defensive anchor.
I don't know how you quantify "hard" , but his coach Brian Shaw spoke favorably of his effort when he didn't have to. Green was never held accountable on defense in high school and it shows. There's no reason he can't play passable defense if he puts in the effort, I'm not sure if Green is lacking in the "effort department". I wouldn't call Kobe elite but he gave a lot of effort when it mattered and he didn't have a great wingspan or great measurables. But it's not like Kobe was some defensive stopper out of high school, he got there later.
Brian Shaw held him accountable for 15 games. Who on the Rockets will maximize Green on defense? Silas and his staff are all offense first coaches. Further I do not see Silas holding any player accountable, especially his stars/high draft picks. Kobe was not the elite defender that MJ was but he gave effort on D from day one.
Did you see Giannis as a rookie? He was skinnier than Mobley so body frame can be build as the player gets older and adds more muscle. I feel he is a bit more buffed than Wood. If Mobley buffs up he will be fine. He doesn’t need to add a ton but he will need it in the NBA. I just feel we need more of a center than a guard. To anchor the Rockets defense and rebounds. How many years are we going to be undersized and get beaten on the boards. I like Mobley but like I’ve said either one of Green or Mobley will be great.
You can literally see defensive improvement from Green from the first game to the later games. Why are you making stuff up? I mean, happy to say I'm wrong if you show me the part where he or someone else talked about him not working on his defense, but you can see the improvements, and others have said he has, and he has said he has. Not great at defense - absolutely.
I do, and while he was an all-star that Houston very much wanted, in terms of his impact he was most similar to LMA or OT - great players but not superstars.
… the Rockets defensive coordinator is offense first too?!?!!? Silas doesn’t hold players accountable….KPJ just did everything he wanted? Rockets didn’t put a little extra effort into KPJ mental health but they won’t hold Green accountable? I don’t believe that reasoning for a second. We aren’t at Day 1 and you already assume Green won’t try? I think you are a bit too biased with your assumptions.
Mobley and Green are both worthy of being chosen 2nd. While I would select Mobley and I think he is the better choice, I am beginning to think that Rockets are going to choose Green. I think the players are close enough and I suspect that the star power is going to give the edge to Green. One of the things that sort of bothers me is that so many people are pointing at the G league stats as evidence of Green's scoring potential. I get that he was a dominant scorer in high school and aau and that what he showed in the g league was some confirmation that he can be that as a pro too. But it was just 16 games. Out of curiosity I looked at the Kenyon Martin Jr's stats the last 16 games in the NBA for comparison below: Green's G league stats (15 regular season games and one playoff): .469 fg% - .358 3pt% - 18.69 ppg - 4.19 rebs - 3.06 assists Martin's NBA stats (final 16 games of the '20/'21 season): .500 fg% - .365 3pt% - 14 ppg - 6.5 rebs - 1.75 assists I will concede that these stats do not tell the whole story. For one thing, Green was the focal point of Ignite's offense and the defense was geared up to stop him. Also, Martin was a year older than Green and had a little experience in the gleague and in mop up duty with the Rockets before the g league. But Martin was doing this is in the actual NBA. And nobody seriously thinks Martin is anything more than a rotation player. Meanwhile, Green is anointed the next Kobe/MJ (or at least that archetype). As I said, I think the potential of Green merits his selection at #2. But for a guy who is all offense at this point I wonder if we shouldnt be looking at the objective evidence of his offense a little more closely. It is just accepted that he is a generational scorer. While he might be, a comparison to our own KJM does give me pause. To be fair, you can do this same exercise with Mobley (and there are many examples of it on this board). *Edit: here are KPJs numbers too KPJ G league stats: .448 fg% - .321 3pt% - 24.1 ppg - 6.5 rebs - 7.2 assists KPJ NBA state: .425 fg% - .311 3pt% - 16.6 ppg - 3.8 rebs - 6.3 assists
It’s one thing to disagree but it’s another to make up a narrative about him not even trying or working on it….
A lot of players are super skinny but that doesn’t mean they will put on muscle similarly. Giannis is like a 21st century Shaq with his strength. I don’t think Mobley is going to end up like that, especially his lower half.
I think you tried here, but just throwing stats up without actually watching and analyzing how points are scored and the skillsets involved isn't worthwhile in any way.
I conceded as much that this isnt necessarily apples to apples for that very reason but I think it does raise a valid point of how certain is it that Green is a generational scorer. If there is reason to doubt that then I think the entire narrative unravels. Since I think the Rockets are going to pick him, I want to feel like he is all that is advertised. This gives his supporters the chance to provide their analysis of how he scores and his skillset.
Perhaps a better comparison in Anthony Edwards would be enlightening. Edwards is 6 months older than Green and had a year of college under his belt but in the NBA, as a shooting guard on a team where he was a focal point of their offense. So I think he is a decent comp. Again, here are his rookie season numbers from the NBA vs Green's G league numbers: Green's G league stats: .469 fg% - .358 3pt% - 18.69 ppg - 4.19 rebs - 3.06 assists Edwards' Rookie year: .417 fg% - .329 3pt% - 19.3 ppg - 4.7 rebs - 2.7 assists Again, perhaps not Apples to Apples but certainly a closer comp than Martin, right? Look, Anthony Edwards is a good player. He was the #1 overall pick. But he wasnt even rookie of the year in his own draft and is not projected to be some generational talent. And, with a mere 6 months advantage in age he is putting up better numbers (though not as efficient) in the NBA. I just question the idea that Green is the maestro of offense when the numbers simply dont show it. He is an excellent offensive player but he is not obviously better than Edwards (who is undoubtedly a part of his generation). I hate to nitpick but it seems like all of the nitpicking has gone one way for the past week or two...
I'm curious, how many people think Mobley would exceed Wood in the first year? . Wood shoots the three ball well, dunks a lot, seems to have better handles - it's hard to see Mobley exceeding Wood on offense, but obviously on D Wood has a lot to work on. But they are both skinny, and seem better suited to be pf's vs true centers (if such a thing even exists anymore). To me, Wood is redundant to Mobley. The Rockets have good reserve type players at every position with KPJ and Wood being legit starters. Tate should be a reserve. Brown is a reserve. KMJ looks like he is trending into a Shawn Marion type starter at sf. A few promising guards in Augustin/Thomas/Brooks. House is probably a reserve. Kelly O is fine but given his age and poor perimeter defense, you have to figure he isn't going to be here for very long. So yeah, you could take Mobley, move Kelly O or sign him as a reserve, and you have a nice front court of Wood, Mobley, and Kelly who can all shoot the 3 and aren't horrible at defense with young athletic guards who can all bomb - that's not a bad way to go. But the pairing of KPJ with a Green or Cade just seems too tantalizing to pass up. Quality bigs are rare to find in the NBA, and if you look at the last champions you get a list of bigs including Davis, Ayton (if suns win), Ibaka, and essentially no center with GS. I think it's crazy to think Mobley is the next AD, and I think you can make the case that with Wood, you are at parity with the other guys. This is a league driven by wings and guards. The championship teams are driven by them. Only reason the Bucks are in the finals is because the Durant/Irving/Harden pairing was injured significantly. Paul/Booker, Leonard/George, Curry/Thompson. Those 4 teams and the Lakers who have perhaps the best big man in the game in Davis with a legendary player in Lebron, plus rising stars Kuzma, Schroder, and Pope. Taking all that into consideration, it just seems that Green or Cade make more sense than Mobley. You don't need a big as a foundational piece unless you think you are getting a Davis, Hakeem, or similar. And I don't think Mobley is that type of guy. So why pick him over Green or Cade who have that kind of upside?
I would really put a lot of weight on the Evan Mobley interview, as well as what coaches are saying about him at USC. At #2, I want a guy that lives in the gym. Is he that guy? Is he working in the facilities the day after a playoff elimination loss ala Tim Duncan? How much does he love the game? I could be convinced If I found out that he loves this game dirty. (Fantasy land) I'd love to send a stack of future picks to CLE for the 3rd pick, and call this rebuild complete with 1. KPJ 2. JG 3. JT/KJM 4. Mobley 5. Wood Going forward.
I like Anthony Edwards, I think Jalen Green is a much more intriguing prospect as a playmaker for his teammates, as well as his willingness to improve defensively.
