Top 4 current Rocket players via draft which is more dynamic? Mobley Woods KPJ Wall OR Woods KPJ Green Wall
True but I've seen enough of the NBA to know how hard it is to find a cerebral guy like that. Athletes come and go like the tide. The road to NBA purgatory was paved with elite athletes. I'm not sure what Jalen Green brings. I know what Mobely does but we already have Wood. Feel like Suggs would round out the core nicely.
Thanks for the info @roslolian ! Big men are so hard to evaluate, since the modern game is more titled against them. Covering high screen and roll above the 3 point line and switches onto guards were things Shaq, Hakeem, Yao etc didn't have to contend with. Ayton was evaluated as having weak defense coming out of the draft, towns excellent defense. A few years into their careers, the evaluation is the complete opposite. Wiseman looked like a world beater the first few weeks, but the complications of the Kerr's offense and the modern game made him a negative on the floor. Watching mobleys highlights reminds me of a lighter quicker Wiseman but without the quite the explosion. If he does have good/great bball iq and switchabilty, then I would select him over Green. I watched several of Green's G-league games and he didn't stand out much at all. Small sample size however so w/e. No oinions yet about Suggs since I havent even watched highlghts of him yet lol.
The reel for Suggs doesn't tend to show his TOs or missed shots. Legit question over whether he can shoot or jump off 1 foot to elevate and finish. Cade is the only certainty- but even Wiggins was a certainty (riggin for Wiggins) - it doesn't always work out!!
I think Mobley's ceiling is as a #2 guy on a championship team. his floor is a #4 guy, defensive big with a decent shot. He's never going to be the guy you give the ball to in isolation all 4th quarter of a game 7. You're never going to him for the last shot. same can be said about Giannis, so I'm not taking anything away from mobley here but he's not a #1 scorer. the question is if he can be a scorer at all. is he more capela or more bosh? Green's ceiling is a #1 guy, but his floor is a #6 - 6th man type. if he's just a scorer, he's the next Jordan Clarkson. can he be a playmaker with scoring and athleticism like lavine? can he score, assist and defend like beal? can do all of that, raise his FT attempt rate, and gain strength to guard up a position or two like harden? he's shown flashes of it all. that's a lot of potential and also a lot of questions to be answered. a lot comes down to his drive to be great and his willingness to be coached. by all accounts he's got that. Suggs' ceiling is #3 guy potential, his floor is #4 guy potential. somewhere between prime George Hill and Jrue Holiday. I don't see the Jason Kidd or Kyle Lowry comps as he's not a big assists guy. You know you're getting a lead guard, smart, can handle the ball well enough and defend either guard spot. he's a starting PG at worst. If he improves his shot he's a borderline all star / all star, #3 guy on a championship team, sort of like Holiday or Conley. I have no issues drafting Mobley knowing full well he'll never be the #1 guy on a championship team. If I believe Green and Suggs lean more towards Clarkson and George Hill, I'd rather draft Capela with a jumpshot. If its a tossup, I'd understand if Stone played it safe with Suggs to avoid a bust, or swung for the fence with Green. I hear the arguments that its a guards league and green can be the #1 option, but I also hear the counterpoints that you can find scoring guards in the lotto every year (and we'll be back next year and the year after!) but the rarer commodity is the shot blocking big who can defend 1-5. I'm really not sure! It depends on what the pro scouts see (they know more than us) and depends on how these kids interview.
Reading this post .... Seems to me that we evaluate him pretty much identically - Right Now. Where we seem to differ is that you buy into him becoming something more dynamic offensively .... where I don't buy that so much.
I envy the Pistons not just for getting the #1 pick, but for the unity their fans must feel: "Cade?" "Oh yeah. Cade." "Definitely Cade." And with the #2 pick our board: "We need a dynamic guard. Big men like AD and Embiid haven't done crap!" "We need a big man. Guards like Lavine and Booker haven't had any success!" "Die!!"
Just started really digging into this last night. Mobley stands out to me. The reads he was making off the pick and roll look like he could be the type of big to actually make another big like woods look even better. Not crazy quick or explosive but controlled drives for a guy his size are rarified air. Green looks electric, but I don't see playmaker so he could be a young Eric Gordon or something. Suggs could have some Brandon Roy to him so passing on that is tough. But Mobley just does certain things that I don't often see from guys his size and age. His lack of weight could be his undoing but he looks like he will do whatever it takes to help his team.
Yeah. I also value bigs that can defend perimeter extremely highly. You can get traditional bigs that are liabs on the perimeter (aka Gobert) outside top 10. You can also find pogo stick prospects that could defend the perimeter outside the top 10 but they have super high bust risk. Its hard to get a pogo stick prospect with range that also doesnt have super high bust risk like Mobley thats why I value him highly. OTH while Green is an offensive talent there's lots of 6'5/6'4 scoring prospects in the draft I mean most mocks have us getting Tre Mann, Joel Ayayi or Cam Thomas with 23/24 and those guys are basically lesser clones or variations of Green. There's 2 prospects next year who are better than Mobley but its hard to aay we'll get top 2 again. Just from rarity persp I tbink its hard to pass on Mobley.
I think Mobley's defensive ability makes him a relatively safe pick, because every team could use a versatile rim protector regardless of what his offense is. At worst he can do is catch lobs and put backs and shoot the occasional 3. Although I personally think the odds of Mobley improving his offense for him to be a first or second option on offense in the modern NBA is lower compared to a guard turning into a high impact player. Bigs these days simply don't get enough touches or chances to create their own shot, unless you are already head and shoulders above the rest skill wise, aka Embiid and Jokic. Obviously there's a chance that Green just becomes another Wiggins or the other dime a dozen athletic guards that don't do much, but at least he will have a chance to have the ball in his hands from day 1 to prove what he can do.
My current rankings: 2a. Suggs 2b. Green 4. Mobley The second most important trait of a prospect, besides measurables / athleticism, is work ethic. This is an extremely underrated idea. All these prospects we are looking at are nowhere near who their final forms will be. I think people are far underestimating the ceiling of Suggs, because I can guarantee you that if the current prospect rankings hold into the draft, we will see Suggs turn into a perennial all-star for Toronto. You are virtually guaranteed with Suggs that, whatever potential he has, he is going to work his ass off and be that first-in-the-gym guy to push himself to realize that potential. The only arguments I can see to pick Green over him--and I admit, these are starting to become pretty convincing--are 1.) that his ceiling is still higher than Suggs', as a true top 10 guy (where Suggs is a multiple time all-star but perhaps never a top 10 player, like a Jrue Holiday or Middleton); and 2.) if his floor happens to be lower (like Ben Gordon or Victor Oladipo), then at least that fits with the Process Timeline of going for all or nothing picks. With Suggs, we might be TOO good in 2022 to keep rolling that lottery wheel and contending for top 5 talent. And I don't care what the Screwy 2021 playoffs are showing us, you still should aim for a top 5 player in the NBA if you want hopes of contending year in and year out. If none of these players outside Cade are it for this year, then we should make like the Sixers did until they landed Embiid. The recent Jarrett Jack comments about Jalen Green's work ethic have also helped reassure me some. And not that it matters too much, but he was also the number one prospect coming out of high school (Cade 2, Mobley 3). I have no ill will towards Mobley, but it's just a fact in the modern NBA that big men, no matter how skilled, are just being schemed out of anchoring championship contenders. Embiid was the best example we had, and both he and AD have turned out to be too injury prone to be reliable. If you wanna bring up Chris Bosh as a Mobley comp...I really think that Christian Wood IS what Chris Bosh would be in the modern NBA. He shoots about the same, is just as good a floor spacer and remains a force in the PnR. Whatever advantage Bosh, or KG, had over Wood in the post or in the mid-range is pretty much minimized in impact these days. The draft is littered with big men that executives fell in love with early in the draft and ended up not meeting expectations. Wiseman, Ayton (over Doncic and Young? the only reason PHX is good is Booker, CP3, wings galore, and their team having a cupcake path to the finals), Bagley, Okafor, Porzingis, and even Towns. Look at how good Towns is, in terms of each individual skill, and how little that has translated to winning. Big men are perennial draft traps.
Mobley - Best case scenario - Bosh or Davis Worst case - Johnathan Bender Jalen Green - Best case- Ja Morant Worst case- Wiggins Take your pick.
Why are those 3 the consensus picks? Why limit to those when it’s been proven that guys who are not deemed top 5 picks in years past have become stars while top ones were busts / didn’t pan out.
