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Shams - Philly offered Simmons/Thybulle + draft compensation. Did we make the right deal?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by ThatBoyNick, Jan 13, 2021.

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Which package would you have prefered?

Poll closed Jan 18, 2021.
  1. Nets package

    177 vote(s)
    50.4%
  2. Phillys package

    174 vote(s)
    49.6%
  1. Houston77

    Houston77 COOKIES AND CAKE, MY TEAM BAKED!
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    I don't see a "2nd option" ceiling when I watch him play. He was the fourth option behind Embiid, Harris, and Curry and they still lost.

    Now, could you build a good team around Simmons? Sure, but you'd have to surround him with playmakers and let him focus on playing D and facilitating. I just don't buy that a guy who averaged 14 points in his fourth year -- and much fewer in the playoffs -- with a sub .60 FT% will suddenly develop into a #2 option. His FT% especially frustrating as it makes him near unplayable towards the end of tight games. What's the point on burning a max contract on a guy you can't play in the biggest moments?
     
  2. malakas

    malakas Member

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    Simmons doesnt just have a mental block.
    he refuses to get professional help and work on his weaknesses,he refuses to aknowledge any wrongdoing and problem.
    Refused the shooting coach and got Klutch involved to have his brother hired as his coach.
    Instead of admitting any fault kept deflecting and excusing himself.

    You cant fix someone who refuses to be fixed. You can show him the road only but you cant make him walk on it.

    And he has been steadily getting worse and worse. Areas in his game that were okay like FTs now are in shambles.
     
  3. steddinotayto

    steddinotayto Contributing Member

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    IIRC, his agent is his brother and his "trainer" is his cousin. Talk about surrounding yourself with yes men and people that probably won't challenge you because they're getting money from him via paid salaries already.
     
  4. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Like I said, a 24 year old is still a lump of clay with its best years ahead of it.

    Offense is fixable, especially jumpshots and free throws. It's worth a shot if the price is right.
     
  5. rpr52121

    rpr52121 Sober Fan
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    Let say he gets over his mental block and is able to maintain his regular season averages during the playoffs, wouldn't that just be PF version of Rondo?

    Is that really a 2nd star or worth a max contract?
     
  6. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    If that's the case then hard pass. As a willing participant I'd take the odds that the Rockets could make him a viable scoring contributor, like they did with Lowry, but it takes two to tango.
     
    malakas likes this.
  7. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    Yes, it is fixable, but there is no guarantee. There are examples where a bad shooter became good or at least serviceable. But there are also plenty of examples of bad shooters that never improved.

    There are several factors that make a good shooter.
    Shooting mechanic: fixable
    Shooting touch: mostly innate, unfixable
    Confidence (nerve): mental block that may or may not be fixable
    Willingness to improve: not fixable
     
  8. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    "Maintaining his regular season averages" would be a failure in this scenario.

    Between the Rockets' staff helping him and him hitting his prime years you would expect his scoring output/efficiency to increase significantly.

    The whole point of this project would be to buy low and sell high.
     
    steddinotayto likes this.
  9. steddinotayto

    steddinotayto Contributing Member

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    This. Especially the fact that he plays the point where, on most nights, he has the height/size advantage to just steamroll through the lane for an easy bucket. On this team he wouldn't have an Embiid in the paint controlling the low post so he should have the green light to get at least 4-5 easy buckets a night.
     
  10. rpr52121

    rpr52121 Sober Fan
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    But he cannot even maintain them when it matters. How on earth could any team bet assets and that contract on him being even better than his regular season?
     
  11. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Because you believe in your staff?
     
  12. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Provided he actually accepts the coaching, there's no reason at all he shouldn't be a terror on offense at the bucket and beyond the 3-point line. He could be baby Durant if he really wanted.
     
    steddinotayto likes this.
  13. malakas

    malakas Member

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    anyway Simmons poses a serious problem and a headache with no easy solution and costs a fortune and Im just glad it isnt OUR problem.
    I dont understand why some people are so eager to make it ours.

    Shouldnt all just be happy how we skipped a bullet?
     
  14. rpr52121

    rpr52121 Sober Fan
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    I mean it is not like this is a new issue. Ben Simmons was drafted as a kid who "could not shoot". Basically nothing has changed since then. The vultures were spiraling around him both of the last 2 playoffs when they got knocked out and nothing changed. I even have an inkling that him getting a free pass and his mentality is one of reasons Jimmy Butler got out as soon as he could.

    There is no evidence whatsoever the he accepts coaching, really thinks there is a problem, or wants to be baby Durant.
     
  15. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Eh. Eager? No. Open to it? Yes.

    It's not every day that a young raw talent implodes like that.

    We'd be remiss if we didn't at least kick the tires.
     
  16. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    Being bad on offense is never a "new issue".

    That's fair but it's also a separate topic and I've already stated how I feel about it.
     
  17. Asian Sensation

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    Draymond-esque sans the passion.
     
  18. varughese.arun

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    Hahaha
     
  19. apollo33

    apollo33 Member

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    He's fine the way he is. If we took him I don't even want him to shoot jumpers. Just make him a pure post up player, maybe a few short jump hooks or the occasional fadaway.

    I have never seen any player not imrpove at all from 19-25 and then all of the sudden make huge strides in the coming years.
     
  20. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost not wrong
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    He wouldn't be worth his paycheck if that was his mode of operating.

    Strange to hear this considering we have one of the most prominent late bloomers on our roster right now (Christian Wood) and two of the all-time best examples are notable Rockets' alumni (Goran Dragic and Kyle Lowry).

    Hell, just look at the award they made for this type of thing. It's full of folks just like that. Not saying it's anything near certain, but it's far from unheard of.
     
    D-rock likes this.

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