Today was the first time I seen Wood look visibly mad at the end of the game

Does moral raise or lower our lottery percentage?

To me, this sentiment is silly. They play a game for a living. They will be ok. One shitty season won't send them into a lifelong depression - they are still being taken care of and can still provide for their families. Maybe I'm just an ass, but grown men acting pouty because they lost a game isn't something that will pull on my heartstrings.

The one person I do feel a bit sorry for is Silas. This season could stain his entire coaching career; if he gets labeled a Loser then that is hard to change. Still, if he is going to get that label then I'd think he'd get that label even if our losing streak was only 15, for example. I don't think a few more losses will make a difference.

This is the perfect season for the Rockets to tank because everything was stacked against them. They hired a new coach who would have like a week of camp to implement his system; Westbrook wanted out; Harden wanted out; Tilman is Tilman. We could run this simulation 100x and it likely wouldn't turn out to be much better than what we're seeing now.

This is what tanking is. True tanking teams don't just have all close losses (which, by the way, this was one!) and moral victories. They lose a lot and its ugly. Now maybe one can argue that our losing is worse than the losing that other tankers have had, but even if that's true (which IMO it's not) it's a difference in degree only. Tanking has never been fun - it's ugly and embarrassing, and that's why the NBA tries to prevent it.

 

why do you have to move him? shut him down for the season(s) and play young guys.. you aint winning this or next year nothing anyway...then 2 years from now you trade him as an expiring

 

It’s easy for us to say “hey just pay that man 40 mil to sit.” A lot harder when you’re signing the checks.

 

lol this is the most ironic post I've ever seen.

 

Isn't he getting his knee scoped anyway, so that will shut him down for the rest of the season I presume

 

Let’s also not discount the effects of Covid isolation. Just like I wouldn’t have drawn long term plans based off the Bubble performance, I would also not draw too many conclusions from this season. Losing Harden, all the injuries, brand new coach, and then COVID. Things snow ball. We lose because we’re unhealthy, and we’re unhealthy because we lose. “It’s a viscous cycle”

 

I'm just sitting here watching the board react to this because it's funny.

I kept telling people there's a price to pay for 'tanking', this ain't NBA2k.

Things such as morale, team spirit, confidence, momentum, this stuff exists and matters. It may not be some fancy stat analytics track, but it exists.

 

The team isn't this bad, no matter what anyone says, it simply isn't.

Oladipo, Wall, Wood, KJP, Tate would all be playing more impactful minutes if they were on another team right now. Why? Simple, chemistry and confidence and playing as a team, this **** matters. Guys are out there playing for themselves and have no faith in the coach anymore...and we're supposed to bring this coach back next season? If he doesn't start the next season off hot that will be the end of him.

In the end, being this bad IS on the coach. He has to get a handle on his team. He has to tell Wall to chill the **** out or sit on the bench and watch the team. Can he do this? Is he even allowed to? I don't know. But the team has to do something. Yeah, Dipo and Wall simply have to go, they aren't here for the Rockets and it shows and their teammates like Wood who probably sees this as a team he can grow with can see it.

so things are going to get ugly from here on out unless the Rockets get rid of these two guys someway somehow.

As for moving Wall, if no one bites this week, just wait for the offseason. One more year off his contract and maybe someone will be wanting to fill a need. Don't get desperate to move him now, the tank is rolling, may as well embrace it and just tell KJP, Wood, to sit tight. I do think it's vitally important should we land a top 3 pick that Wall is off the team though. Him wanting to be leader is going to clash with Silas-Wood and the youth movement that needs to happen.

 

It's a vicious cycle for every team.

 

It’s not silly. Young players need to learn how to win at the NBA level and how to play at this level as a high-functioning team. The Thunder are blatantly tanking like the Rockets, but they are still finding ways to win (18-24) while developing a bunch of young talent.

Also, simply picking in the lottery doesn’t guarantee long-term success. The Pelicans are going to miss the playoffs after being gifted Zion Williamson with the number one pick last season. The Lakers were going nowhere until LeBron James chose them in free agency and convinced Anthony Davis to join him. Go look at the Phoenix Suns’ record since 2010 and tell me that tanking guarantees a quick turnaround. It wasn’t until they traded for a proven veteran leader in Chris Paul that they took the leap. The Clippers picked in the lottery forever under Donald Sterling and they never turned into a contender. The Timberwolves and Kings have been perennial lottery teams for the last decade, look at how they are doing. The Bulls have done nothing since they traded Jimmy Butler and have become a perennial lottery team. Their only star was acquired in the Butler trade. The Knicks have been in the lottery for the last six years, and it took bringing in a defensive minded coach along with the development of Julius Randle to get them back in the playoff hunt.

Also, whether the Rockets finish with the worst record or the third worst-record, they have the exact same odds if landing the number one pick or staying in the top 4. It’s not as if finishing with the worst record in the NBA by far gives them markedly better odds of keeping their pick or getting the number one selection.

 

Stone either needs to attach a first-round pick or two to Wall (Portland first, either the Washington or Detroit first-round picks) to get Wall on a contending team, or the Rockets tell him to get his knee scoped immediately after the deadline, and he sits the rest of the season. The third option would be that Stone and Silas make it abundantly clear to Wall that his role is to shepherd the team’s young talent and that either his ball-hogging, stat-padding ways hit the road, or he won’t play.

I understand Wall’s point that the spacing on the final play of the game was terrible, but he didn’t even give it a chance to develop and shot the ball with three seconds remaining.

 

Tilman probably won't agree to buyout of such magnitude. Realistically they should just play Wall every other game in the name of load management so that the young guys have some chances to play without him.

 

I was back playing soccer and basketball 2 weeks after getting my knee scoped for torn meniscus and patella. I was in my mid 30’s at the time so I could see him being out as little as 3 weeks.

 

I agree that we are probably going to have to give up a pick to get rid of him, I'm fine with that. He needs to go. We do need vets but not vets that think they are the best player on the team and franchise player.

Either way, Silas has to get a handle on him and set some kind of logical hierarchy on the team.

 

It would be nice if we were actually tanking and not just a crappy team that is beyond crappy when injured.

Probably where his frustration lies.

This team needs to pick a direction(youth) by this deadline or this year truly will be a complete waste as far as maximizing on court development of younger guys goes.

Look at OKCs team salary structure and minutes breakdown. They are tanking.

We just suck.

 

The Rockets are trying to tank. They are tanking successfully.

The Thunder are trying to tank. They are tanking unsuccessfully. (Plus, as you said, the Thunder have young talent - we don't! We have a couple young guys but we mostly feature vets. So this comparison is off-base; us winning and building the confidence of Wall/Dipo/EGo etc would be detrimental for our long-term goal. OKC also has SIGNIFICANTLY more draft picks than we do, so they could just opt to trade for a disgruntled superstar - we couldn't match their trade package.)

Agreed that players need to learn how to win. But again, the Rockets are tanking. So the "learning to win" phase comes after the tank phase.

Also I never said or implied that tanking is a guarantee of any success. What I'm saying is tanking is what the Rockets are doing. This is true whether or not you or I personally like tanking.

Your last point is of course true. And I am not opposed to us getting some Ws. But when we don't get a W, I won't break out the violin.

 

The Rockets have 13 first-round picks in the next seven years. They have plenty of draft capital to play with in future trades, and that doesn’t account for trading Oladipo for another one. The Thunder only have four more picks than the Rockets in that time frame.

I’m well aware the Rockets are tanking, but I’d much rather do what the Thunder are doing than the way the Rockets are approaching tanking. They still currently have a top-10 pick while their young talent is getting a lot of minutes and learning how to win games. If the Rockets want to truly get the most out of tanking, Stone needs to move Wall and Oladipo immediately or demand Silas bench them. If Wall won’t stop his ball hogging ways, he’s not the type of veteran you want making an impression on Porter Jr., Wood, Tate, Martin Jr, etc. Also, by getting their young talent valuable minutes now and teaching them how to play together while letting them compete and win some games, the Thunder are speeding up their rebuilding process. The Rockets need to use the remaining 30 games to let their young core grow together and allow Stephen Silas to actually coach them and see what they truly have.

Also, the Rockets would still lose a lot of games if they started a lineup of entirely young players, or four young players and D.J. Augustin. They simply wouldn’t have enough talent against most teams.

 

Yeah this is a small issue. The real issue is our **** owner.

 

Wall still needs to prove that he's more that a washed up stat padder.

 

Amen