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Biden Covid Relief package (3rd Covid Bill $1.9T)

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Amiga, Jan 14, 2021.

  1. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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    lol. thanks for catching the grammatical ambiguity. I've gone back and fixed that.

    you make me want to be a better man.gif
     
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  2. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    No it isn't. Criticizing someone for being a signficant player in a presidential race due to their wealth isn't the same as saying billionares shouldn't exist full stop.
     
  3. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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    oops, and thank you for catching my mathematical mistake. The cost will actually be closer to $16,800 for every single American TAXPAYER--not $15k for every household.

    mea culpa

    the figures from the last time around:

    https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020...each-taxpayer-see-the-staggering-numbers.html
     
  4. Roc Paint

    Roc Paint Contributing Member

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    Just keep posting on here and you and I will be square
     
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  5. adoo

    adoo Member

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    just to give all the info provided by the article

    About $16,800 per taxpayer, “Keep in mind, some of the package are loans and may ultimately be paid back.”


    also, as per the article, only 56% of American pay taxes.
    44% don't earn enough, as defined by the tax law, to pay taxes.
    • egs includes thew billionaire tax cheat who had received a pardon from Trump

    what is missing from this article is the economic impact on the GDP
    • w this stimulus, the economy will recover and grow much faster otherwise
    • w/o this stimulus, the economy will tank; more unemployment / business shutdowns
     
    #405 adoo, Mar 6, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
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  6. Roc Paint

    Roc Paint Contributing Member

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    Like the saying goes nothing in life is for free
     
  7. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Another thing to consider under Keynesian economic principles, which both Right and Left now subscribe to, spending money during a crisis can lead to a greater return in the future as economic recovery will translate into higher tax returns later.
     
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  8. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    So you gonna address the fact that you said Billionaires should not exist.

    Full stop.

    Why do you keep focusing on Bloomberg he was just one example.
     
  9. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    One of the strategies that Sun Tzu talks about is "Death Ground". How this works is that if you see that you are already at a disadvantage with no clear way of getting back to an advantageous position put your troops on death ground where they have retreat or surrender is impossible and they will fight much harder.

    In some ways McConnell is doing this as he can read polls as well as anybody else and knows that the unpopularity of the last President has hurt the GOP brand and their positions are unpopular. By putting the GOP caucus on "Death Ground" no compromise, no retreat will galvanize support within the base and make it less likely that the GOP message will be diluted. In a low turnout elections as usually midterms are, this means that the GOP base is going to be far more motivated to fundraise and turnout. As we heard from a Republican lawyer in the AZ voting case this past week, many in the Republican party see this as a zero sum game so any gains by the Democrats inevitably come at the cost to Republicans. By taking an uncompromising "death ground" stance makes sure that even if Democrats win it won't be because Republicans were willing to help them win.

    This obviously a very risky strategy but it worked for very well for Republicans in 1994 and 2010 when they were out of power in all three parts of the elected federal government.
     
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  10. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    This is very interesting as a strategy but I don't see how you can put Trumps base in a "Death Ground" they only really care about Trumps and having something to be upset about, i don't think they will ever really feel urgency unless Trump actually runs again, I don't see them feeling the urgency for anybody running in 2022 and most of them they probably think are traitors.

    I think an effective campaign for democrats would be saying most of these guys were not loyal to Trump and highlighting when I could.

    After the Flip Flop Turtle did on Trump I don't think he has much of a plan and is going with what worked before.
     
  11. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    I haven't even mentioned him for months. You brought him up.
     
  12. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    I see you are not gonna address the actual topic and continue to deflect from what you claimed you were not advocating.

    Thanks for illustrating perfectly why no one should take you seriously.

    So have you changed your stance or not?
     
  13. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Changed my stance info what exactly?
     
    #413 fchowd0311, Mar 6, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  14. ThatBoyNick

    ThatBoyNick Member

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    2 things here

    I remember I made a post saying I didn't think billionaires should exist and you replied something along the lines of "something we finally agree on".

    and secondly, when someone says billionaires shouldn't exist, it doesn't mean they should be executed. Same way if I say for example, starving people shouldn't exist in today's world, it doesn't mean I want starving people to be executed, it just means I think the human society should make sure everybody is fed.

    It almost feels as people are making this akin to racism, that's a total joke. The statement of Jews shouldn't exist is a very, very different thing than saying billionaires shouldn't exist. One involves massacring an entire ethnic population of humans, the others involve tax systems for people with unbelievable concentrations of wealth.
     
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  15. dmoneybangbang

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    Truthfully I skipped over the first part since that’s exactly what I meant by “politics”. That’s just part of the dog and pony show that is the primaries.

    From my perspective Bernie is more attacking the system that has increased inequality and is a politician that can personify it. That’s fine if you think it’s more classist but I just view it as part of the larger political game. Bernie himself is somewhat wealthy.
     
    #415 dmoneybangbang, Mar 6, 2021
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  16. dmoneybangbang

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    Well obviously it’s not easy, but neither is being a rough neck in west Texas.

    What’s your point? Those people are now at the top of system.
     
  17. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Also the way wealth accumulation works in this modern world of instant trading is that the more wealth you have the easier it becomes to create even more wealth. Yes, those guys worked hard and were extremely intellegent to get there first millions. But at a certain point the wealth accumulation became very easy.
     
  18. Major

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    The question was whether Bernie was using class warfare rhetoric. He openly says he is - even using those exact words. I'm not sure what else there is to discuss.

    This is like people who complain that Bernie is called a socialist when he calls himself a socialist.
     
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  19. Major

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    Do you understand English? You do know war does not require a military conflict, right? I would hope you are smarter than that. If that's your level of the understanding of war, we should just stop communicating entirely.
     
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  20. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    If someone uses "war" outside of the context of a literal armed conflict on rhetoric they disagree on its purely out of a motivation to frame it in a worse light that is toxic.
     

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