Can Steph carry his own team thread.

Exactly. That's why the phrase "more with less" was a poor choice.

The obvious counterargument is two-fold. One, Curry played 5 games last year so its intellectually dishonest to count 2020. Two, Harden's supporting cast last year (Westbrook, Gordon, Covington) was clearly superior to the Warriors (Draymond Green, D'Angelo Russell). You could say Harden accomplished more last season, but you couldn't say he accomplished more with less.

 

Ok, then please elaborate. When did Harden's team accomplish more than Curry's team?

 

It's actually intellectually dishonest to not count 2020. Curry only played 5 games because he is not durable. In order for a star to carry a team he needs to stay healthy enough to actually play games.

Harden did it his entire career. Harden's supporting squad his first season with the Rockets was Jeremy Lin and Asik, that is about as bad as what Curry had last year. Harden's team made the playoffs that year and he played the whole season.

 

I would humbly say 2015 and 2019. In a vacuum the rosters may have been better but factoring in injuries, a lot of those lineups Harden was trotting out there with were way worse than GSW currently.

 

Curry fell awkwardly, and Aron Baynes fell on top of him with his full body weight. That's how he broke his wrist. Anyone would've gotten hurt in that situation, and even though Curry could've played more games at the end of the season, no one can blame GSW for sitting him to improve their draft positioning.

If you're relying on Curry's 2020 season to prove your point, then you've already lost. Intellectual dishonestly at its finest.

In order for the argument to work, you'd have to compare their respective teams in the same year. 2013 Warriors and 2013 Rockets. By comparing 2013 and 2020, you're ignoring the relative strength of the league in those years as well as salary cap implications.

 

In 2019, GSW had 4 more wins than the Rockets. In 2015, GSW had 11 more wins than the Rockets. The question asked for years where Harden led the Rockets to a better record than the Warriors.

 

Harden did it last year lol. He also did it in 2014.

 

I believe he's comparing the 2019 and 2015 Rockets teams to the 2020 GSW team.

 

People that get injured in the NBA usually fall awkwardly, maybe Curry needed to learn how to fall properly. Whether or not he fell awkwardly or beautifully, he missed the season and his team were the worst team in the league as a result. That is the opposite of carrying his team to wins.

Your entire second point is entirely made up by you. So let me get this straight, there's no way to compare supporting talent unless it's two teams from the SAME YEAR? Also what does salary cap implications have to do with talent surrounding a player. Asik and Jeremy Lin are still Asik and Jeremy Lin no matter what the salary cap implication is

 

I agree with you on durability. If the ability to "carry a team" means anything, surely a player's durability must factor in some how.

I don't disagree that Harden is better equipped physically to carry a team compared to Curry. The question posed is whether Curry is capable of carrying a team, and I've seen enough prior to this year to answer yes to that question. Is he has reliable to do so as Harden? No, probably not. But with some luck health-wise, I think he can do it.

 

Is the question whether Steph Curry can carry a team or whether people like LeBron James and James Harden can carry a team better?

First, there is no question that players like James Harden, LeBron James and even Kwahi Leonard can carry a team better than Steph Curry. I would argue that even Giannis can carry a team better than Curry.

As for the other question, yes Steph Curry can carry a team, just not as well as some others in the league. Hell I would argue that Chris Paul arguably carries a team better......... but Curry has shown he can carry a team for at least periods of time, and I say that because of injury concerns.

Look at someone like Anthony Davis, as good as he is, he never carried a team.

If the question is whether Steph Curry is the best player, the answer is that he is one of the best but he isn't the best. LeBron James, James Harden and Kevin Durant are clearly better and that really isn't much of a debate. Has he really been any better than CP3 has been? I would say no, but Curry has been very lucky to be surrounded by great teammates and that helps him. Defensively he is a real negative, there are serious concerns about his durability and he really isn't a great playmaker like some other. He is arguably the greatest shooter ever and he is an expert at getting his shot off, that makes him a first ballot Hall of Famer.

 

Curry wouldn't have gotten hurt if Baynes didn't fall on top of him.

In any case, you can't look at 2020 if you're trying to argue "more with less". You'd have to pick a season where he played a substantial amount of games.

If you want to argue that Curry isn't durable, then go ahead and use 2020.

I'm sure you can figure it out. Think about it.

 

You can score points by dunking. Shaq couldn't shoot like Robinson but was a better scorer than him. And again, the guy who won the most specialized in defense and rebounding.

 

We normally agree on 90 percent of things, but I have to disagree with you on CP3. Mostly because I've never been a fan of CP3. I think a lot of his assists are cheap assists and doesn't contribute much to winning. The fact that Curry is the best shooter that has ever played the game causes teams to account for him and have to chase after him which does flexes a defense and creates space and opportunity of for his teammates. With CP3, you literally want him to shoot because no team will ever beat you with CP3 going off for 30. Even on our great 2018 team, I would taken Curry with Harden a zillion times over CP3 with Harden. Curry's gravity would have create opportunities for Harden and Harden's gravity would have allow Curry to get a lot of relatively open shots.

Maybe CP3 with a bunch of scrubs is better than Curry with a bunch of scrubs but Curry with another all-star would be tons better than CP3 with a bunch of all-stars proven by the success of the GSW vs the Clippers with Griffin and Jordan in their prime.

 

Don't we have plenty of evidence indicating that Chris Paul has a huge impact on winning, even in recent years? Do you think it's due to something other than his playmaking?

 

This means absolutely nothing, we can say that for every single player injured ever.

The difference is that players fall on top of workhorses like LeBron and James Harden all the time, and they either play while injured or they don't get as severely injured. It doesn't mean that Curry WANTS to be hurt, but it does mean that he is more likely to get injured..... and that doesn't even get into Curry playing less minutes.... and having missed 102 games the last 3+ years.