It’s all gonna work out, I’m pretty sure stone will get aggressive and make some moves to make us worse in the short term
This is what I disliked about Morey very much. Those 'low gambles' are all very flawed or head cases. If you gave it to a specialist like Duncan Robinson, it is another story. Or a JJ Redick, JJ Barea type, even a better Clemons.
They sat Curry and then waited until the season was over to get the procedure done. Curry had a real injury last year too but they sat him way longer than they would have if they were trying to win. They traded for an injured Bogut knowing he wouldn't play. And they did that because they were giving up on the current season. Nobody trying to win trades a major piece for a player they know won't play and may never return to form. If you go back and read these grades they talk about the move being a way to tank the season. There is just no denying that the Warriors threw in the towel that year by trading for an injured Bogut and shutting Curry down. Then in the final 8 games they went full tank and sat Lee but they weren't trying to build a winning team before that point.
That doesn't make sense. Why would he wait while sitting out most of the season to get the procedure done? He rolled his ankle again and he never played after that. Last year was an entirely different year. As everyone got hurt, there was no reason to play him and his injury wasn't nearly as serious, this is according to him, the surgery he had that year as quoted by him saved his career. I think you're really downplaying the seriousness of that injury and how bad his ankles were. This wasn't an optional thing This ignores my point that Bogut was a top center at the time, they didn't trade for him to tank, they traded for him because he was better than Monta Ellis. It's like if the Warriors want to trade Wall for Klay for some reason we'd do it, it wouldn't be a tanking move, it'd be a 'Well yeah, you make that trade' kind of move regardless if he's hurt or not. Sure, maybe he's never the same after returning but you take that gamble and live with it. You say they weren't trying to build a winning team but that's exactly what they did? They built a winning championship team and they didn't tank to do so. People saying Klay and Draymond, one was an 11th pick the other a 2nd rounder and this is somehow equating to "Warriors tanked to build their championship team" and that's just not true. Even if I were to say "They tanked for Harrison Barnes" so what? He was a replaceable role player and their core guys weren't acquired by tanking.
Last year was not totally different. There was no reason for him to play in 2012 like there was no reason last year. They shut him down and played it safe because they gave up on both seasons. Bogut was a top center when healthy but he rarely was. People didn't think they won that trade at the time. But they took a chance on him because Ellis was redundant on their team and Bogut was worth taking a shot on for the future. The future not being that season. It's like the Rockets trading Oladipo for Nurkic if they knew he wouldn't play again this season. They built a winning team by giving up on the 2012 season and making moves for the future. It's the same thing a lot of fans want the Rockets to do. Trade Tucker, Gordon, and Oladipo for younger guys and picks. So what? Barnes, Bogut, and Green were all huge for that team. And they got all 3 of them by giving up on the 2012 and building for the future.
I love this!! I couldn’t agree more And I’m really hoping we get really aggressive I want victor gone I want wood gone I want tucker gone You should be able to get a nice haul for those three in draft compensation for the future and it would almost guarantee us a 52% shot at keeping tge top 4 pick Please Stone let’s be wise. Let’s be terrible - don’t be stupid trying to compete for 10th Place in the west ! what are you doing?
Trading Wood would be stupid. He has just as much potential as any of the picks we might get for him and he is locked up for 3 years, we have his bird rights, and his contract is affordable. Agree on Dipo, Tucker, and if possible Gordan.
You keep saying they shut him down as if they had an option, they didn't, that was a literal career saving surgery. It really doesn't matter what people thought at the time, it matters what they thought at the time and they thought it was an obvious improvement to the team. Also, they did not get Green by giving up on 2012, he was a 2nd round pick. They took a flyer on a guy and he literally (his own words) would not be in the NBA if it weren't for Kerr.
They did have an option. He could have kept playing through the ankle problem and got surgery at the end of the year. You are acting like he hurt his ankle and didn't play again which isn't what happened. They shut him down, he didn't suddenly get injured. An improvement for the future. Not for 2012. They weren't trying to win that season. They took a flyer on him with their 3rd pick in the draft. They passed on him just a few picks before. Whose to say they don't take Crowder or another SF if they don't have Barnes. The more picks you have the more chances you get. Again, there is no denying the Warriors gave up on the 2012 season and started planning for the future. And part of the plan was to finish in the bottom 7 to keep their pick.
The one where we traded Harden, Hopkins and soon Watt and Watson. Lost Hinch, Luhnow, Morey, MDA, and Springer. Embrace the darkness.
I'm acting like that because that's what happened. https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2013/1/17/3885596/stephen-curry-injury-update-timeline On Jan. 4, 2012, he sprained the same ankle yet again. Curry, making his first return from a mild foot sprain, was forced to leave a March 10, 2012 game after another sprain, one of many in the lockout-shortened season. Following months of rehab and a clean bill of health, he returned to training camp for the 2012-13 season and inked a four-year, $44 million contract extension. So you're just wrong here. It wasn't an option. He had a chronic injury that wasn't just him rolling ankles. IIRC he had structural issues with his foot. He could not keep playing, they literally tried March 11, he played 9 minutes... he never played another game for that season. https://www.espn.com/nba/recap?gameId=320311012 So, how can they have been tanking if they tried playing him even after he rolled his ankle multiple times that season? It is far more likely they weren't tanking at all and just had to sit Curry out. The 3rd pick...he's still a 2nd round pick. Yes, they took a flyer, it had 0 to do with tanking. It was complete luck that they drafted him and it was just a good hire that they brought in Kerr who realized he was better as a big than some 3 and D wing which Jackson thought he was.
The article you linked to about the game has a quote from Mark Jackson, the coach, saying he decided to sit him. Not that he was forced out. They made a choice to prioritize his ankle over a meaningless season. I'd agree they didn't try to tank if it was just Curry. But it was Curry, then trading Ellis for an injured player, then sitting Lee to finish the season. That team gave up on trying to win basketball games in the 2012 season. They only had 3 picks because they tanked the second half of the season.
I don't even know what you are trying to argue. They did give up on the season when they sat Curry, but that was more about protecting your future's star's health than whatever pick they were going to get. Even if they didn't own any picks that season, they would have sat Curry out. GS didn't build their dynasty because they tanked in 2012, they could have bought a 2nd round pick for cash and picked up Draymond and would have the same result. They already had their core of Klay and Curry from the previous years.
But the season wasn't meaningless at that point and they tried to play him despite him spraining his ankle the game before. Think about that, he was already playing on a messed up ankle and Jackson STILL tried to play him. Eventually, after 9 minutes, they decided enough was enough. He never played again and had career-saving surgery to fix his ankle. At the time they were very much in the playoff hunt, you can see the current standings here... https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/?month=3&day=11&year=2012 It's exactly what @apollo33 said and I agree and said they did start to give up on the season but they tried several times to have Curry push through his ankle injuries that year and eventually decided it against it. I don't know or recall why he waited until the offseason for that surgery but I really the wait wasn't that long from March-April and probably just had more to do with the options the surgeon/specialist had given him is my guess but they did try to play him through the injury and it became obvious that he couldn't.
I'm arguing that the Warriors gave up on the second half of the 2012 season, and especially the last few weeks to keep their pick. They didn't build it because of that but the abandoning of that season paid off huge for them. It got them Bogut, Barnes, and Draymond. I find it hard to believe they strongly wanted Draymond and would have paid a second to get him when they passed on him 5 picks earlier. My whole point is that teams conceding seasons and making moves for the future isn't a loser mindset. The Warriors threw away the 2012 season when it made sense and it changed the future of the franchise. And in general the idea that the Warriors never tanked ignores how bad they were after Baron Davis left. They had top 10 picks in 3 of 4 years and the one year they didn't is when they they took Klay 11th. That team was built off of taking picks at 7th, 5th, 11th, and 7th. They hit on two.
Then I guess we agree. The Warriors tanked the season when they realized Curry's ankles couldn't hold up. And they were a bad team for 4 years that got to pick in the top seven 3 times.
I still don't understand the strategy of the management of this team. As a Rockets fan I love to see the team win, but giving up a shot at any of the top four picks in the draft this year is a new step toward mediocrity. If the idea is to rebuild, rebuild. If the idea is to win now, make the necessary moves now. I trust Stone, I hope he has a good plan for the immediate future.
