How do we fix the divide & teach truth to the disenfranchised?

Wait, are you saying storming the capitol and killing cops in the process is "free speech"? Or are you saying directly inciting these murders is free speech?

 

Coming from Turkey who knows what @dachuda86 thinks. Turkey is known for their coup attempts. It is like a rite of passage for them.

 

Please just don't let us fling poo at Ann Althouse and the Federalist and Jonathan Turley and...

 

Issue with this is the vast majority of political content (and content) on Twitter and FB is right wing content. They drive up the most views. So to claim "censorship" is a bit of a stretch. Censorship was never something that applied to private companies and definitely not in the application of their TOS. Furthermore, if a communication platforms decides it doesn't want untruthful or violent content on its platform, how is that censorship? Is that any more censorship than CBS news saying they don't want opinion pieces on their sites or broadcast?

If someone is generally inciting violence, should they not be allowed to do so? Frankly I thought inciting violence was not just against any organizations TOS, it's also illegal and definitely not protected speech by a gov't entity.

If Twitter made a good faith effort to correct Trump and push him from not inciting violence, and he has failed to comply, it seems that a ban is completely fair. I hope it's a temporary ban and they let him back in, but it's not different than someone getting banned from Clutchfans.

Did anyone cry censorship when someone got banned from this site?

By the way I was curious what would happen if I made a over the top statement - I posted it and sure enough I was banned from Twitter for 24 hours. So I doubt Navalny is being entirely truthful.

 

You can not tell people how to think or get people to see your perspective. Trumpsters have made up their mind. They don't want to be convinced. They don't want to know the truth. They have warped a world that allows them to believe in a false reality that makes them feel good. It's a religion to them. We can blame social media, snake oil salesman, and all the lies - but the truth is they wanted to buy into it. They were ripe and ready to absorb whatever BS was fed to them. You can't argue them out of it because they have rationalized everything to fit that new reality.

You have as much chance of "rehabilitating" them as you do of convincing @dachuda86 that liberals aren't commies.

Put your energy into positive things. I know I can't convince a Trumpster that their are wrong in their beliefs. But you can teach them that other people are good people and stand for what you believe in. And treat people well and make sure to spread love and kindness towards them, because that's the only hope of ever waking them up from the nightmare of lies they are trapped in.

Oh and thinking of them as deplorables or looking down on them, as tempting as it may be, will never do any good other than to make them dig their heels deeper. They have a right to believe and see the world as they want, and that is the fundamental right of any human being. There is a lot of anger on both sides, but Trumpster are very angry. And when people are angry the last thing they want to hear is the truth.

So disarm the anger. Not with the truth, but with respect, kindness, an inclusion. Stand strong for what you believe, but the last thing that works is judging them or telling them they are wrong in how they think. I am guilty of ripping apart those I disagree with but recognize it's pointless and serves no purpose.

 

Dachuda is from Turkey?

 

I would also advocate more education and not just job training. US history which honestly talks about our racist history and the real story of the Confederacy and its more or less resurrection after reconstruction leading to Jim Crowe, the bad treatment of Latinos and the genocide of the American Indians. We need more education in civics and how government works and the role of money in government. We need to educate folks on financial literacy so they do not give their money wastefully to high interest credit cards and pay day lenders. We need free college or at least as free as other advance countries.

WE need to subsidize

Cute, I assume quoted from Fox/Rush or sort or your own unique compilation from years of the type of right propaganda that led to folks invading the Capitol, killing folks and tazing their balls or being trampled while carrying their Don't Tread on Me Flags.

We need to debunk ignorant posts like this one: that try to pit city folks vs rural folks: that claim that all government is forcefully shoving stuff down people's throats whether in the city or rural areas; that acts like the rural economy would not be helped by medicare for all would not help put more doctors including specialists in rural areas; that free college would not help rural people's children go to college; that all rural people are self sufficient farmers without wages so a higher minimum wage would not help them economically; that using government to break up big ag; that waiting till it is profitable to put high speed internet in their areas is the way to go.

 

There are some deeper truths in what I "sarcastically" posted.

Hopefully, you can see that rural voters would view this discussion topic with a great deal of contempt. They will hear outsiders calling them ignorant which they equate to stupid. They will hear outsiders trying to fix them. They will feel disrespected.

Respect is maybe what this boils down to.

 

I haven't had the chance to read through this whole thread but this is really a very difficult and intractable issue. In the short term there needs to be consequences for those who stormed the Capitol, those in government who supported that and Trump himself. Further those who have been pushing this narrative need to face consequences. The people like Lin Wood, Sidney Powell, and Rudy Giuliani need to be disbarred and heavily sanctioned for both spreading false claims but also incitement. Many members of Congress should be recalled and/or expelled. This wouldn't so much be for objecting to the electors but for divisive rhetoric. For example Ted Cruz speaking the weekend before at a rally using very inflammatory rhetoric. Finally Trump needs to be impeached again and charged. In the short term these actions will be divisive but there needs to be consequences or we will see more things like this.

Trump hasn't been the cause of this divide but he's exploited it and once he's gone even if impeached and prosecuted there will continue to be a dangerous partisan divide. The Murrah Federal Building was bombed in 1994 more than 25 years ago and before the Internet was widely available. If we don't want to see years from now things like what happened in OKC or at the US Capitol will be a long process. I think we first need to consider that there are legitimate problems with the demographic that most supports these. White male rural life expectancy has been declining due to several causes. Addressing things like the opiod crisis will be a start. While I both believe in trade and the global movement of capital and even labor the problems from it need to be addressed. We're going to look at retooling rural economies. Things like mortgage crisis have also greatly hurt rural areas and the Trump supporters as older have been hurt by it too which we need to address.

The most intractable issues though are the cultural and social issues. The only thing that we can hope for is that younger white Americans are more accepting of diversity and don't see the culture war as a zero sum game. At the same time on a personal level for those of us who are on the other side we can engage with those who do, treat them in personal dealings with the respect that we ourselves would like to see even as we disagree with their political views. I've heard stories including here on Clutchfans about how politics are ripping families apart and as difficult it is to have a Thanksgiving dinner with the old uncle as a country we have to find a way to make that work.

 

Some more of this.

 

...this is what it looks like when you can be yourself, Lindsey-dear.

...er...

...except maybe for the skin color difference thing...

...but we're all past that thing now, right?

 

I agree on helping get the truth out and that social media is a huge problem but it should be for all sides. The question then becomes, well what really is the truth, I would rather read something that gave me the outlines of what occurred without the bias/opinion of the writer. Also, this virtuous attitude that its just far right Republicans that suffer from taking in disinformation is part of the problem as well. I also don't trust big tech to fact check without bias and there moderation policy is problematically inconsistent. The media feeds of the dissension, this isn't something that will end soon imo.

 

To add to my previous comment, media trolls like Lemmon/Jemele Hill/Clay Travis/Hannity don't want civility because then they would have nothing to report on. Division equates to $$$

 

Yeah, they should be shut down like the fossil fuel industry given the amount of **** they rake into the fire.

Might be the isolation but Colbert just goes on angry tirades with basic news. It's like it's more catharsis for him than when his biting sarcasm and wit gave us the benefit of catharsis.

Seth Meyers doing a much better job on that front by throwing us news we might've missed.

No bueno for blood pressure

 

Re-education camps

 

You don’t have the right to yell fire in a crowded theater or incite a bunch of morons to storm the capital with lies.

Stop whining about you rights snowflake and start focusing on your duties to this country which involves not attacking it.

 

...we used to call those "schools".

 

Both sides need a healthy way to air their grievances. Only then can the healing begin. The answer for this is the same as for other major world issues. It is right under out feet.

Spoiler: All big problems can be solved by having...

A Karate Tournament.

- cobra kai

 

Jade Helm, chemtrails, FEMA camps, black helicopters go WHIIIIIIRRRRR