Merit based school admission versus discrimination against Asians and Whites

That is not true.

A black boy whose parents made in the 70% percentile will do as well as a white boy who grew up in the 30% percentile.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/03/19/upshot/race-class-white-and-black-men.html

 

But is that due to systemic racism overall or because they had a harder time getting a scholarship or getting into a higher tier university? I'm not saying the cards aren't stacked against POC because they certainly are. I'm saying a rich black kid shouldn't get more preference to get into Harvard or a scholarship to a top school over a poor Asian or white kid because anyone rich has the means and resources to get into college. In terms of the workforce, there should be guidelines for diversity, otherwise some employers/industries would never hire POC.

 

There was a thread a few years after Texas went to the top 10% rule that showed that kids from the inner city high schools were competitive with their peers.

It was viewed as cream rising to the top phenomenon.

 

I take the stance that wealth distribution doesn't always equate social mobility. That's a broad stroke that people should hesitate using.

And playing numbers with probability doesn't equate causality. To your credit and others, just because you won't be permanently poor in the US for having graduated HS, employed full-time, and avoided having kids prior to the age of 21, this doesn't make the US completely socially mobile. It only demonstrates the simple idea that the bar to make a living in America is extremely low.

Yes, if socio-economic classes are separated by thousands instead of 10s of thousands, movement between the strata is going to be highly probable. But it doesn't mean it will happen nor does it mean that's the problem in the USA.

I've mentioned several problematic factors that you just can't reproduce in the USA. I enumerate again:

• Geographically situated next to high number of thriving economies
• Strong national identity
• Lack of ethnic diversity
• Low birthrate

These characteristics permeate through 100% of the countries that top the social mobility index.

There's other common factors you're pointing out here, like high tax rates, a centralized economy, and the structure/organization of the government. But that's not the total template, and we probably won't be able to replicate the gov't structure/organization anyway.

 

Thing is , Jobs are based off of production .... no production , no need for the employee.

How do you create more jobs without creating a demand for production of some sort of value first ? Creating jobs isn't easy.


Looking at the job market the vast majority of jobs don't require much intellect in todays society .... and really shouldn't require a college education to acquire.

 

I think OP is asking whether the current state of admissions should be changed or not.

Some people mentioned networking being important aspect of IVY league education. That sounds like a legit (albeit debatable) reason to have AA for legacy students' admissions. Is that what you are saying too?

Or are you just being cynical and not addressing the OP's question for the most part?

Just trying to understand your post a little better here as it is a bit confusing.

 

I think the mistake here is you would assume the person operating on your heart would not be qualified to do so. Do you think s/he just lucked his/her way through college and lucked his/her way to becoming a heart surgeon?

It seems like you're ignoring all of the obstacles one would have to pass to get to that point of their career. They don't just randomly select these people after all.

There is no such thing as a diversity hire for a heart surgeon. It doesn't exist. While AA assures a black person or any other minority get a chance at becoming a doctor it doesn't then go on to say this person MUST be given this prestigious job. It's like the rooney rule, they must be considered and given an opportunity.

What exists is people that see a doctor, look at their race/gender and then assume they aren't qualified and are a diversity hire based on their race/gender. It's a passive kind of racism bred into this argument because if you're looking at a black doctor and wondering if he's a diversity hire that's more of a you issue.

I think most reasonable people will assume s/he worked hard to become a doctor and heart surgeon and s/he's likely being assigned for your heart surgery because s/he's good at it.

 

Would you want the doctor with the best resume or the doctor with the best ability to heal you?

Your mistake is you think a piece of paper determines how good someone is with a scalpel. Best surgeon I ever met was this guy in this lab I worked in college -he didn't go to a fancy medical school - it was a crap one. But he was known as the best hands down. He told me his secret one day. He used to practice by taking rubber gloves and drawing patterns on it. Then using a scalpel to cut alone the patterns without going through the other side. And then, he sutured the glove back together. They don't teach you that in medical school and it doesn't go on your resume.

While arrogant fools like you focus on pedigree and paper, and dismiss life experience, other understand that people who walk a different path aren't inferior, in fact, most often, they are superior and bring innovative ideas to the table.

This is why diversity brings success. But your racist anger prevents you from seeing that.

 

Good point. I don't think people get that this is about opportunity. Opportunity isn't a guarantee of achievement.

 

bizarro world

 

What you quoted was not in response to OP.

 

Why are your bigoted doubts more meaningful than the years upon years of residency, specialization and board certification your black surgeon doctor had to get through, or whatever positive patient outcomes have allowed them to stay at that hospital? Or the fact that individual black medical school applicants have different admissions profiles, and may actually self-select for programs they know they can get into?

Affirmative action speculation is a straw man like social fit, attitude or STAR questions for jobs where half the candidates have no experience of any kind, just a lever to pull when your anti-black ego and agenda cross paths with a qualified black professional.

 

The fact that you think this is not hard shows how out of touch you are, everybody can't choose to those things especially as children.

I believe all of those things should be done but everybody are not afforded those opportunities, that's why the phrase circle of poverty exist.

 

It's really not a bizarro world in terms of education , it's the fact that so many jobs just don't require much intellect at all to do. Think about how many are , service or point of sale activity that literally anyone can do with the slightest of training.

What's bizarre is that very few jobs these days are actual production based.

 

Its.bizarre because were going from technology to automation and artificial intelligence

While you are suggesting

People shouldnt be going to college lol

What jobs that dont require much intellect are growing a rate alot more greater than jobs/careers which require intellect?

 

Learn a trade that would be difficult to be replaced by a machine. Some trades are far from being automated.

Medicine is also automation proof.

 

Medicine is not automation proof.... it’s the opposite.

 

Healthcare and nursing and doctors is what i was saying couldn't be automated

 

I'm not suggesting people shouldn't go to college ....

There's more jobs that don't require much intellect than there are that do .... if you want one that pays above the median , more and more of those do require a college education.

Those higher paying jobs aren't unlimited and are subject to the laws of supply and demand so what you end up with is exactly what we have - a whole heck of a lot of people with college educations that just don't pay off and a mountain of debt as a result.

Thing is , as American's we all feel like we deserve the opportunity to reach the upper economic crust .... even if the vast majority of us don't reach our expectations. We just don't seem to want to own the consequences of failure to reach those expectations ....

Everyone can't be the winner ....