Is the Trump Coup underway?

Assuming Trump picks up North Carolina - though that's a close thing itself - he's still at only 232 electoral college delegates. He'd have to have recounts flip the outcome in multiple states. Initial counts are already pretty accurate and flipping a state outcome only happens when the delta is very small. The record is a 2,500 vote shift in Rick Scott's 2018 win. The closest I see is Arizona at 13,000 votes. And Arizona by itself won't change the outcome anyway. So I wouldn't say it was 'seemingly'. I'd say it was undeniable. Recounts won't do it. He must have court intervention to throw away people's votes to have any chance at all.

 

I think they are banking on creating as much chaos as possible to force states into not certifying the election in 9 days or whenever the deadline is. I think they look at what Georgia announced today (hand recount) as a win to get at least one state in a losing situation to not finish by the 20th. So I dont think it's about overturning the results as much as it is about invoking the 12th amendment to force the House to then take a vote to put Trump back in power.

This is sort of an impossible task again with so many states needing to not certify, or namely one or more of WI/MI/NV/PA to keep the number under 270 by the deadline and then the Trump admin going to SCOTUS to try and force Pelosi to hold the vote. They will need multiple states to be where Georgia is in now, and need those state's recounts to go horribly wrong.

We'll see, but what they are trying is really difficult, and feels a bit more like a trial run for future elections than it does about literally putting Trump back in power in the overthrow of our Democracy. I think they are practicing, and normalizing the American public on the notion that a red state changing their rules in order to vote against the will of their people and state vote to just vote in whoever they want through the EC.

At least that's my opinion. Practice run for screwing with EC rules for the future, and placating Trump by giving him false hope. Boy if they do get let's say GA, WI, and NV to refuse to certify citing not enough time to recount, or litigation, or "irregularities" with the voting process and are able to get a vote in the House to put Trump back in power.... wow.... the world will explode that America is officially a dictatorship. Pretty embarrassing that the GOP is even trying to do this.

 

What if Trump's right? There would have to be enough evidence that the Supreme's rule in his favor.

It would be fraud on an epic proportion to pull off what Trump claimed (if true). Would you still support the group that committed fraud on that scale?

 

The problem is in court, they're not claiming massive fraud, but the potential for massive fraud because the Republican party isn't having total power to access. Biden can make the exact same legal claim in every county that he lost. It's not a winning legal argument.

 

If they can prove that they falsified tens of thousands of votes I would tell Biden to kick rocks.

 

That will not be the only thing they are claiming. If anything is to be overturned, there has to be concrete proof.

 

CONCRETE!

 

It isn't. My point is that we just have to think through a new system before getting rid of the current one. And the issue is also that Republicans have little incentive to get rid of the electoral college and go with a straight popular vote anyway, so it can't happen.

Seems that a better solution is to make the EC do its job. Maybe the president shouldn't be decided by popular vote. Maybe electors should be made up of former state governors, senators, and representatives who have served the state for a lengthy period of time and do not hold any current office to be compromised. Maybe the president shouldn't be a democrat or a republican but just someone who is respected across the board.

I don't know. I just know that its unrealistic to believe that the EC is going away.

 

I don't think @Baffled is hoping to win by sowing confusion and undermining the vote. He's not a crook. Whatever Trump is up to, @Baffled seems to be putting his hope in the legitimate process of recounting close election outcomes. I'm just saying it isn't all that close - not close enough to justify any hope in a different outcome.

Now Trump might be putting his hope in underhanded ways of changing the forum and getting a friendlier decisionmaker, but that also seems like a real long shot. I'd also suggest he may only be doing it to maximize this feeling of grievance so that when he launches TrumpTV he'll have an audience hungry for whatever conspiracy theories they're serving.

Trump has been warning us for months that the Democrats were going to perpetrate this fraud. If it turned out to be true that they did it, would you support the guy who saw it coming, had all the powers of the presidency, and somehow still couldn't manage to stop it? That's incompetence of epic proportions. At least it would show that Sleepy Joe is industrious, smart, and ambitious! If he could do that to Trump, just imagine what he could do to Putin and Xi!

 

There is no universe where I suspect serious election fraud or enough to change more than a few hundred votes nationwide. The only fear is that Trump tries some other maneuver to stay in power. If you or others think Trump has a legal path to victory; you’re part of the problem. The reason every other president has conceded before all votes were counted is because it keeps faith in our democratic process. This is unprecedented cowardice and frankly treasonous behavior by the president at this point

 

So are you serious about this?

@B@ffled?

 

Yet you have quoted 0 evidence. You need to backup your claim here. Affidavits are not evidence when they don't name who said x or they are based on hearsay.

You ask for audits of the vote - something not done before. How do you audit the votes? Do you want Republicans and Democrats to sit down and review each ballot? What if they disagree on every ballot? Set aside the laws that would be violated in revealing personal info about each voter.

 

4D chess.

What if Trump saw what was going to happen, allowed it to happen, and catch them in the act?

 

Thanks! I'd rather lose at anything than win by cheating. If there is a silver lining, it's the spot lite on the election shenanigans that has gone on for years unchecked. I'm not keeping up with the math to speak to how many votes have to be overturned, rejected or 'found' for Trump to win.

I haven't combed through these posts to see if the Dominion machines have been discussed, but I'd say that's a trending topic to say the least. I'm not pretending to know one way or the other how much validity there is in the allegations regarding these machines. But there is a lot of 'gocha' talk coming from the conservative twitter/parler-verse. It might be last ditch hope to string everyone along. But there are more and more non-political statisticians looking at the anomalies and it's spurring on the fanbase.

So it got me to thinking about the Esper firing. This is hypothetical, but if it was known there was the ability to cheat using the machines and cheating did occur. I'm saying IF. Trump would need both Esper and Richard Pilger out of the way to prosecute and then prepare for the backlash (riots, etc.). Pilger has been seen as someone who has stymied the DOJ's look at election interference and fraud, or so someone other than me says. And Esper is unwilling to use the military to preserve order in the streets. Is Trump expecting a massive backlash? He's set up for it with his new DOJ replacements (all loyal). ---You guys know I like a good conspiracy

 

I posted this a joke yesterday. He's talking about his lawyers. Both sides are expecting a legal fight.

 

Well that there's your problem: subscribing to the precedent instituted by 200 years of the Deep State (TM). You may think of that as "America," but you are wrong. America is only properly contained in the hearts of angry patriots who follow MAGA. (Yes, that is kind of circular, since America is also in the acronym.)

At any rate, correcting this election is showing that Trump is still draining the swamp,

Spoiler

... and filling it with his own putrid urine, like DeVos, Barr and other cronies.

 

Dach does not think its a joke and you did not post it as a joke either.


Dominion machines are not trending, maybe on parlor but nowhere else.

 

uh..yeah...I did.

Dominion. It'll be news in the next 24 hours. Take that to the bank. Even Rudy and Sydney Powell are talking about it. I feel like I'm a news cycle ahead of ya. You should peek into the other side's view from time to time just so you can understand what's coming next. Seriously.

I can't tell you if its true or not. I can tell you that you'll hear about it soon if you haven't already.

This is the coup thread right? So we're still talking hypotheticals. Wait.. it isn't a coup if a sitting president is...nevermind.
Back to my hypothetical. Throw in a foreign government, colluding. Now you've got yourself a Nation Security issue. That give Trump carte blanc to use military at his discretion. Esper had to go.....hypothetically speaking, that is.

 

Seriously. There may be something good to come of this. For you guys, that would be Trump losing but fixing the election process or making it more secure. That's a silver lining for me. It's not cowardice or treasonous by any means and he has the right to challenge it. You know this. You're in the legal profession. Don't let emotion overcome your rationale. (isn't that the saying???)