Bush's credibility sinks ever lower; Poland "misled" about Iraq, may pull force early

Poland is penalized 15 yards for piling on.

 

Sorry I couldn't resist...

Three soldiers, An American, a German and a Polish in the Persian Gulf war were captured by the Iraqi army and thrown into a prison.

When Saddam Hussein heard about them, he ordered the prison warden to execute all three of them by firing squad. When they heard the news,the American soldier, who shared the prison cell with the other two said:

"Look, I have an idea, these Iraqis are really nervous right now because of the war, so just before they shoot, scream something to divert their attention and that'll give us a few seconds to get away."

A few hours later, all three were taken to a yard where an execution squad was ready to carry out their orders. The American soldier was ordered to go and stand against a wall, and a few seconds later, the squad leader then ordered: "Ready! ... Aim! ..." when the American screamed in panic "EARTHQUAKE!! run!!!!". The squad scattered around and ran for cover and that gave the American a chance to escape.

The squad then reassembled and the German soldier was ordered to go and stand against the wall and again the squad leader repeated the order, "Ready!...Aim!...." and the German guy shouted "LOOK OUT! BOMBS!!! Run!!", and again the squad panicked and ran for cover which gave the German a chance to climb the wall and escape. A few minutes later the squad gathered again and the Polish soldier was ordered to stand against the wall and again, the squad leader shouted the order:

"Ready!... Aim! ..." and the Polish soldier then yelled "FIRE!!....."

 

Well Spain is pulling out, Honduras also. Bush was rather pathetically begging Holland to stay in. Looks like the "coalition of the willing" is not so willing anymore. Also looks like democracy is kicking in as the leaders who went against the majority of their people fear a backlash at the polls as the quaqmire goes on and on. Tony Blair must be feeling the heat, too.


Funny thing about lying to get people to do things. Sometimes they get pissed when they discover it.

Should be interesting in Nov 2004 to see how many of the ditto heads begin to get a bit perturbed at the lies. So far, most seem to have switched seemlessly to we had the war because we have this Christ like love for the Iraqis in that we are willing (with todays' small families) to sacrifice our only beloved sons for Iraqis democracy.

 

Say it isn't so....

 

just curious, glynch...if we were more consistent with it, would you support an effort like the iraqi war done solely to liberate a people, with no other pretense?

 

Sam:

Seems you're a graduate of the Basso School of Thread Titles.

Poland hasn't threatened to pull out early, as your thread implies, but rather has stated he thinks their job may be done earlier than anticipated.

I'm not disagreeing with the gist of your post (that ya gotta stop deceiving them that helps ya), but rather pointing out that these statements are not quite the condemnation you imply them to be.

 

A very very hypothetical question, Max. Let's suppose that the US was run by perfect Christians who weren't influenced by the desire for earthly wealth, prestige or position. Let's assume that the US had perfect intelligence of the real conditions in the other country ,not influenced as we have seen by imperfect individuals who weren't motivated by pure Christian humanitarianism etc

It might be ok for humanitarian intervention to prevent genocides if an analysis like the just war theory showed it was the only way possible.

Trying to be more real life about it. Such intervention should be done by the UN to safeguard against it being done by a rather small group in the US who might be primarily motivated by financial profit, , xenophobia or crazed desire for world domination.

Was it worthwile in the latest Iraqi war to kill approximately 20,000 and growing daily number of Iraqis to achieve what we have acheived? Was it worthwile to kill a couple of hundred thousand others beforehand in Iraq War I and the aftermath by destroying their water, sewer, agricultural, health and electic power systems? I definitely don't think so. It was a crime against humanity in my mind.


So Max, despite all the crooked statments and intelligence you still think it was a good thing to do?

 

glynch:

i hope you didn't take my post as being pointed...i was sincerely asking...not rhetorical or trying to box you in. just curious.

i don't know...i'm happy there's no more saddam...but i'm not happy at all with the outcome that lives were lost and that we seemingly exaggerated claims of WMD to our closest allies and to everyone that would listen. and no...i don't stand behind what i think were clear exaggerations...i don't think that was a good idea at all!

 

So in other words, you think that we are no better than Saddam? Your moral relativity is first seriously scary first of all and just plain stupid on the other hand. Can you not recognize that while we are far from perfect, we are the good guys? Of course not.

We committed no crimes against humanity, because those things you speak of are used for......ding....ding....military purposes and thus are legit targets. I know you hate America and wish the country (that nourishes your freedom to frothe at the mouth your little conspiracy theories) would get knocked down a peg or two. Everything you post here is America is wrong, blah, blah, blah. Bush is the devil....etc. I'm calling you and your militant anti-Americanism out.

You'd rather have Saddam still in charge. You'd rather that we had just let Saddam take over Kuwait and Saudi as well. You have no problems with Saddam owning all the oil, because it would accomplish your hidden purpose of weakening America.

 

Bama this is not moral relativity. Wrong is wrong. Killing kids by bombing their water supply is wrong. Even if sanctioned by the UN. Just wrong.

Sadam was wrong in much of what he did ; the US was wrong in much of what it did.

I'm not sure of what to call your morality. Perhaps "moral relativity". It is bad for Sadam to kill lots of kids. Any old excuse for killing kids is good enough if the GOP says it is so.

You'd rather have Saddam still in charge. You'd rather that we had just let Saddam take over Kuwait and Saudi as well. You have no problems with Saddam owning all the oil, because it would accomplish your hidden purpose of weakening America.

Good to see you that acknowlege that we killed all those kids and had two wars, the sanctions all over oil.

For your info I think America would not be seriously weakened no matter who controls the oil as they can't eat it, they have to sell it. We have the money and need for it. We could get by with a lot less if we had to.

So in summary, fo ryou killing kids for oil is ok.

 

Glynch judges the actions of the U.S. and other countries by the same standard. That is moral clarity.

You consistently excuse U.S. actions as "acting in our own best interest." That is the definition of moral relativity.

You love to throw that term around, but have no comprehension of what it really means.

 

Wasn't Poland the place where George Bush claimed that we had already found WMD's in Iraq?

 

Except for slavery, genocide of native Americans, exploitation of children through the industrial age, propagation of a global prohibitionist regime, etc.

Nothing to see here, move along!

 

mulder, if we keep it up, in fifty years, Americans will replace Polish people in jokes. and that is

 

Gee..., Poland, Honduras, Australia, Great Britian, Italy, Spain, Peru, Argentina, Malta,....I'm hearing all these countries with personnel contributions...the list goes on and on, and all this time, we hear the lying libs telling us we are doing this all by ourselves or something???...

 

Yes there are a few countries that are giving us some nominal help. But nothing that would make it inaccurate to say we doing it alone. That's basically the way it is.

 

you know who I blame for this?...You know who did this?!?...I will tell you... I blame the British, the Irish, the Italians, the French, the Germans, the Russian, and even the Africans...This is who we are...

Everyone is pointing fingers at us, when they did wrong by wronging others and sending others some other way and propagated what they knew as the wrong bestowed upon them and we learned the counter-societal embrace of the Mormon effect, and tuned what is truth and right by acknowledging the benefit of having your cake and eating it too...

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!!