Is LJ much better than SF3?

I suggest you invest in the NBA league pass and watch some Cavs games, - Lebron really is living up to the hype -PLUS, he really does have excellent court vision. He already make Illgaskas look like Rick Smits - image the assist numbers if you put him with a Yao Ming.

btw - you cannot compare him to Jordon is scoring, because the defenses are better now -

 

Hey it's not Steve's fault he was born with his brain how it is.

Labron hands down cant believe we're having this discussion.

 

While the stats are comparable I think Lebron James takes the edge on those stats and he does it at three years younger than Steve Francis. The statistics you're not looking at though are the most important ones and that's the ones measuring his impact on his team. Look at their winning percentage from last year to this year. Compare that to the impacts players like Jordan, Bird and Magic had on their teams and you'll see where Lebron James belongs in terms of what he brings to a team. Aside from having much better court vision than Steve Francis he makes his teammates better and they play harder. I like Carlos Boozer but I'm not entirely convinced he'd be having the year he is having were it not for Lebron's presence on the floor. The very fact you later had to bring up Michael Jordan's rookie statistics to show how he was better is telling. I don't know the future so I won't make any bold predictions gaurunteeing greatness in Lebron because we've seen potentially great players fall short of their potential due to injuries, substance abuse problems and various other problems. (Grant Hill being a perfect example of this) but I think only a fool can deny that Lebron has the potential to be one of the all time greats. I remember saying before the season started that even if Lebron James was every bit as good as they made him out to be the best the Cav's would still be lucky to win 25-30 games. Well they've won 23 already and it could be argued if they'd have shipped out Ricky Davis earlier they'd have won 30 by now. They're right there in the chase for a playoff spot. A PLAYOFF SPOT! If you can't see how special this kid is then you're just not watching basketball.

 

I agree. The most important number being the number of wins, and that is WAY up. I believe they had 17 wins total last season if my memory serves me. They have 23 wins now with 26 more games to play and they've been playing over 500. ball since they traded Ricky Davis. (the move that officially made Lebron James the man on his team)

 

Please do some research before you say this. Cavs got their first win ad Delta Center when Lebron went down because of injury and Boozer took charge in OT to score 10 points.

The fact is: Lebron missed 4 games after that. In those 4 games, Boozer averaged 21.3 points and 15.4 rebounds leading Cavs to a 3-1 record, 75% winning percentage. For the entire year, Boozer is averaging 14.8 points and 11.1 rebounds.

About Cavs winning more games: Cavs were losing badly (14-28) before they got JEFF MCINNIS as their starting point guard. Since then, they are 9-6, which is decent in East. Winning wise, I think the addition of MCINNIS and the break out of Boozer may be the deciding factor.

Also remind you, don't buy into Cav's total wins last season too much. They were intentionally tanking the season just to get Lebron.

 

the 14-28 record includes the time Ricky Davis was on the team. After Ricky Davis left they were playing over 500. ball. Jeff McInnis was a great pick up for them and I didn't entirely discredit Boozer. I love his game but what I'm saying is that Lebron seems to make players around him better and having him did alot to change that teams outlook and attitude. They feel like they can win now. I think alot of that stems directly from Lebron. Not to mention, were it not for Lebron James, it's doubtful the Cavs would have felt like they could afford to give up on Darius Miles and ship him out for Jeff McInnis. Same with Ricky Davis. Those trades just wouldn't have happened in all likelyhood were it not for Lebron James.

Also, I find it hard to believe they were intentionally tanking the season just to get Lebron. I'd like to see you deliver anything even resembling proof to support that accusation. That team was just that bad. (also, if that were the case then why did they fire their coach?)

 

If Cavs still have A. Miller, they will be Eastern champion contender.

 

The only problem with Lebron is that he goes airborne most of the time before he makes a pass. He can get a lot of turnovers that way if teams play the passing lanes.

 

Now you see that too. Getting rid of Ricky Davis and adding McInnis has a bigger impact than what Lebron has done for Cavs winning wise. So far I don't see Lebron making players around him much better. While his court vision is superb, some of his plays are spectacular, his poor shooting,turnovers and poor defense actually are hurting his team to a certain degree at the same time. McInnis , Boozer and Big Z should be more than capable to win in East. Lebron has bigger impact at putting peolpe in the seats and making more money for NBA and Cavs though. Will he make a huge impact on winning? More than likely yes in the future, but he's not there yet.

For that tanking season part, there will never be a proof. Just like Ewing went to NY in 1985. But everybody knows what Lebron meant to Cleveland last year.

 

Bron Bron is undoubtably smarter.....amongst other things.

The sad thing is that Stevie peaked in his first and second year (thanks to ISO). He can only go down from here not up IMO.

On the other hand, Lebron is like Woh! now and guaranteed scarier later. Mentioning Steve in the same sentence as Lebron's is an acute insult on the rookie.

 

I have been a SF critic. But I think the thread starter has a point here, though I don't totally agree.

I believe James is a better player than Francis, even now--but not as much as some people think in this thread. Statistically, their rookie numbers are very similar. In fact, both of them are/were playing for a bad team.

People point out the number of wins. But look at how the Rockets did when Francis was sidelined two years ago. I think Francis had comparable impact as James. It's just that Cleveland was REALLY bad before this season. The Rockets were still a decent team before Francis' rookie year.

The only objective evidence that James has better potential is that he is only 19 and Francis was 22. I think that was a big difference and is the decisive factor why I would pick James over Francis. As for the intangible such as leadership and court vision, we'll wait and see how LeBron does a couple of years from now.

 

This is a joke, right? It's not even close. LBJ is spectacular. He is this generation's MJ (and I'm talking about both Magic and Jordan). SF3 is this generation's . . . well, nobody because no one bothers to keep track of athletic and talented but ultimately ordinary players.

And this isn't just a knock on SF3. LBJ is also much better than Tracy McGrady and AI who are both very special players.

You can try to look at the "numbers", but consider this: LeBron is taking a last place team that endured lots of turnover at the beginning of the season and leading them to the cusp of the playoffs. That's something SF3 could NEVER do.

 

I think Easy is pretty much on. I think Lebron is a bit overrated as far as how "great" a basketball player he is now. He is a very good player now who also is very inconsistent in his shooting and shot selection. I do think SF in his rookie year had close the impact on the court as Lebron this year.

That said, it is also obvious Lebron is going to get better and better, and odds are he will be a truly great player. You can see Lebron has the mind, determination to improve as a team player and individual skills, it is a matter of him just continuing the refinement of his innate abilities. Steve has the skills and athleticism, but not the other parts Lebron also has in spades.

In Steve's case, and why it is so frustrating, is he really hasn't progressed much from his first 2 years. The same flaws he has as a team player are in his game, and his court vision and mental toughness have neither improved as well.

Thus SF in his 22 year old post U of Maryland rookie season he did have close the impact ont he court as Lebron's 19 year old, just out of high school, rookie year. BUT Steve has never progressed much through different coaches and different players around him since those 1st two years, it is all but certain (barring injury or terribel off court decisions) Lebron is going to quickly and steadily get better and better.

 

are you kidding me? i would trade steve AND yao for MJ.

 

this is a joke right? have you looked at how many teams under .500 would make it to the playoffs in the east right now?

 

sorry you were too late. when every1 realized it, mj was not tradable anymore.

 

That is a terrible arguement. The Cavs are like 8 games below .500. Making the playoffs in this years east really does not mean that much. The 8th seed could end up with 36 to 38 wins or so.