I like this Franchise!

Maybe because it doesn't
Sometimes you have to have faith in yaself
I get tired of those prescripted bull****
interviews. . . .

Like after a hard foul and you get kicked
you gotta 'respectfully' disagree rather than
saying .. . it was bull****

HeyP u prefer those Jordan like
say nothing interviews? Franchise may not
say the right thing. . but dammit he says something


Rocket River


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What has Carter learned? Please explain. Other than the fact he's finally hitting his shots, he's the same player attitude and skill wise as he was last year.

Do you think he's adjusted to playoff intensity defense?

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[This message has been edited by tacoma park legend (edited May 11, 2001).]

 

RR,

I don't really care what he says, but this thread does.

All I care about is he often appears to think he can soar to nba heights...well he can, individually. But that is far from his team being good in the playoffs. Shaq, Iverson and Vince learned that. Now McGrady is learning that.

If he wants to impress the media with quotes (which he clearly has been trying to do since the Vancouver fiasco), why doesn't he just talk about what he needs to improve on, and how hard he is going to work, rather than ... as grummett say,,, achieve success through osmosis.

You never read Francis talk about his short-comings. Mobley is just now starting to do that, but Francis seems to favor expressing false confidence. And it is false. A man like Francis without a goto move, talking about how he is going to will his team to the playoffs without "worry about fitting in", is expressing false confidence, imo. It is like he is afraid to face the fact he has no go-to move (like Iverson/Cat's first step), or afraid to see how Nash is a better PG penetrator, because he works the defense so much better, yet he has no real goto move either.

Francis doesn't need a goto move if he really wants to work his awesome midrange game and improve his interior decision-making, but he sure showed me last year and is expressing again in this article, that he really wants to be a shooting guard with no goto move.

 

TPL, ask Carter! He says he and the team are learning playoff winning. The game winner against the Knicks (or was it 1st game vs 76'ers) was two passes from a smothering double of Vince at the elbow. I could see him shooting that last year.

 

HP,

The only thing I see different about Carter this year is that he's finally making his shots. Being able to pass out of a double isn't a sign of a player's growth experience wise in the playoffs.

I think you misinterpret the quote "worry about fitting in." I think that means if a guy makes a mistake, he's gonna let them know about it, and make sure they don't make the same mistake twice. Also, why would he comment on the weaknesses in his game? The whole point of the article was what he's learning from watching playoff games live, not what he thinks his weaknesses are and what he needs to do to improve them.

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TPL,

We are talking about quotes here in this thread...no?!! Stay on topic...

Carter said he feels different, and the team is responding differently. He pretty much admitted to playing the playoff incorrectly in the past. You say it is "hitting your shots". I say Carter is remarking about reading the court and the defenses better, from maturity to know that playoff defenses are different, and he can't beat them like he can in the regular season.

Francis never mentions his shortcomings. Not just this article, but never. Yet, he is now saying he is going to get in the face of teammates. He is too imperfect for that. And it just exudes false confidence.

I don't think I'm reading too much into what Francis is saying. It is more reading too much into what Francis is NOT saying or NOT doing.

Look at it this way, Finley was down 0-2 against Utah in his first playoff ever. First EVER! He never once tried to take over. He continued to let Nash run the show, and Nash continued to work his magic into the gut of the defense.

Do you read that type of team-play maturity into *anything* that Francis has said or done. imo, both Francis and Mobley think they can win on skill alone, and "just taking over". They can't. From late season quotes and play by Mobley, I think he is closer to realizing that than Francis. Francis is a classic celebrity-type in my mind with contrived quotes, knowing he will always be a superstar as long as he doesn't act like a Marbury idiot. But I could care less about Francis being a media darling. Just play the game and cut the celebrity crap.

 

I agree with Tacoma, heypee.

I think you're misinterpreting the spirit in what he's saying. I think he's just excited at the possibility of becoming a team leader and being a part of the competition he's been going out of his way to go and see. He's excited about next season, he's showing a competitive fire.

I say amen, brother Steve. Preach on.

Lord knows there are some others on our roster that could learn a lesson from that.

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Gascon

 

Gascon, I said to TPL that I don't think I'm reading too much into Francis's comments; if anything, I'm reading too much into what Francis has never said and doesn't do, and this article is further confirmation.

OK, i'm on a one day run, having been away from cc.net posting lately. Forgive my overexuberance...but this Francis is GOD, and can preach to us like he's our savior .... makes me want to throw up.

...the possibility... uhhh, he is proclaiming himself not only as team leader, but ready to get into people's faces. That's too much celebrity interview crap for me.

Just improve your game Stevie this summer, like we all know Mobley will. You have a LOT to learn to be even a hybrid PG, much less a real PG like Isiah, who is your "Role Model" in the article. Quit talking the talk. Just play like Nash, and I will be so thrilled.

[This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 11, 2001).]

 

I would hope he'd be ready to get into his teammates faces in his 3rd year ,on a team with no veteran leaders, assuming Olajuwon is gone.

HP,

Obviously some people are blowing this article way out of proportion, and some of the things being said are ridiculous. Honestly, I think he just went to the games to enjoy them with a few of his good friends, and this whole learning from seeing it live thing was a little exagerrated, but it is Fran Blinebury writing the article.

I understand you want to smack some sense into some people, but don't overcriticize the guy to get your point across.


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What if Cuttino Mobley had made those remarks? He would have been lambasted on this board for "shooting off his mouth as much as he shoots the ball".

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"You don't do that! You must always give the Dream back his change!"

The Rockets will be NBA champions. Believe.

 

Seeing as you are expressing NASH so much, how long did it take him to get to where he is now? I know for a few years now, last I remember no one wanting him and riding the pine.

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I do wish he never gave up on a fast break ,like Nash, and drifted to an outlet spot like Jason Williams.

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[This message has been edited by tacoma park legend (edited May 11, 2001).]

 

I only compared Francis to Nash to make the point that Francis is no point guard like Nash or his Role Model (Isiah). Now, imagine Isiah....would your trade Francis for a non-jumping Isiah....I don't think you would.

My point is: Francis is far from being the leader to will us to victory as he proclaims with such false confidence, given the fact he has no goto move.

Here is my best Commode Comment
Francis wants to be MacGrady, Vince and Kobe, but he is only 6'3". He is not them, and should stop trying to be them. Iverson isn't even 6', but he has a goto move that Francis only dreams about.

The boy needs to face the facts. His dribbling is not all the hype. His cross-over is little without a fast move or spin move. He is not Nash or Isiah inside the interior defense.

Francis needs to find a role. Right now, it is my opinion that he is screwed up in the head between being Isiah and Kobe. And it is also my opinion that 95% of the board is is major homey denial about our superstar's shortcomings.

TPL,

You ask me how Vince has improved other than making more baskets. Well, obviously the comeback is how has Francis improved other than improving his midrange jumpers. He did not improve the interior passing game, nor the fastbreak like I hoped. He is a miserable C- in my book on those two counts, especially when you compare him to other star point guards....rather than comparing him to Mobley or Kenny Smith.

 

HP would have praised Cat if he made those remarks.

Whats with all the lack of love for Francis HP? He definitely has a lot of growing to do as a player, but damn your being hard on him.
It just sounds like someone that has a burning desire and a willingness to work his ass off to achieve the playoffs.

By the way, how many times did we hear Dream or Jordan talk about their weeknesses during their early years? I don't think just because Francis doesn't talk about his makes him less mature.

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That's crap!! Especially since I started my whole run by saying Mobley's talks like an idiot, too. Read my POSTS!!!

I'll leave it at this, once again...95% of this board is in denial to the shortcomings of our superstar.

Francis is not MacGrady, Kobe or Vince because he lacks 4 inches.

Francis is not the pure point guard because he lacks superior penetration and interior passing like Isiah or Nash, or superior fastbreaking like Kidd.

95% ..... 95% ..... 95% .....

After 3 years.....after 3 years....after 3 years.....

...what are you going to do with a 6'3" schizophrenic "hybrid PG"

The boy does not know what he wants to be other than a celebri-ty

 

ooops

[This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 11, 2001).]

 

I have no problem admitting that Francis has some growing to do as a player but I like his attitude and his desire to work. Not trying to put words in your mouth but you sound like you have a hard time finding the falue in someone that gave us 20 pts 6 assists and 7 boards a game last season.

Francis has a ways to go as a player but you should still be able to apreciat the talent level and the possitives that he brings to the team.

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God you are so easy. Hakeen and Jordan had go to moves from the gods...duh. Magic and Bird had court vision and passing from the gods. Isiah had interior passing instincts from the gods.

That is why they never talked about their weaknesses. They had **** from gods. Francis has leaping ability from the gods like many others. Francis has excellent midrange shooting. So do about 8 other people in the nba, and he is like 4 to 5 inches shooter than them, or a step slower.


plus, what is my problem with criticism our Francis, if I don't believe he is ready for all he says he is?

[This message has been edited by heypartner (edited May 11, 2001).]

 

You've complained alot about his interior passing, but I just don't see it. His interior passing isn't great, and it isn't bad. He definitely needs some improvement in that area, but not to the extent you suggest IMO.

There's alot of GOOD players with no definitive go to move. Just to name a few, Kobe Bryant, Vince Carter, Tracy McGrady and Gary Payton. It would be nice if he developed one, but most star guards do NOT have a go to move. I'd like you to name me another guard ,other than Iverson and Mobley, with a true go to move.

On the Nash comparison, I don't really see how that comparison is a good one, other than the fact that you like the way Nash plays. Nash is surrounded by good perimiter shooters, who are consistent. What consistent perimeter threat does Francis have other than Mobley? Walt and Bullard are streak shooters and can't be relied upon. I can easily see why Francis does have an identity crisis. He hasn't found that equilibrium between being a point guard and shooting guard. Hopefully next year we'll see the transformation.

I totally agree with you on the fastbreak. He is way too inconsistent in running the break, and has yet to develop the point guard tendencies to running the break, like leaking to the middle of the floor after the shot has been put up. The good thing about his shortcomings are that they have nothing to do with skill, but rather with his decision making.

I actually wish he would have the mindset of a 2 guard more, as far as shot attemps go, but that the shots he took would be more midrange like Sam Cassell. If he can develop that midrange game like Cassell and Brandon, I'd be ecstatic.

Hopefully he'll work on his shortcomings, even if he hasn't said he will publicly. I know at the end of his rookie season he said he wanted to get bigger and become a better free throw and 3 point shooter. Well, he did, so I hope he'll work on his other weak areas this summer like he did the past one. I kind of like the idea of one of the players wanting to help take this team to the next level, and this does not mean he wants to be some one man team to get to this goal.

Cuttino and Francis are the least of my worries as far as working this summer to improve their games. They both have a burning desire to be great players, so there's no reason to believe that they won't improve.

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