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Van Gundy does NOT hurt Steve's game

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Random., Jan 30, 2004.

  1. Random.

    Random. Member

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    Everywhere I read anything about the Rockets, (especially now, in connection with all-star voting) all the sportswriters seem to give Steve Francis a free pass on why he's having his worst statistical year ever because he's now trying to play how Van Gundy wants him to.

    However, besides sounding 'good,' there doesn't seem to be any support behind this excuse.

    Fallacy #1: His points are down because he's trying to get everyone involved and thus shoots less this season.
    So what? He still is shooting a terribly %, far less than the year he suffered migraines, and I seriously doubt Van Gundy's game plan requires him to take some of the horrible shots he attempts. Even his rookie year he averaged 2 more pts a game, despite attempting 1 less shot.

    Fallacy #2: He's becoming more of a true point guard, because that's what Van Gundy wants.
    Then why are his assists at all time lows while his turnovers stay the same? If he can't raise his assists with Yao Ming (who makes half his shots!) standing right by the hoop, then he's really not doing anything to become more of a true point guard.

    Fallacy#3: The offense now runs through Yao, Steve is the second option.
    Second options don't attempt 3.5 more shots a game than the first options, even Mobley attempts more than Yao. In fact Yao attempts about as many as Mo, and Jim Jackson, so Steve is obviously still an integral part of the offense.

    I'm just tired of Sportswriters making up excuses for Steve and blaming it on Van Gundy, because it isn't his fault Steve often opts to ignore Yao so he can run headlong into 4 defenders and throw the ball wildly at the basket.
     
  2. benvolio

    benvolio Member

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    Here, here!

    The only legitimate consideration I can see with the JVG systems is the emphasis on the defensive end. It goes like this:

    1) Each player has a finite amount of energy to expend.
    2) Energy can be spent on the offensive end or the defensive end.
    3) Energy used on the defensive end cannot be used on the offensive end and vise versa.

    So, one could argue effectively that Steve's lower offensive numbers are PARTIALLY due to heightened energy expenditures on defense.
     
  3. buddry

    buddry Member

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    Ok, this is all wrong. You will get very few assists passing to a guy in the post. They always stand around for a while then make thier move. An assist is never awarded for this.
     
  4. Toast

    Toast Member

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    Fallacy of your post #1: His assists this year are at 5.9 a game vs. his 6.3 in his best year (2001). His minutes are also down - 39.6 vs. 41.1.

    Fallacy of your post #2: The offense runs through the POST, not just Yao. Yao and MoT mostly, but other players post up. Regardless, just because the offense runs through the post doesn't mean the post player's # of shots should be inflated. Once Yao puts the ball on the floor (which negates any assist, by the way), if the double team comes, he kicks it out. Then the shooters shoot.




    Agreement with your post #1: SF's shooting touch has disappeared. Why? I have no clue, but he needs to find it. BAD.
     
  5. buzz1701

    buzz1701 Member

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    Energy? How much energy does it take to dribble, dribble, dribble then launch a brick, or an impossible throw-it-up toward the rim? His game is off right now and it's not JVG fault that's for sure.
     
  6. OddsOn

    OddsOn Member

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    How can he be expending his energy on the defensive end when he is to busy cheating into the lane looking for rebounds?
    How many open shots did Mike Bibby have in the Sac game? I got tired of counting....

    I don't mind him cheating down for rebounds as long as the man he is guarding is not hitting his shots, but if he is shooting lights out you gotta man up on him...

    And for goodness sake, if you are going to cheat off for rebounds how about pushing the ball up court for a fast break every once in a while........otherwise it kind of defeats the purpose and trains you big men to not fight for the rebounds since they know there is a guard lurking there......IMO the only rebounds guards should be making are long ones from errant threes.....else they should be getting back to stop the ball on transition defense...which is something else are guards suck at.......lol

    I think that the zone defense has really limited the play of SF since it is easy for people to double down on him now...
     
  7. Charvo

    Charvo Member

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    Look at the streetballers in the league in the league. Steve stands out in the West, but look at the brickers in the Eastern Conference. Baron Davis, Vince Carter, and Allen Iverson have all used their superior driving ability to be successful. Is it a wonder why Allen Iverson always does badly against the Rockets while guys like Bibby always kill the Rockets? One guy has to challenge a 7' 6'' guy while one guy can stroke it from outside for easy points.
     
  8. buddry

    buddry Member

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    How many shots did Bibby make when Steve was practically in his jock? Bibby was shooting lights out. It didn't matter if he was defended or not that game. It was just one of those games where he was on.
     
  9. waihh

    waihh Member

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    I start to watch Rox because of Yao but I love Steve much better. He is a player with courage and skills. I think Steve's recent bad game is mostly due to JVG's game plan and lessly Steve himself. Reason 1, as Toast mentioned, JVG run almost every play through the post, not Yao but also Taylor and others. When double team comes, the ball is kicked out. Steve is a better player with the ball in his hands than shooting off pass. I know Steve has to improve in this catagory, but you have to give him time. Reason 2, JVG want Steve to be a true point guard, which is like to force Yao to be Shaq and simply will not work. Steve is apparently confused. This severely affected his game. If JVG can allow Yao to play his game, why can not he allow Steve to play his. Why must a team have a "True" point guard. Look at Spurs, Twolf and the 2001-2003 Lakers, are Parker, Cassel, Koby "true" point guard? Hardly. I saw how Mark Jackson helped the team in a couple of games, but that was just winning in a different way Period. JVG has to help Steve to play his own game. Reason 3, Steve is forcing himself. Because of the mentioned reasons, Steve was having bad games. He is a so passionate player, he wanted to shot his game back which is understandable to me.

    Now out of the topic. I am really confused of JVG's game plan. Somebody tell me who is the superstar in the game. You have to have one or two superstar to win big time. It seemed to me the superstar in this team is Mo Taylor, or JJ, or Mobley, or Steve, or Yao. Devided by minutes, they attempted similar amout of shoot. Do you seriously think Mo or JJ is going to lead us to somewhere? If you do not like Steve, trade him for another leader. If you will keep him, establish by the game plan that he is or at least will be the team leader. When the game goes smoothly, everything is fine, when something goes wrong, you need a "HEART" to lead you back. I personally think that's why Rox won close game last season while lost this season.
     
  10. PhiSlammaJamma

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    Just like the 4 pass rule, I'd like to see a dribble rule on the Rockets. If you are not going toward the basket you cannot dribble in the half court. If you do, you can take a seat on the bench.
     
  11. francis 4 prez

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    if there's one thing that's been missing from this forum, it's threads that bash steve francis. that's for the refreshing new angle Random..
     
    #11 francis 4 prez, Jan 30, 2004
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2004
  12. Tonaaayyyy

    Tonaaayyyy Member

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    more money more problems.. its the pressure:D
     
  13. titaniumws

    titaniumws Member

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    can steve renegotiate for a lower contract?
     
  14. Uprising

    Uprising Member

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    Maybe SF needs to grow out his hair again. Since he has shaved it off he has lost is touch. :p
     
  15. ayears

    ayears Member

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    :rolleyes:

    Well.Give you some info,waihh

    2002-2003 season

    1)Nov 16 @Suns L 88-87

    2)Nov 25 @Clippers L 90-89

    3)Nov 27 @ Blazers L 77-71

    4)Dec 7 @ New Orleans L 98-96 (OT)

    5)Dec 14 @ Memphis L 114-109 (OT)

    6)Dec 24 Utah L 91-96

    7)Jan 5 Golden State L 84-86

    8)Jan 21 @ Spurs L 82-87

    9)Jan 27 @ Chicago L 98-100

    10)Feb 6 @ Cleveland L 102-105

    11)Feb 12 Utah L 101-103

    12)Feb 19 @ L.A Lakers L 99-106

    13)Feb 28 @ Washington L 98-100

    14)Mar 19 @ Seattle L 94-100

    15)Mar 24 @Sacramento L 108-109

    16)Mar 27 @L.A Lakers L 93-96

    17)Apr 3 @ Milwaukee L 99-106

    What's you gonna say now? :p
     
  16. ricerocket

    ricerocket Member

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