Ring count means nothing for KD bc he joined a team that had already won championships and incredible regular season win totals. He did not elevate a team to the championship. He simply hopped on Curry’s dick to get some easy chips. He has no respect. KD = POS
**** KD. Biggest p***y in the NBA history. I think it's blasphemy to even mention his name in the same sentence as LeBron or Bird. Let him enjoy his asterisk rings.
Also, equating what KD did to LeBron.............. KD didn't join just some championship contender, he joined the CHAMPS, guys that already had a ring. Champs that he had a 3-1 lead against and choked. A team that had the best regular season record of all-time even without him. LeBron's circumstances of joining 2 all-stars and a complementary cast of certified scrubs wasn't even close to what KD did.
Why are we taking about narratives and emotions? KD clearly lacks the play making ability to be one of the all time greats, and unless he REALLY steps up that area of his game, he will never be a part of the goat conversation. Picking teams that are already capable of winning championships definitely isn’t helping him either, but his ultimately secondary to the fact that he simply isn’t as good at basketball as MJ, Bird, Lebron. KD has arguably never been the best player at any point in his career, never mind across all of time. Cute thread, and I appreciate the edge lord factor, but come on.
KD will always be viewed by the majority of fans as a b**** for joining GS 73 win team who had already won without him. As a result, no matter how good he is, he will always be viewed a tier below the MJs and LeBrons. Pure skill wise, I think he could be considered top 15 or maybe borderline top 10 all time.
34.7PPG/ 7.8RPG/ 3.8APG/ 2.7SPG/ 1.0BPG FMVP. 3rd Greatest SG ever. Peak advanced metrics blow #2 Kobe out. 5 year run of 23ppg on 50% and 10rpg. LeBron joined up with these 2 guys to be what the Warriors are. Different league and different time. Different CAP. KD had no one else to go form his own super team and I think everyone can agree Russ will never win a damn thing. If the Warriors exist in the summer of 2010 with max cap space, I guarantee you LeBron would have taken his talents to the city by the bay. Not only that, but the fact that he ditched out on his home team at just 26 to join up with the super friends and then ditch them after a failure run of only 2 titles and not delivering on his "not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6, not 7" comment for some BS media narrative of going home when in reality Miami was going to have a tough time continuing to contend with LeBron and Cleveland was sitting there with Kyrie and multiple #1 picks as assets for another all-star team up. NOW. A THIRD time ditching out after the hardest playoff run he's had and running Kyrie out of town and a clear sign things would get tougher with Boston and Philly and Toronto improving. He goes to LA and some time is going to go by where people think he's going to teach some young kids how to be great, but when they get the first opportunity to trade for a big time superstar and sign another this summer, it'll be another forming of superfriends. Here's a funny scenario. KD joins up with LeBron in LA after LeBron heavily recruits him and loses to him and gives him FMVP 2 years in a row. KD apologist don't exist like they do for LeBron. KD will still be a b**** for joining up with LeBron who "carries KD" to more rings right?
KD has to win at least one ring as unquestionably the best and most important player on his team to even start to be considered. People are infatuated with KD and his ranking for some random reason. The real question regarding players is can Steph finish as a top 2 pg? I think yes. Magic and him. Steph is the lynchpin to that squad. 2 mvps, one unanimous. And as much as anything has been as responsible as an single player ever - to the exten one player can be - for changing the entire way the game is played and even thought about potentially being played.
I think KD needs some actual impressive championships to move up the all time ranks in most eyes. Coasting to a few championships while you're on the A team beating a bunch of B teams isn't an impressive accomplishment. Lebron only has 1 impressive championship. The league will be in a much better place once these 2 cupcakes aren't the best players anymore.
I wondered about that. If KD wins one more this season and joins up somewhere else where it's still a great team but he's unquestionably the best player and leader and continues to win especially against GS's original big 3, that'll boost him big time. Steph is already #2 PG all time behind Magic. You can't convince me Isiah is better. Stockton is not better. CP3 has those LeBron like metrics that would make him #1 all time if you just used advanced stats, but his playoff resume is severely lacking. Very comparable to David Robinson and his insane advanced metrics in comparison to Centers ranked above him due playoff #s and rings as #1s. Jerry West and Oscar and Cousy have much respect from me as pioneers but I just hate to rank them among modern players. I usually try and do pre merger rankings and post merger rankings where pace and amount of teams are more consistent. Maybe one day another separation will need to be made for the 3pt era because Steph is going to further make shooting 3s the most exciting talent to develop for kids. Might see most stars shooting 15-20 threes a game one day.
Understandable . At the same time I don't see Harden/Cp3 getting as much respect if they win last season aganst GS and get a ring or if it happens this year and breaks them up. I just see them being seen as a one off championship team. They'd have to repeat to truly get that all time level of respect where Harden makes his case for #3 SG of all time and CP3 gets his hardware to officially boost him over guys like GP,Stockton,Kidd and possibly secure#3 in front of Isiah and behind Curry and Magic
KD to NYK, then winning a ring as the #1 guy - even if Kyrie joins and Porzingis returns healthy and solid, would do wonders for KD's legacy. I'd still have some "hater" type thoughts, but most of my hater type thoughts come down to the fact that he's ultimately riding coattails while whining and crying and wanting to be viewed as if he isn't. The above scenario would change that.
Ya it's so hard to rank players like that especially across different generations. I gave up on that awhile back and just appreciate them for who they are.
Steph is already #2 greatest PG ever. No one is going to take you serious if you argue Isiah and Stockton are better PG. The only arguement you can make is, "he's not a real PG, he's a SG in a PG body." That's the only arguement you can make for him not to be #2 PG all time.
Top 15 right now. I think he has a good shot at Top 10 and move ahead of Oscar, Hakeem and Duncan on that top 10 list if he can stay healthy and they win some more rings. He seems to be getting better because he's getting stronger or the league has completely changed to his style of play. Rule changes, style change, everything is made for his style. Who would have thought? He's the most unlikely in that top 20 list. You got some guys that no one thought would be in that top 20 list like Dirk and Stockton(or top 30). He's taking 13 3's a game this year and hitting 52%. He would be shooting 60% from 3's if he didn't take 1 or 2 shots every game that's 40 ft plus
That's the weird part about rankings. you don't think Oscar is a PG?? You have Steph above him as PG already, but Oscar ahead in all time rankings?
Yeah he did. People hated him and then the narrative shifted not because he 'came home', but because he came back from down 3-1 in the NBA finals without homecourt advantage, against the best regular season team of all time. If he came back to Cleveland and won absolutely nothing he would never be in any serious discussion for GOAT status. Will KD's narrative change? Maybe, maybe not. I don't think so and I'm not sure what he needs to do for him to erase the stain of joining GSW to his legacy.
