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This is not a government of the people

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Sweet Lou 4 2, Oct 6, 2018.

  1. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    So you are dumb enough to believe anecdotal interviews posted on youtube rather than statistical data having more meaningful relevence.

    So basically you aren't worth debating with .
     
    #101 fchowd0311, Oct 8, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2018
    robbie380 and adoo like this.
  2. SugarLandFan

    SugarLandFan Member

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    all 'narra
    In the TL;DR era, all 'narratives' on discussion forums like this are necessarily piecemeal.

    I'm interested to learn more about the alleged increased targeting of illegal immigrants with children in comparison with illegal immigrants who have not brought children. Are there any reputable government or journalistic studies making such a comparison between the two groups? Incidentally, what is the detainment rate among illegal immigrants who aren't known to have brought children with them?

    Do the parents accept any responsibility for putting their children in this situation (by breaking the law and all)? I would think that even parents who are U.S. citizens and decide to commit a felony together must know that they are seriously jeopardizing their ability to continue living with their kids.
     
  3. adoo

    adoo Member

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    why not just deport those, as a unit, who you've detained.
    why make the extra effort of separating the children away from their parents

    since this act of cruelty was exposed,
    the Trump admin has reverted back to practice of detaining the adult/children as a unit
    suggest that you read the cruelty thread, http://bbs.clutchfans.net/index.php?threads/cruelty.291614/page-55#post-11917654, from page 55 on
     
    #103 adoo, Oct 8, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2018
  4. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    I see what you are doing. I chuckle with it.

    In all seriousness, I'm more concern with the lack of attention and the action to protect our voting machines and systems than Trump going completely rogue in 2020. The signs are clearly out and it's telling the world you are all welcome to come and mess with our election. Our voting machines, voting database are a weak point (extremely vulnerable) and it's criminal to not do anything to protect it. That to me is more concerning as it will put real doubt on any results going forward. Certain loser will use it. I don't expect Trump to take the risk of stopping an election, but if he lose, what does he have to lose by claiming the result is bogus and then try to hold onto power? Because we all *should* know an unethical, power hungry, dictator wanna-be will not blink at cheating, lying, and beyond to maintain power.
     
  5. SugarLandFan

    SugarLandFan Member

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    I'll read it, thanks.

    But right now, the Astros gotta sweep the Indians!
     
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  6. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    Lol what statistical evidence has been provided?

    And it isn’t like all those various opinions were for Trump or positive views of the US and Americans.

    Anyhow, Americans seem to think we matter a lot more to everyone else in the world than we actually do to them.
     
  7. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    robbie380 likes this.
  8. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Contributing Member

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    My wife has dual citizenship. She put in her vote yesterday in the Brazilian election. Since there is a runoff, she will have to vote again later this month (the guy in the lead for their Presidency makes Trump look like Jeb Bush).

    As a Brazilian, she is required by law to vote. No way in hell that would happen here for U.S. citizens. The party currently in power knows it would just kill them at the voting booth.

    Funny how you name Kamala Harris and Corey Booker as the cockroaches but, no, the GOP isn't racist. Nope. Not one bit.
     
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  9. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    I provided the YouTube clips from other media outside the US to get perspective on what people feel. You can get good perspective from interviews of people. Do you agree with that? Or were those media outlets not acceptable to you?

    There are excellent channels on YouTube that help give perspective from people all over the world. There is another great one for Japanese perspective on their culture if you want to check it out https://www.youtube.com/user/YPlusShow

    So with Israel what does it ultimately matter if they think he is a buffoon as long as he is boldly supporting them?

    My view of Trump is that if he keeps up the style of foreign policy that he has had so far then the world should be thankful. He would be the first president in my lifetime that didn’t get involved in major cowboy escapades with our military. Further he has avoided the neocon policies as well. I was afraid he would get sucked down that path. The track with North Korea is simply positive as well.

    And as I’ve said before, in general Americans hold a much higher opinion of ourselves and our value than other people in the world think of us. We get hyper focused on ourselves.
     
  10. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    I read thru it and yes I understand these things. However, what does it matter? The thread isn’t about American favorability in the world. Also if you are making the point about Russia then you have to at least acknowledge that the relationship has not continued down a positive path since this poll in 2017. Can we at least agree on that?
     
  11. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Yeah definitely, all they do is make it harder and harder to vote...

    Also, I've been reading about that guy...yeah...that's gonna be a yikes from me. Hopefully, he won't win and if he does then hopefully things won't get too bad.
     
  12. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Contributing Member

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    I don't want to derail the thread, which would involve us taking swipes back and forth with the Trumpanzees. But yes, Jair Bolsanaro (Brazilian Presidential candidate) is openly racist and homophobic, talks openly about killing criminals (no due process); he's a step toward Duterte from Trump. I don't know what the hell is happening in the world.
     
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  13. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Then what was the point of posting anecdotal videos?

    You think we believe there are zero Indians and Chinese in existence that like Trump?

    What point we're you trying to prove with those videos?

    Shall I say you are moving goal posts?
     
  14. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    He's definitely beating the war drums with Iran.

    We had a substantial nuclear deal with Iran with actual tangible enforcement mechanisms such as IAEA inspections and he tossed that away because "Obama did it".

    He will gladly go to war especially if it distracts Americans from the Mueller probe.

    The dude was boldly claiming that we should have military intervention in Venezuela.

    You are very naive if you believe Trump to be a principled man. He is continuing the same Middle Eastern policies of his predecessors. You think the drone strikes and selling arms to Saudi has magically vanished?

    Trump chosing John Bolton as his national security advisor should tell you everything about his "anti-neocon" polices.
     
  15. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    It seems to be a cycle I guess, we don't learn from history so we repeat it.

    Nothing I read about that guy was good news. The right wing populist movement is growing, that is true, but there's a lot of people that don't want it. We'll see what happens. I think a lot of people are frustrated and also scared that the world is going to leave them behind. A lot of these right wing populists are trying to hold on desperately to old ideals.
     
  16. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    Anecdotal? They are from media sites. Asian Boss does a lot of really good work.

    I’m not trying to prove anything. Did you watch them? They weren’t just pro Trump. I’m just saying that not everyone all over the world freaks out about Trump like he gets portrayed over here in America.
     
  17. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Yes they are anecdotal. Individual Asians speaking about Trump is anecdotal. It doesn't matter where the source is from. That isn't statistical evidence.

    It's purely anecdotal. I can find youtube videos of Jewish people embracing Nazis. You can find individual cases of people stating any opinion. That is why anecdotal stories don't paint a macro picture. That's why institutions like Pew Research Center exist.
     
    #117 fchowd0311, Oct 8, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2018
  18. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    He is trying to break down Iran thru economics primarily and using the same tough talk tactics he used with North Korea. We will see if it works. I think American foreign policy with Iran has been a disaster forever. I appreciated Obama’s more relaxed tone towards Iran. I don’t think Iran has ever seriously worked towards developing a nuke since the Islamic Republic has been in control.

    And seriously calm down with the going to war conspiracy theory if he wanted to use war to distract from anything domestic then he would have already done so at this point. For what it’s worth I think this view of Trump helps him out to a degree.

    With Venezuela I think you’d probably find that a lot of Venezuelans would love it if Trump teamed up with the Colombians and took out Maduro. I’m glad that report got floated out there to get Maduro’s worthless ass on the defensive. That said he won’t sent the US military down there to get involved but he will continue the same tactics he has used with Iran and North Korea. Did you think the sanctions against Maduro’s inner circle were dangerous? What about Trump seeming to have a pretty good meeting with the Colombian President? They kind of seem to be on the same page. The other South American nations around Venezuela are getting tired of Maduro’s ****. I think Trump has shown restraint and a willingness to act and let Maduro know that his **** can’t go on forever. Hell he also said he was even willing to talk with him. Was that dangerous?

    Did I said Trump was principled? And yes I know the US continues it’s activities in the Middle East and that we still have a zombie military intervention going on in Yemen that started under Obama. It’s a proxy war that the Saudis have against the Iranians. We have consistently been on the Saudis side since the overthrow of the Shah. Sorry if you mistook my statements to seem as if I thought America had stopped all miltlary activities in the world under Trump.

    We will see where things end up but overall I see a positive trajectory with Trump’s foreign policy. Maybe I’m just a keg half full type of guy.

    So is there anything I’ve said that you agree with? Or are we only playing the game where we have to disagree with each other?
     
  19. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/12/world/americas/trump-venezuela-military.html

    Calling Trump restrained is pretty hilarious. He's the most impulsive President in American history.

    Do you understand that the North Koreans have desired to meet every former recent US President to have an air of legitimatecy? So when Trump received the call that that Kim wants to meet with Trump, due to his naivness and impulsive nature he immediately thought he did something different instead of the reality being that this is something that the NK dictator has wanted for a while.

    Trump's only motive to dismantle the Iran deal was from a motivation that it was a Obama deal. Nothing less, nothing more. That deal had nothing to do with Iranian's military influence on the Middle East. It had everything to do with mitigating another North Korean type state where they become pretty much untouchable because they are armed with nuclear weapons. That deal had actual tangible methods for verification from the IAEA.

    Sanctions will do nothing besides agitate the actual moderate citizens of Iran who don't hate the West but if their economic futere is bleak, Iranian leadership will have more clout over it's citizens to be even more hostile towards the West esoecisesp when the lead Western power tore up a deal between them.

    Yes I vehemently disagree. I disagree that this child like mind should be incharge of the world's largest bureaucracy and commanding the world's most powerful military .
     
    #119 fchowd0311, Oct 8, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2018
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  20. Gdaliya

    Gdaliya Member

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    Well i don't wanna hijack the thread to much but i agree that Jair is more Duterte than Trump.
    I've also seen some comparisons to Sisi from Egypt, although it's a bit to far in my opinion.
    But it's not only the personal success he had in the presidency race that is surprising, his party success in the lower house election is incredible.

    You can see the right wing populist successes around the world, even in surprising country's like Sweden and i see some of it even in Belgium.
     
    JayGoogle likes this.

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