Why would the Rockets want Ray Allen when Cuttino provides an excellent scorer at shooting guard already? Rasheed Wallace is a bad person. There's no point bringing him in the pollute the locker room. Tinsley? I don't know. He doesn't make that much money, so I don't even know how the Rockets even get him. Jermaine O'Neal? Keep wishing. Al Harrington? He make around $5.5 million. Is he even on the trading block? Jeff McInnis is a bad person. Luke Ridnour makes rookie salary money, and he plays a decent point guard. I doubt the Sonics will be letting him go. Steve Francis for Lewis and Barry? Brent Barry is a better playmaker than Steve is. I doubt either of them would be traded by the Sonics.
My thinking is that unless you can get a frontline PG (ie Kidd, Marbury, etc) then look for a good perimeter option to really loosen up the offense. A player that can consistently score from the perimeter but without needing excessive one on one type situations. Essentially someone that is effective off the ball and can consistently hit shots in the offensive flow ie Allan Houston, Ray Allen, Rashard Lewis even Michael Redd. JVG was able to effectively handle Sprewell and Houston in NY so I dont really see an issue with Mobley and Allen or Mobley and Houston on the perimeter. In addition to that, I would consider players that can fill roles in terms of getting the team in the offense and pushing the ball on the break. Also, if a tough role player at the PF spot could be included in a package ie. Kurt Thomas who can score reasonably ok with being able to grab double digit boards that would help also. Clearly it would be tough to find a deal that would fill all of these holes but if atleast 2 of them can be filled that would be great. That being said, the deals I would consider are as follows: New York Knicks: Allan Houston, Kurt Thomas, Charlie Ward, Othella Harrington for Steve Francis, Mo Taylor (This deal is the only one I can think of that would fill basically all the needs of this team and provide the type of players JVG is used to coaching.) ------------------------- Seattle Sonics: Rashard Lewis OR Ray Allen plus Brent Barry for Steve Francis ------------------------- Golden State: Jason Richardson, Nick Van Exel for Steve Francis (Jason Richardson is not the established, efficient scoring threat in terms of FG and 3 pt pct that Allan Houston, Ray Allen or Rashard Lewis are, but I would still give this consideration b/c Richardson has tons of upside and Van Exel has really become a savvy PG over the last few seasons.)
where can the Knicks sign up, do the knicks have to take us for dinner and movie before they screw us that good. with give away the best player in the lot and receive back a larger bunch of ordinary players with ordinary contracts than with give away.....
My first proposal had Knicks including their 2004 1st round draft pick too. If the Knicks don't make the playoffs, it will be a lottery pick.
Has anyone looked at where Tim Duncan signed? With his old team, the Spurs. How about Jason Kidd? Jermaine Oneal? Kevin Garnett? Cap space can get you some mid level players, but seldom very good players. In your senario, we'd trade Steve for some mediocre player, so we could have cap space in 2 years to sign some other mediocre players. We have to trade Steve for someone better or potentially better, not a bunch of role players.
I like your Knicks trade since it also gives the Rockets cap room after 2 seasons. Ray Allen makes even more money than Francis. I think he's overpaid. He makes Kobe and Tracy McGrady money without being at their level. I think the Sonics really want frontcourt players. They've really got nothing upfront. If the Rockets traded Yao to them, Sonics will give up anyone on their roster. That's not going to happen unless Les Alexander gets a brain freeze. Golden State isn't trading for any player with a contract extend beyond Yao's contract year. They are cap planning for Yao.
Houston is a good destination. It's not Los Angeles or Chicago, but it's a big city. Many free agents like this aspect for commercial reasons. Many of the great players in the league have exit clauses. I think having cap room is better than not having cap room unless the team has demonstrated it can win with the guys on the roster already.
If a championship team with Tim Duncan on it can't get anyone better than Rasho, what makes you think Houston can do any better? The best free agent we've got in recent memory is MoT. Cap space is better than no cap space, but it's not worth giving up good players. Trading Francis for cap space is absurd.
You've got a point if there are no good free agents coming onto the market after 2005-2006. From a business point of view, I think Les Alexander will want to pay less money if he is going to get the same old lottery year after year. I would really like them go to the playoffs to dispel the idea that this team can't succeed. However, the roster should be burned down if they don't make the playoffs.
It looks like there are problems in the motor city, and with Larry Brown's history of tinkering I wouldn't be surprised if they decided to make a move. How about: Francis for Chauncey Billups Mehmet Okur Billups makes like half the money of Francis and has made a number of clutch shots in the playoffs. And he's already shown in the past few years, first with Carlisle and now Brown, that he can play within a system. Okur is very fluid with his game (not a stiff at all), has good shooting touch, and is a solid rebounder. The only reservation I'd have about this move is that Okur might blow up Arenas style and we wouldn't have the cap room to resign him. But in the current business climate of the NBA, a full middle exception is still a pretty big contract offer. If this deal went down, that would allow us to deal either Cato or Motay, who have value to a team either looking for a legit center that can rebound and play defense or a pretty good frontcourt scorer. My dream trade would be: Cato Moochie for Al Harrington Scott Pollard Jamal Tinsley My rationalization is that Indy would get a legit center to put next to Oneal, and that they don't have any decent pgs on their roster. Not that I'm saying that Moochie is a decent pg, but I'm pretty sure from the national perspective our players have more trade value than this board thinks they do. That being said, it's still a major longshot to expect Indy to pull the trigger on that trade. But imagine what the team would look like: Billups-----Tinsley Mobes-------Pike JJ----------Harrington Okur--------Motay Yao---------Pollard It may not be the flashiest team in the league. But I'm telling you, this would be a solid, effective group. It'll probably never happen, but if I was the GM, I'd love to put this group together. Aw hell, I've come this far, I might as well put the finishing touch on my dream team. If I've constructed this lineup so far, the last thing I would do is trade: Motay Amaechi for Brent Barry Potapenko We move Motay's contract and bring in another non-spectacular solid guard, and a hustling pf. So this would be my dream lineup, if I was CD: Billups------Barry--------Tinsley Mobes--------Pike JJ-----------Harrington Okur---------Harrington---Potapenko Yao----------Pollard We got veterens in Barry and JJ. Good outside shooters in Billups, Mobes, Pike. Talented big guys with a lot of potential Okur and Harrington. A couple of serviceable backup big men in Potapenko and Pollard. And a center with the potential to be a dominating player. And the best thing is, there are no huge long term contracts left. Imagine having a fiscally responsible team instead of being loaded down with albatross contracts. I guess that's what makes these moves so unrealistic. I guess I was right the first time, "It'll never happen." Well there goes my post for the month. Time to quit dreaming and get back to lurking.
The Pacers trade is intriguing. Pacers need a center. Carlisle is a defensive coach, and Cato is a defensive center. Al Harrington does not start, but I think he might start on the Rockets. Scott Pollard can play backup center and PF. Tinsley would be a better backup PG than Moochie.
If we can trade Steve for NVE and JRich I am all for it. But seriously, I looked at every team and I can't come up with anything that did't seem way too homerish. Basicaly if we trade Steve we can forget about getting a top PG in return. If we trade Steve we should be looking for a great 3 or 4 and try to limp along at the PG spot, which might turn out to be ok but it won't be ok this season.
I like this trade in the sense that (a) it is a change, and that could be good and (b) I agree with the opinion the Okur will only keep getting better in this league. It may not be that useful, though, as Billups essentially plays the same role as Francis, only not as well. Billups isn't a true point guard either. I don't know the dynamics of the salary cap well enough, but would anybody be interested in trading Francis + Mobley to Milwaukee for Michael Redd and T.J. Ford Or how about a Francis for Marbury type swap - I think Marbury is clearly the better player - it is disturbing that his teams never win and he is always traded, though. I think any Jermaine Oneal scenarios are pipedreams. Maybe him and Carlisle don't get along all that well, but there is that 18-6 record that says it doesn't matter too much at this point. Other than that, I think many of the potential trade partners have been discussed ad naseum
But like I said, Billups has been able to play within a system for three years now, something that Francis is still having trouble with. Also Billups is signed to a 6 year 33 million dollar deal, while Francis is locked up for 6 years at 80+ million dollars. Well I'd do this trade without thinking twice, but I can't imagine that this would happen. It's funny because I just noticed the other day that even though Stephon is an 8 year veteren, he's still only 26 just like SF. In fact, Marbury and Francis were actually born one day apart. Spooky.
That trade has been presented to Milwaukee Buck message boards at ESPN.com. No Bucks fan thinks that a deal the Bucks would do. That may not be what the GM thinks, but it's a slice of their collective fan thinking.
Maybe Brad Miller did not get along with Jermaine. I don't see the reasoning why they let him go for basically nothing.
Interesting...I think it's a good deal from both ends - I guess it depends how much value you put on T.J. Ford.
