Not to add fuel to this fire, but one of the most evil things I've done recently involved having beers at an SF bar, talking with some friends of friends who are past glynch on the left-o-meter. One of them (again, not my friends directly, mind you) was going on about Bush being involved in 9-11 planning, and I said "I've read that he really wasn't on airforce one. He may have actually been piloting one of the planes. You know he can fly a plane, right? ... after his service an all when he was younger." This person was ready to accept this, so I went on. "Yes, apparently there was enough time for him to leap from the first plane, parachute down, and have enough time for a special stealth plane to place him in the cockpit of the 2nd plane." That's when she figured out that I was being a jerk. I think I read this joke (Bush in both planes) on this BBS originally or maybe I posted it or somebody else or whatever. Good god do I ever derail threads.
OK, I take back my previous part (except for the friends part) 1. I've never posted an article or implied that the Administration was behind 9/11. 2. There are unanswered questions and as long as the administration goes to great lengths to withhold documents that may shed light on what was known at the time and given their history of opposition to even the most perfunctory of investigations, it is entirely logical to assume they screwed up in some way. That is not to say they could have prevented it, but at a minimum aren't we, as Americans, owed an investigation into the worst terrorist act in history? Aren't the families who lost loved ones deserving of the truth? Doesn't allowing the WH to redact documents before turning them over to the 9/11 Commission raise some concern? If that's a conspiratorial stance, I'm guilty I guess. 3. I hadn't heard that one. Maybe if the loser Dems in Congress quit rolling over for Bush and start an investigation we'll know the truth.
I agree 100-percent. Having a healthy skepticism of authority and government is probably the most important trait an American can have. But dismissing an idea as a "conspiracy theory" is just as silly as dismissing an idea that's "government-approved." Judge each fact and idea on their own merit, and you won't have to worry about such labels.
I finally got around to reading this thread. I can't argue with rimrocker here, Max. The White House hasn't cooperated in any investigation of 9/11 that I've heard of... not one worth mentioning. (have I missed one?) About Clark and "the generals", I'm not at all surprised that 2 retired generals who lean towards the other party (maybe "lean" isn't strong enough) would take cheap shots at Clark. Service rivalry is as old as military service. I think we're seeing some of that carried over into the public lives of these 3 men, all of whom served with distinction. It's pretty easy to make personal attacks and then not back up what you're saying with facts. I had read about Shelton back when he first made those remarks. None of this is really new. In my opinion, the writers for The New Yorker and U.S. News both had agendas, but that's politics. Fred Kaplan's article in Slate sounds much more believable to me. Someone will probably say he has an agenda. Maybe it's putting some light on the truth. If it's politics, then again, it's what I find believable. Clark's problem is that he isn't a politician. He's very familiar with politics in the military, but he's learning as he goes about the politics of running for public office... in his case, the highest we've got. I find his lack of political polish refreshing. Whether it will get him the nomination remains to be seen.
Most of these were gathered together by someone who posted them weeks back on the general blog running at the Clark official web site. I added a few more that I had pulled off the open letters written to Clark during the Draft Clark days. Sorry if the formats differ, and I warn you, this is a long post. But all of it involves comments made by people who worked with Clark in the military. Gerry Smith, West Point Classmate Gerry SMITH continues to send occasional emails from the Balkans and recently made some observations that are quite laudatory of Wes CLARK. " As I travel around Kosovo and visit business owners and presidents, so many have calendars, posters and photos with Wes Clark's visage in their offices. While they speak with respect of the Clintons, Holbrookes, and Walkers, they speak with awe and reverence for Wes. I am always treated nicely by those I visit. Invariably, in the small talk that follows, Wes Clark comes up and I mention that we were in the same West Point class. From that point on, I am treated like royalty even though I point out that I knew him very little. You would think I was the hero. I am certain they go home that night to tell the family they met somebody that knew Wesley Clark." (http://www.washingtonpost.com, By Vernon Loeb,Washington Post Staff Writer, Wednesday, September 17, 2003; Page A01) “Army Col. Douglas Macgregor .... An author and strategist who has also had his fights with the Army brass, Macgregor said he will forever be indebted to Clark for taking a chance and naming him as director of planning at NATO headquarters in Belgium in 1997: "There is this aspect of his character -- he is loyal to people he knows are capable and competent," Macgregor said. "As for his peers, it's a function of jealousy and envy, and it's a case of misunderstanding. General Clark is an intense person, he's passionate, and certainly the military is suspicious of people who are intense and passionate. He is a complex man who does not lend himself to simplistic formulations. But he is very competent, and devoted to the country." (http://www.washingtonpost.com, (By Vernon Loeb,Washington Post Staff Writer, Wednesday, September 17, 2003; Page A01)”William J. Perry, who as deputy defense secretary first encountered Clark in 1994 when he was a three-star general on the Joint Staff. "I was enormously impressed by him," said Perry, a mathematician and legendary Pentagon technologist who later served as secretary of defense under Clinton. Perry was so impressed, in fact, that with Clark facing retirement unless a four-star job could be found for him, Perry overrode the Army and insisted that Clark be appointed head of the U.S. Southern Command, one of the military's powerful regional commanders in chief, or CINCs. "I was never sorry for that appointment," Perry said. www.veteransforclark.com (Chuck Smith, Command Sergeant Major – Army, City - Clay Center, Kansas)“I am writing this not only to let General Clark know that he has my support, but to let whom ever reads this understand what makes Wes Clark tick. I have known General Clark professionally since he was a Major in Bamberg Germany and I was a Staff Sergeant. I had the privilege to serve with him two more times at Ft Carson Colorado when he was a Brigade XO and then when he was a Battalion Commander. The man is a brilliant leader! He does not make rash decisions. He checks out every option. He listens to his subordinates but asks them the hard questions and then checks out his options again. He is a true professional. If he was in the White House the American public would feel secure in knowing that the decisions he would make would have their best interests in mind. He is a true patriot! What he does and what he says is how he feels about this country and the future of it. He will think about the little guy just as he used to think about the young soldier in that tank engaging the enemy, and what that soldier would have to deal with because of his decision. Wes Clark is the right man for the job!” Forrest (Bill) Hilbish, CW04 (Retired), US Navy, Mogadore, Ohio, 1975-1999 Comments - I worked for General Clark while stationed at SCJ6 Current Operations Branch for USSOUTHCOM in Panama. He was an excellent leader and commander. My wife was impressed by the fact that even though there were hundreds of officers working for him, he knew both of our names. He replaced General Barry McCaffrey (Drug Czar for Clinton). I am a Republican but I would vote for the "ONE" Democrat. Good luck General... Louie Yepez, SPC, ARMY, Long Beach, California. 1997-Present Comments - I first saw Gen. Clark when I was in Bosnia in 1999 and he spoke to us in a theater. I always felt he had strong leadership qualities, which is why i will support him for 2004! Thnak you. Sam Closkey, Rank - LTC – Army, City - Palm City, FL, 1966-1986 I worked with General Clark at the National Training Center. I always thought he would be an excellent president. He was the easiest guy to work for, smart, appreciative, confident and he really cared about people. I am a registered republican, but he's got my vote. How can I help? T. Ryan, Rank – SSgt, USMC, City – Boston, Ma, 80-84 87-2003 Comments - Prior to joining the Marines I was a 17 year old Soldier in the 1st Bn 77th Armor 4th ID. Then LtCol Clark was my Bn Commander. I can honestly say he was top notch, very well respected by Enlisted and Officers a like and lerned a lifetime of respect from myself. A true Soldiers Soldier. Thanks for everything Sir and Semper Fidelis. "I have watched him at close range for 35 years, in which I have looked at the allegation, and I found it totally unsupported," said retired Gen. Barry R. McCaffrey, who taught with Clark at West Point in the 1970s. "That's not to say he isn't ambitious and quick. He is probably among the top five most talented I've met in my life. I think he is a national treasure who has a lot to offer the country." http://www.azstarnet.com/vote/31012nClark-Military.html"Look, for 34 years when there was a tough problem the local leadership asked Wes Clark to take on the problem," McCaffrey said. "This guy has been incredibly successful at doing the country's business." http://www.azstarnet.com/vote/31012nClark-Military.html "Two other retired lieutenant generals who worked with Clark, Dan Christman and Don Kerrick, said friction involving Clark was to be expected as he tried to balance the interests of NATO allies and the United States. "We knew that he was a man of his word and that he would deliver what we expected," said Kerrick, who was deputy national security adviser to President Clinton when Clark was at NATO. Colonel David Hackworth (www.clarkmyths.com) “At the interview, Clark came along without the standard platoon of handlers and treated the little folks who poured the coffee and served the bacon and eggs with exactly the same respect and consideration he gave the biggies in the dining room...” Military Support from the Draft days: FirstName: Tony LastName: Jones City: Mandeville State: LA Date: 09/13/2003 Time: 09:42 PM Comments Dear Sirs, As a former military officer myself and having served under Clark, I can attest to the fact that Mr. Clark is a strong leader and a truly innovative thinker. Not afraid to make decisions but wise in mechanics of diplomacy as well. I applaud his stance and feel that as any American, he has the right to question the current administration and it’s policies. As a member of the military you do not enjoy these rights only the heavy often dangerous burden of protecting them. My hats off to him and any other American who has the courage to be a free thinker and not ignorantly mimic those who choose to use political spin to support a very flawed policy for the US. I fully support Mr. Clark’s ability and his courage to take a stand for what many millions of Americans believe in but are afraid to express – a strong nation with a solid foundation capable of operating with tact and discretion a global society. I am disgusted with the current administrations tactic of wrapping their poor decisions in an American flag and declaring those who challenge them as unpatriotic. How dare them and any other citizen who is a true American to believe that free speech is something to be suppressed. I, like Mr. Clark and millions of others, have spent a large portion of our adult lives defending this great nation and it’s constitution and fully support the right of each and every American to express his or her rights of free speech. Good or bad, pleasant or not, these rights are what make this country great. I and all my friends will be behind Mr. Clark should he decide to make this very important decision, one which I know will be of great benefit to this country and the entire world. FirstName: Frank LastName: Adams City: Spanish Fort State: AL Date: 09/12/2003 Time: 09:57 AM Comments General Clark was my last boss in the Army. He was the J-5. I never worked harder, but it was clear that what he had us doing was important. He is the smartest, fairest man I have spent time around. If he runs, it will be for the good of the country, not for any type of self aggrandizement. I am prepared to actively work for his election. I am also pledging $500 to his campaign. General, duty is calling you once again. Please answer the call. FirstName: Angelo Ray (GSE-15 CIV/COL) KFOR LastName: GALAS City: New York State: NY Date: 09/15/2003 Time: 09:14 PM Comments General Clark, America needs you. Please run for president. I served with you in Albania and Kosovo, first as part of TF Hawk, then into KFOR. I'd like to "meet up," with fellow supporters at the New York Athletic Club, which I think would be a great venue, no host. Keep me posted. You're a leader and a true hero, our military, our citizenry, deserve an intelligent, experienced, multilateralist to lead. You and your family will make a great First Family and I'd be honored to serve you again. Very Respectfully, /s/ Ray Galas Commissioner City and County of Honolulu (Now resident of New York City.)
