I seriously don't think he's "protesting" because of slaves in America nowadays like that Nike Situation... ------------------
fro, you're right. i'm done til the morning. peace, blessings and light to everyone (fro, curly, chenzhen, and lurkers alike)
Now that you put it that way, I can kind of see where he's coming from then if that's the case...the way it was put out by the media, I get the feeling its all about hate... ------------------
Goodnight verse...hope your pillow is soft.... j/k ------------------ In the end there will be no judges...only witnesses to my greatness.
Probably for the same reason a lot of us wish we could change things we've done in the past. Or the same reason a lot of us have changed as we got older. He also wasn't the same person he was at LSU. Didn't he convert to Islam (or was it the Nation of Islam?) after leaving LSU? He changed his name from "Chris Jackson" after LSU. ------------------ "what if my aunt had balls?" -- in one fell swoop, bbs member verse expresses his dislike of "what if" scenarios and shows he has far too much idle time on his hands.
I know people change but he played several years under adul rauf in denver and he didn't do this sort of thing...I kind of overreacted at first, partly due to the media misleading the public, partly do to me being a little naive on the subject...Its clear to me now on his stance...its legit... ------------------
Oopps! Sorry I asked ------------------ "I think the people who believed the world was flat were pretty stupid. You would think at least those living near mountains would know better." - P. Mesku
here are my two cents I am a white man, i heard alot of cold war propaganda, I am a fairly patriotic guy. I think that all of americas citizens should speak english, but should keep their other ethnic traditions. they should theach their childern their native tongue. they should become americans, and not just stay as chinese(for example) living in America. with all that being said I Have always tried avoiding being Ignorant by using a little common sense. I dont care if you piss on the flag, burn it, grab your crotch during the anthem, whatever. I found the t-shirts(printed during desert sheild) more offensive for having flags with the phraise "try to burn this flag" on them. I dont want ignorant red-necks wearing th flag and spouting off racial epitafs like "lets kill some towlheads" representing my country. Just like I am sure most libyans were pissed at their ignorant countrymen burning the american flag infront of the embasey on television every night. hell im sure they were real pissed when they were bombed. what rauf did was commendable. he brought some thought to the public attention. he also set an NBA record in the process(free throw %) what the media did was disrespfull. we think that just because he is muslim he is not american. damn this country is so inbedded with cristian beleifs that I am amazed that other countried fell safe living here. religion is in our anthem, on our currency, governs our national hollidays, and now it is in out whitehouse. people freaked out about him not standing as though he was burning the flag in the middle east. well to be quite honest america has been very aniti muslim for decades. his protest was fair. the people burning flags in the street are also being fair. why the hell are we messing with those countries anyway. why have we supported anti muslim puppet governments in places like Lebenon and Turkey. hell if i were them I would burn the flag too. "one nation under god" it dosnt say one nation under Allah, or buddah, or any of the other religions of the world. can you blame a Muslim for not pledging alegiance to another mans god?? peace ------------------ Hanta-Force Paintball www.hanta-force.com
The great thing about the U.S. is that our government allows freedom of expression. You have that right as well as I. But let's be smart. I bet you an overwhelming majority of citizens have respect and pride to live in the U.S. Is this country free from murder, rape, bigotry, racism, etc? Does Government screw people? Let me tell you secret ALL GOVERNMENT in the world screws people, but they do it much worse! Don't believe me? Go live their a while and tell the King that he is a b*stard. Burn their flag. After that not only will you be dead, but they will have your mutilated corpse pictured on a stamp (as another country has done to a U.S. military serviceman). How is that for expression! A bit more on topic, the U. S. remains the best place to live despite the evils out there. I guess you could say this country is the lesser of a whole bunch of evil countries. Now knowing this...How can someone not stand as respect to the symbol of our great nation? Yes, you don't have to, and as a matter of fact it should not matter if others are offended. But just what is the NBA? It's a for profit business in the entertainment segment. Who are your customers? Well mainly U.S. citizens! How do most U.S. citizens feel about their country? Do you see where I'm going with this? Let's not be naive. It just doesn’t make business sense for a player to do such a thing and obviously this movement didn’t last… In light of fairness, I acknowledge a person’s right to expression and not care who gets offended just as I will proudly wear shirts with a pic of the flag stating: “try and burn this flag” and not give a rat’s sunshiny ass who gets offended. GOD bless America! ------------------ Sometimes you gotta do the next best thing!
I was wondering what Wink and Cat were up to too. Rule out the conclusion that they're of another religion, because I know for a fact Francis is a Christian, and I'm pretty sure Mobley is too. Personally, I think they are bowing, to God, America, whatever. ------------------ The best is yet to come. Go Rockets!
we are reeeeaaaallllly searching for somethin' to b**** about aren't we? ------------------ C-son _ __________ _ !Viva La' Dream!
Good question Jeff! When I started this thread I thought there would be a simple answer to a simple question. The last thing I was looking for was a history lesson on Abdul-Rauf or a political debate. I truly suspect that there is a simple, reasonable answer to this question and quite honestly I'm shocked no one seems to have it! ------------------
Well, let me throw in a real wishy-washy sounding two cents. People should be allowed to protest their own country however they see fit (as long as it is legal, I mean)...But, by doing so, they should realize it also affects the emotions of other people. Should it? I dont know, but it does. So I think people should be allowed to protest, but other people should also have the right to criticize that person or be offended by his actions. National symbols represent different things to different people. And every person has had a different set of experiences and perspectives (which is one thing that I really like about this country - we can all learn from each other)... We should make an effort to understand why a person is doing what he is doing - whether it be the protester or the criticizer. But people certainly have a right to disagree with each other...our different perspectives and backgrounds can be this country's greatest strength if we dont allow it to tear us apart. So how bout them rockets? ------------------ "I think the people who believed the world was flat were pretty stupid. You would think at least those living near mountains would know better." - P. Mesku
It's hypocrisy to not salute the flag of a country that pays you big bucks? They don't just give you money, you EARN it! And I don't have a problem with Abdul-Rauf's protest, because this is the same country that has racism, sexism, murders, rapes, violent crimes, the government screwing over people, poor people, screwed up legal systems, extortion, the "Good ol' boys networks", and other garbage like that. Don't have a problem at all. As for Cuttino Mobley and Steve Francis, that stance you saw them doing, I saw Michael Jordan do that all the time. The players are stretching, and focusing. ------------------ Dream a deadly Dream. . .
BadKnees, The answer to your question from Steve himself. From ESPN.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/clubhouse?team=hou) : -------------------------------------- Pair mean no offense during anthem It's been a few years since the NBA has had a national anthem controversy. Apparently, Rockets guards Steve Francis and Cuttino Mobley do not remember the experience of former Nuggets and current Grizzlies guard Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf, who used to stage a one-man protest of the national anthem before the criticism of the practice became too much to bear. According to the Houston Chronicle, Francis and Mobley have been criticized – as well as supported – for their practice of bowing during the anthem. Each player claims that he is not making a statement of any kind with the habit. "I just say my prayers," Francis said. "I pay my respects to my family, focus in on the game and pray for the outcome of the game, that no one gets hurt." Francis maintains it is not a statement. "It's not that at all. I've been doing that since my first preseason game." Mobley also contends that he means no disrespect. "Some people must have a guilty conscience about something," he said. "Whoever said that is being stupid. I don't mean any offense, none at all, whatsoever." ------------------ "I was arrested for sexual assault involving an elderly man and I was out in 35 minutes." -- Achebe - programmer by day, geriatric ass grabber by night. As(s?) a side note, he did state he was cleared of charges.
