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Howard Dean's Candidacy Reeling from Racial Remark

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by El_Conquistador, Sep 10, 2003.

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  1. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    Yet another severe blow to the credibility of Howard Dean:


    CNN
    WASHINGTON (AP) -- Democrat Howard Dean's claim that he is the only white politician who talks about race to white audiences drew criticism Wednesday from one of his presidential rivals. Sen. John Edwards said the entire field discusses racial issues on the campaign trail.

    "I think what Howard Dean said last night does a disservice to everyone he stood next to and all the people before us who have raised this issue over and over again in front of all audiences," the North Carolina lawmaker said one day after the nine candidates debated in Baltimore.

    Dean, defending himself against criticism that his supporters are mostly white, told the predominantly black debate crowd, "I'm the only white politician that ever talks about race in front of white audiences."

    Dean was wrong.

    Edwards urges racial tolerance in nearly ever speech he gives on the campaign trail, including addresses to white crowds. Sen. Joe Lieberman of Connecticut talks about his efforts as a student during the 1960s civil rights movement. Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts has discussed race and its role in his Vietnam service.

    "What he said last night was divisive and divisive is exactly what we're trying to overcome. He's right about one thing, politicians should talk about civil rights wherever they go. And in the future, I hope he leads by example instead of by attack," Edwards said in a telephone interview.

    "Sen. Lieberman marched with Martin Luther King. Sen. Kerry talks about his experience in Vietnam. I grew up in the segregated South. Fighting for civil rights is part of who I am which is why I talked about it in front of every audience and whoever I'm with," he said.

    The North Carolina lawmaker had avoided attacking his rivals until Wednesday, but his criticism is another sign that Dean's eight rivals are throwing elbows at the front-runner in an effort to force their way to the front.

    In previous appearances together, the candidates have looked more like a ragtag team of underdogs hankering to make the big leagues and take on President Bush. The sharpest barbs have been aimed at the president, while the candidates largely have avoided challenging each other by name.

    Not so Tuesday night at a debate sponsored by the Congressional Black Caucus. Some of the sharpest exchanges were between front-runner Dean and Lieberman, the Democratic vice presidential nominee in 2000.

    Lieberman said comments Dean made last week about the Middle East "break a 50-year record in which presidents, Republicans and Democrats, members of Congress of both parties have supported our relationship with Israel."

    The former Vermont governor responded that his position was the same as former President Clinton's, and Lieberman, who is Jewish, interrupted by saying, "Not right ... not right."

    "It doesn't help, Joe, to demagogue this issue," Dean replied.

    And so the gloves were off.

    Several other Democrats said Lieberman's performance illustrated why his rivals shied away from attacking Dean, even at the risk of allowing Dean to build on the momentum he developed over the summer.

    "It basically sounded shrill to me," said Joe Shanahan, veteran Democratic activist in Iowa. "Lieberman didn't make his point well, and Dean responded strongly."

    One candidate who didn't take on Dean was the one who may be most threatened by him, Kerry. Dean has taken over Kerry's early lead in the early primary state of New Hampshire. Kerry has decided not to go negative now, although some of his supporters and even some advisers have been pressing him to do so.

    The debate was at Morgan State University, a historically black college, and the Democrats took pains to stress their support for civil rights and other concerns to blacks -- although Al Sharpton said black voters shouldn't allow themselves to be taken for granted.

    "We need to correct the party so we can beat Bush with one expanded pie," he said in remarks critical of what he sees as Democratic inattentiveness to black concerns.

    But international affairs dominated the debate. It opened with questions on Iraq, and some of the candidates tried to maintain their focus on Bush by criticizing his handling of the postwar reconstruction.

    But those who opposed Bush's attack on Iraq put some of the blame on their fellow Democratic candidates who voted for the war resolution -- Kerry, Lieberman, Sen. John Edwards of North Carolina and Missouri Rep. Dick Gephardt.

    Without mentioning any names, Sen. Bob Graham of Florida said they handed Bush "a blank check." Former Illinois Sen. Carol Moseley Braun said they gave the president "the right to go on a free-for-all."

    Sharpton threw one of Gephardt's favorite lines -- that Bush's foreign policy is a "miserable failure" -- back at him and the other war supporters.

    "I've never heard of people acting like they didn't know we needed an exit when we gave him an entrance," Sharpton said. "That is a miserable failure for us to allow this president to play these kinds of games."
     
    #1 El_Conquistador, Sep 10, 2003
  2. Friendly Fan

    Friendly Fan PinetreeFM60 Exposed

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    OMG!

    this is the end of civilization as we know it


    Thanks, Chicken Little!
     
    #2 Friendly Fan, Sep 10, 2003
  3. johnheath

    johnheath Member

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    This is EXACTLY the kind of mindless remark that Howard Dean produces time and time again. He is not Presidential material.
     
    #3 johnheath, Sep 10, 2003
  4. Oski2005

    Oski2005 Member

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    Wouldn't you guys be posting such remarks if they did indeed happen time and time again.
     
    #4 Oski2005, Sep 10, 2003
  5. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Member
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    A candidate claiming that he tackles issues of race and that other candidates don't hardly seem out of place. I'm curious how Dean is reeling from his statements?

    He appears to still be the front runner.

    And if that kind of talk is somehow not presidential material, I think it pales in comparison to making an appearence at Bob Jones University.
     
    #5 FranchiseBlade, Sep 10, 2003
  6. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    It is nice to know that this is the kind of stuff that T_J has to cling to when trying to criticize the challengers for King George's throne.

    I guess if you make up a nasty headline, it doesn't matter what the article actually says, many people will just bite on the headline. LOL
     
    #6 GladiatoRowdy, Sep 10, 2003
  7. GreenVegan76

    GreenVegan76 Member

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    Dean said he was tackling the race issue?! He should drop out immediately!
     
    #7 GreenVegan76, Sep 10, 2003
  8. B-Bob

    B-Bob "94-year-old self-described dreamer"
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    Man oh man, T_J really is desperate. This article is absolutely nothing.

    There's no "reeling," not even the suckers T_J is trying to reel into the thread.

    There's no "racial remark." There is an exchange of remarks about who makes honorable, righteous remarks on race in America. Ooooooooo! Controversy!

    Hilarious. Once again, Dean continues to effortlessly complete sentences each time he speaks, all while not looking like Curious George, doubly striking fear into the hearts of all Bush supporters. ;)
     
    #8 B-Bob, Sep 10, 2003
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2003
  9. GreenVegan76

    GreenVegan76 Member

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    I know what you mean...

    "One of the interesting initiatives we've taken in Washington, D.C., is we've got these vampire-busting devices. A vampire is a—a cell deal you can plug in the wall to charge your cell phone."—Denver, CO. Aug. 14, 2001

    "We spent a lot of time talking about Africa, as we should. Africa is a nation that suffers from incredible disease."--After meeting with the leaders of the European Union, Gothenburg, Sweden, June 14, 2001

    "It's very important for folks to understand that when there's more trade, there's more commerce."--Quebec City, Canada, April 21, 2001

    "I've coined new words, like, misunderstanding and Hispanically."—Radio-Television Correspondents Association dinner, Washington, D.C., March 29, 2001

    "I am mindful not only of preserving executive powers for myself, but for predecessors as well."—Washington, D.C., Jan. 29, 2001

    "Then I went for a run with the other dog and just walked. And I started thinking about a lot of things. I was able to—I can't remember what it was. Oh, the inaugural speech, started thinking through that."—Pre-inaugural interview with U.S. News & World Report, Jan. 22, 2001 issue

    "The California crunch really is the result of not enough power-generating plants and then not enough power to power the power of generating plants."—Interview with the New York Times, Jan. 14, 2001

    "They misunderestimated me."—Bentonville, Ark., Nov. 6, 2000

    "I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family."—Greater Nashua, N.H., Chamber of Commerce, Jan. 27, 2000

    "I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully."-Saginaw, Mich., Sept. 29, 2000

    "The great thing about America is everybody should vote."-Austin, Texas, Dec. 8, 2000

    "It's clearly a budget. It's got a lot of numbers in it."--Reuters, May 5, 2000

    "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?"-Florence, S.C., Jan. 11, 2000

    "I understand small business growth. I was one."-New York Daily News, Feb. 19, 2000

    "The most important job is not to be governor, or first lady in my case."-Pella, Iowa, as quoted by the San Antonio Express-News, Jan. 30, 2000

    "It's important for us to explain to our nation that life is important. It's not only life of babies, but it's life of children living in, you know, the dark dungeons of the Internet."—Arlington Heights, Ill., Oct. 24, 2000

    "I think if you know what you believe, it makes it a lot easier to answer questions. I can't answer your question."— Reynoldsburg, Ohio, Oct. 4, 2000

    "Natural gas is hemispheric. I like to call it hemispheric in nature because it is a product that we can find in our neighborhoods."—Austin, Texas, Dec. 20, 2000

    "We ought to make the pie higher."—South Carolina Republican Debate, Feb. 15, 2000

    "They want the federal government controlling Social Security like it's some kind of federal program."—Debate in St. Charles, Mo., Nov. 2, 2000

    "It's your money. You paid for it."—LaCrosse, Wis., Oct. 18, 2000

    "There ought to be limits to freedom. We're aware of this [web] site, and this guy is just a garbage man, that's all he is." -- discussing a web site that parodies him.
     
    #9 GreenVegan76, Sep 10, 2003
  10. glynch

    glynch Member

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    I saw the whole debate on Fox last night.

    Lieberman came off like a little snot, just trying to accuse Dean of being anti-Israel. Of course he had to stretch to do that.
    I suppose Lieberman might actually cause some Jewish voters to vote for Bush rather than Dean if that is what it comes down to.

    Way to go Joe.

    The whole obsession of conservos with Dean makes me feel that they fear that he would go after Dubya and not be overly polite like Gore.

    I thought, Edwards and Gephart did pretty well. Kerry not too well. These are the other three with a shot at the nomination.

    Edwards comes off very well if he can just stop smiling too much. He is very well spoken. Gephard, though he came off well, I think just has too much baggage as a weak loser minority leader and pro-war guy, though he tries to spin it.

    I assume Edward was a pro-war guy, also.
     
    #10 glynch, Sep 10, 2003
  11. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    As the Dean campaign struggles to restore credibility, questions still remain:

    Was Dean purposefully *lying* in an effort to slander his Democratic opponents? Or was Dean just simply *unprepared* for that question?

    Either way, the evidence overwhelmingly points toward Dean being dead wrong. His comment was truly outrageous -- he was shamelessly pandering to his minority audience -- all with complete and utter disregard for the truth. How can minorities take the man seriously? He lied to their face abouth his record. Dean needs to take action fast, in an effort to salvage what is left of his candidacy.
     
    #11 El_Conquistador, Sep 10, 2003
  12. GreenVegan76

    GreenVegan76 Member

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    Yeah, at best Dean was guilty of bad decision-making. There was no need to bust out the race card (though it *was* at an event sponsored by the Black Caucus).

    I see what he was getting at (and maybe he *is* the only candidate to talk race with white audiences in his campaign, who knows), but that tactic should have stayed in the barn.

    That said, many conservatives seem *very* threatened by Dean, and that can only mean good things for the Democratic Party.
     
    #12 GreenVegan76, Sep 10, 2003
  13. GladiatoRowdy

    GladiatoRowdy Member

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    A politician pandered to his audience?!?

    OFF WITH HIS HEAD!

    You are really approaching pathetic, T_J. Dean was guilty of pandering yes, and hyperbole certainly, but you are truly grasping at straws now.
     
    #13 GladiatoRowdy, Sep 10, 2003
  14. johnheath

    johnheath Member

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    Dean was pandering to black voters at the expense of both truth, and his fellow Democrats.

    Now, he will lose the support of Jewish Democrats, and their sizable campaign contributions. Dean is DOA.
     
    #14 johnheath, Sep 10, 2003
  15. Friendly Fan

    Friendly Fan PinetreeFM60 Exposed

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    I love reading the comments of a couple of Republican rookies

    can you guys even vote yet?
     
    #15 Friendly Fan, Sep 10, 2003
  16. johnheath

    johnheath Member

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    Some of my best friends are Jewish.
     
    #16 johnheath, Sep 10, 2003
  17. TheFreak

    TheFreak Member

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    Especially if it's Trent Lott.
     
    #17 TheFreak, Sep 10, 2003
  18. Friendly Fan

    Friendly Fan PinetreeFM60 Exposed

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    yeah, I'm sure they are

    and I'm sure some of your best friends are democratic contributors

    what you and Trade Jorge know about politics would fit in a thimble
     
    #18 Friendly Fan, Sep 10, 2003
  19. johnheath

    johnheath Member

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    OK FF, no need for personal insults. Lets just wait and see who is correct. I think that Dean is alienating himself from the other Democrat candidates, and he is bound to be ganged up on for the remaining debates.

    Time will tell who is correct here.

    btw, if I misunderstood your comments, and you were referring to a gigantic thimble, and therefore complimenting TJ and me, disregard my previous statement.
     
    #19 johnheath, Sep 10, 2003
  20. GreenVegan76

    GreenVegan76 Member

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    Yeah, let's try to keep things clean in here -- personal attacks suck all the way around. We all live in glass houses, so we don't need to start lobbing rocks at each other.
     
    #20 GreenVegan76, Sep 10, 2003
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