Let's face it. We aren't going to be able to update our backcourt without taking on risk. What is out there that could be had? Go down the list. The players that are FA are either some combination of restricted, or they are bit players such as Demarr or they have off court issues, such as DS and mary jane, or they are over the hill, ie Finley, Spree, etc. Even the players that are available through trade would come with either bloated contracts or chemistry issues, such as Bonzi, Ricky Davis, Stephen Jackson. There are no riskless transactions that can be made. So what are our best choices: 1. Work a S&T with Portland for DS and Miles/Anderson/Patterson. 2. Work a S&T with Memphis and get Bonzi or JW along with Swift 3. Go after a high profile guard with baggage like Spree with the LLE and then limp along with our PG situation. Who is going to give us a PG in a trade for our expirings that is worth anything without us taking on redundant overpaid players which bog down our salary and put us in lux tax in a year or two? 4. Convince DS to sign for the LLE and then use our expirings to get a SG/swingman at the deadline when some team wants to dump slary. 5. Sign a bit player like Demar or Buckner for the LLE and then use some expirings to pick up a point like Arroya. 6. Trade expirings to a team like Boston for Davis, or Minny for Wally. Then after we do that, we are still screwed for improvement at the point. No money, and staring at lux tax next year. I can't see Les paying the tax. I think we are trying to come up with a reasonable deal to move out maybe half of our expirings for a talent upgrade and still leave some room so that we can re-up Yao and be able to use the MLE without being in lux tax territory next year. But we need to upgrade both backcourt positions if possible. If we can only upgrade one, then CD has to be sure that whatever move we make is an upgrade because after this year, we are going to be fresh out of moves except the MLE and dealing with future expiring contracts after next season. Stoudamire: Really it looks like it is between us and Miami for his services. If Cleveland signs Sarunas, then they are tapped out and don't need him. The way I see it, if Miami wants to pay him more and we can't work a S&T with Portland, or he won't take the LLE then we should let him go and concentrate on getting Damon Jones another Houston product. Or..........Portland is gonna dump Van Exel. We should be able to get him for LLE. Any S&T with Portland should help us as long as it includes one of Patterson/Miles/Anderson. Miles isn't in Portland's plans except as a trading chip and what teams are there that really want to take on his contract. Outlaw is their 3, Webster is their 2, Telfair is their 1, Zach 4, Pryzbella 5. Portland can dump a player with the Lux Tax clause, that will probably be Ratliffe or Anderson. And I believe they have a team option on Van Exel which shouldn't be exercised. If they can then dump another contract or two in a S&T with DS and get back a future pick plus a couple players that give them some veteran backup mentorship to their young players, that are on relatively short/expiring contracts, I think they do it. I guess I believe that it is just a matter of time before a deal with Portland materializes unless West can't find trading partners to dump salary and comes back to us to do a S&T with Swift and Williams and/or Wells. What other deals are out there that would be a talent upgrade and that would make sense? We're going to have to take on some more risk to seriously improve this team this year.
What kind of money does Ruben Patterson make and how long is his contract. I know Patterson has off court issues, but the dood is total thug on the defensive end of the court and can rebound his tail off. Would love to throw him on Manu Ginobli for about 15 to 20 minutes a game.
I like Patterson too. He's arguably also overpaid (makes similar to Spoon) but only has one additional year.
Patterson would be a perfect fit for us IMO. He's a 6-7 mill per yr guy with two years left on his contract IIRC.
Good thread. I'm surprised this hasn't taken off. I liken this offseason in possibility to the one Minnesota had 2 years ago to vault them from pretender up to 1st seed. KG had no help similar to Yao/T-Mac and so they went out and got Kandi with the MLE (I sure hope Swift works out better than that disaster), traded Joe Smith for Cassell, and Brandon's expiring contract for Sprewell. So I guess it's down to Miami and Houston for Stoudamire? I am curious to know which teams have expressed interest in Latrell Sprewell. I would love to trade for Stoudamire and Darius Miles and I think that is a deal Portland would jump all over to dump Miles. There could be some serious defensive potential with him under JVG. I don't see us taking on that contract though. I don't see any team offering Sprewell more than a little over the LLE, so I feel he will ultimately end up here with his former coach. I am wondering what would be more likely, signing Sprewell with the LLE and trading a guard for Stoudamire or signing Stoudamire with the LLE and trading a guard for Sprewell. I think there would be some negative reaction with signing these two guys as a stop gap backcourt, but I would be completely for it as long as the deals were low $. The way I see it, adding Swift, we have formed our young core. Those 3 guys will be there and possibly added to in the future with MLE's. I think however that this team has the potential to be so good this year that they cannot waste an opportunity to improve themselves. I liken it to San Antonio winning with Avery Johnson and Mario Elie and then again later with Manu and Tony Parker. PF Swift/Howard SF McGrady/Glover C Yao/Mutombo SG Sprewell/Barry PG Stoudamire/Sura/James? That's a team that can compete with anyone and is realistic to assemble.
PF Swift/Howard SF McGrady/Glover C Yao/Mutombo SG Sprewell/Barry PG Stoudamire/Sura/James? that's sick
from the cabbage: Agreed. jopatmc you really put some options that would all work, depending on the deal. My preference would be the Portland option, but it's still a shot in the dark. The trouble with this team (even though we landed Stro) is this team is more likely to change more at the trading deadline than the rest of the offseason because of our expiring contracts. Yao is used to continuity and he's had none. Even by NBA standards we're an anomaly considering we've been very much "in the hunt" for the last three years. If we have 30+ wins by the all-star break it may still not mean we can get out of the 1st round and we bank on the future. It takes time for a team to gel and I still think next April this team's going to be very different, for better or worse. It's all such a crapshoot, but I just want us to get young and convince T-Mac he's still a very young guy and we need to have a core of players that suit our stars. Last year we had that, but those guys were just too old to play 89 games.
It really is sounding like that TMac is having a lot to say about who is on this team. I wonder what his feelings are about Miles and Patterson. We're not hearing who he DOESN'T want on the team. But I have to think he is probably talking to Van Gundy and CD about that too. I think they are probably running players by Van Gundy and him to get the agreement before they attempt to get them. I'd sure like to know what he thinks about players like Miles, Patterson, and Bonzi Wells and Jason Williams. Obviously, he is on the DS and Swift bandwagon. Does that mean he doesn't like Jason Williams or other PGs that are out there? What kind of swingman does he want to play with???? I would think he would want a swingman who would dig it out on defense and give him a break and not take away from his shots on offense. That sounds like a Sura type player except more athletic to stay with the better 2 guards in this league. Does that description fit Spreewell? Does it fit Patterson? Obviously Miles can defend. Can he defend the perimeter 2s and 3s and give TMac a break and is he the type of player that would blend his personality and accept being at best the 4th or 5th option? Does TMac like him or not?
If it was up to him, I`d be pretty sure he`d choose DS over JW; one for the fact that they played together already and I think DS is a vet who has playoff experience and is pretty consist while JW over the last few years has shown that he can be a pass first shoot second type PG but tends to jack up contested 3`s and turn the ball over too much at times. Both players would be an upgrade though at the 1. I know TMac has always praised the players who can drain the 3. His boy MMiller... TMac also had some good things to say about DWes last year. I think we need a *Bowen* type player like someone suggested in a different post. A Defensive minded swingman... who can hit the 3 with regularity. Although Mile`s potential and athleticism is very intriguing, he has a pretty hefty contract and I`m not sure how that would work against us when we try to resign Yao to his Max extension. It looks as though for the LLE you are limited in the choices you have, so we are realistically probably looking at the Sprewells, NVE, and Buckner`s of the league. If we were able to sign DS, Deke, and JB then I really dont think we need to make any moves just for the sake of making moves. It wouldnt hurt to have cap room at the end of the year. Yao / Deke / Baker Swift / Howard / Spoon T-Mac / (LLE) Sura / JB / Head / (LLE) (DS) / James / Sura / Ward / Moochie
My ideal scenario would be to sign and trade Wesley, James, and Mooch or Baker for Derek Anderson and Stoudamire. Then resign Bowen, Deke, and Barry and we've got ourselves a pretty successful offseason, not to mention one of the best starting fives in the league. PG - Stoudamire / Sura / Ward / (Moochie?) SG - Anderson / Barry / Head SF - McGrady / Bowen PF - Swift / Howard / Spoon / (Baker?) C - Yao / Deke High character guys all across the board, plus we've retained our most important chemisty guys in Sura and Barry. Stoudamire, Anderson, and T-Mac can all penetrate, shoot the three, and they're all good passers. Anderson's an underrated defender as well. If DA's knees don't hold up, Sura (or maybe even Head?) can step into the starting lineup and we'd still be in pretty good shape. Plus, we'd still have around $10mil in expiring contracts to potentially deal at the deadline. I'd be very excited about a team like this.
man screw darius miles' overrated ass. yeah, he's great athlete but he doesn't do much of anything else. he's a decent scorer but nothing special as he has very little range on his jumper. despite being a great leaper and athlete in a 6'9 frame, he's an average rebounder and poor defender. then we get to his off the court problems which alone are reason enough NOT to want the guy. you thought eddie griffin was a nightmare wait to you get this guy.
You just made the kids cry. Darius Miles has successfully guarded small forwards to point guards such as Steve Francis. "Poor defender" is the clearer not a description of Miles. He has the potential to be a great defender. Stat Highlights of last year: rebounding highs of 12 and 13 assist high game of 8 a 6 steal game and two 5 block games of course a 47pt game vs Denver Game Highlights: January 24 vs Spurs Darius Miles, who had 21 points off the bench, made key plays for the Blazers in the fourth quarter. December 27 vs 76ers Miles continued his impressive stretch as a starter for Portland, scoring more than 20 points for the third time since replacing the injured Shareef Abdur-Rahim in the starting lineup six games ago. December 18 at Detroit In a show of sportsmanship, Brown pulled Miles away from officials as he argued after drawing a technical in the first quarter. The move proved to be costly for Detroit. With 0.5 seconds left, Miles converted a free throw to give the Trail Blazers a 75-74 win over the Pistons. Brown doesn't regret pulling Miles away from the officials. "Why not?" said Brown when asked if he would do it again. "I don't want to see him get ejected. He's a good kid." Chauncey Billups tied the game with a 3-pointer with 7.8 seconds left, but Ben Wallace was called for a foul after colliding with Miles, who was driving to the basket. Brown said the officials got the call right. "It was a foul," he said. "It was unfortunate, because Ben was trying to make a hustle play after someone lost Darius, but it was a good call." Miles missed the first shot free-throw attempt, but swished the second. "That was big pressure -- almost like a playoff game," Miles said. "I just wanted to make one of them, but the crowd was going nuts." December 17 at Hawks Miles, starting for the second straight game in place of the injured Shareef Abdur-Rahim, made 10 of 13 shots, had eight rebounds, four steals and three blocked shots. He's averaging 11 points a game for the season, but has picked that up to 19 in his last three games. "This is what Darius was doing last year before Shareef came in. That's what we expect of Darius," Cheeks said. "When Darius is out on the floor, he can fill up a lot of parts on the stat sheet," he said.
Also, I don't like the Eddie Griffin comparison in terms of baggage. Sure, D-Miles needs a better attitude, but he's never been arrested for shooting at his girlfriend. And if you go to Darius Miles' bio page you can click on his community assists to see all the good things D-Miles has done. Eddie Griffin does not have such a page.
Just for the record Kim, I agree with you about Miles to a certain extent. I think he's a good kid and not a chemistry problem like Bonzi Wells or an (extreme case) like Anthony Mason. However, I DO think he needs to mature a little bit, and he seems to have burned some bridges in Portland. That said, IMO he's Tayshaun Prince without the three point shot. That's the only thing that scares me away from him. But if he could develop a halfway respectable three point set shot, he'd be a very, very good player here. Good man-to-man and help defense, pretty good ball handler, good rebounder, sensational finisher. He's certainly worth a gamble, but if I had to choose between him and Derek Anderson, I'd rather have DA.
I've thought about Miles as well; didn't Portland draft a small forward with their high draft pick? Can't remember now. I wonder; JVG insists we get younger, more athletic. OK, Stromile will sign. And I know we don't want to get too far into luxury tax territory. Still, Tracy and Yao get us on TV a lot; we sell a lot of tickets now (even if our damned crowds often just sit there like oil paintings); would Les open his wallet a little on players, if the team improved enough to actually contend for a championship? Would Portland take on Sura and expiring contracts to sign-and-trade Stoudamire and trade Miles to us? One hell of an athletic, defensive team. 1) Damon, Head 2) Miles, James, Barry 3) T-Mac, Miles 4) Swift, Howard 5) Yao, Deke
Maybe I`m alone on this one but I dont want DA, he is way overpaid and is injury prone. He has been said to have had a bad attitude since the Blazers have decided to go with the kids... I`m all for DS but if we have get anyone else as a filler... it would have to be Miles or Patterson for defensive reasons.
While you can't ignore the talent and athleticism, Darius Miles has the potential to be unmoveable. We're just now clearing the mistakes that Rudy left, and I'd be disappointed if we took a contract that could potentially shackle us. Let's not forget that Darius isn't even a good fit. An amazing talent, and a stud on defense, yet no semblance of a jump shot. We need Maxwells, Kenny Smiths, Mario Elies here. Defenders who are excellent spot up shooters. Adding both Spreewell and Stoudamire would be an ideal stop gap move, but highly unlikely. Let's face it GM's aren't blowing up CD's phone inquiring about Wesley and Mike James. I would like to see us utilize our LLE on either Spreewell or Finley or Stoudamire (thus upgrading atleast one of our guard positions). It's a low risk move and we don't have to worry about taking on an albatross contract via trade, which in my opionion, would be the worst thing we could do. I really fail to see the fascination with Derek Anderson. Remember this guy has the same contract as Mo Taylor. He's injury prone, and while he may be an upgrade over David Wesley -- Why take the risk? He's not a long term solution, just another stop gap. It has been shown that Houston is a desirable destination for free agents. Continually using the MLE could net us young, talented players, that upgrade our roster AND are long terms solutions. And of course there's the draft. My point is that our guard rotation (Sura, James, Wesley, Barry) is temporary. Why should we upgrade with more temporary players who dont figure into long term plans, and then also have to be burdened with undesirable contracts? I'm firmly against this, and I think such a trade may upgrade us talent wise, but would be a lateral move in the whole scheme of things. We need to be careful in our roster building and avoid unmoveable contracts. Rudy left us in a mess, and we're just now recovering from that, I'd hate to see history repeat itself.
Here's why I really like Derek Anderson: He's a good defender. He can stay in front of his man as well as poach the passing lanes for steals. He did a very nice job defensively his one year with the Spurs. I think he'd be a good fit here as well. He's also a very polished offensive player. He's a willing passer who can handle the point, drive both left and right, and he's a good finisher at the rim, both in traffic and in the open court. Though he's a bit of a streak shooter, when he gets an open look from beyond the arc he usually nails it. Finally, he's a guy with high character. He got frusturated last season with the Blazers, but then again, so did Shareed Abdur Rahim, who's always been considered a solid citizen. He won't make waves or be a lockerroom distraction like Bonzi Wells, and he'll do whatever the coach asks of him. Obviously, there's a major caveat; he can only do these things when he's healthy, and recently, that hasn't been very often. Over the past four years he's played on average 61 games a year. That's troublesome, but let's keep in mind that Swift's averaged 68 games a year the last four years, and some of DA's injuries have been a bit fluky. I think he would be worth the gamble. He's a very skilled player. The contract I'm not too worried about, as it will be up in two years anyway.
i think you've gotten a little bit spoiled by the Stromile Swift signing. I highly doubt we can lure high profile FAs every year with just the MLE.
