Ever since yesterday, when I heard about the Rox talking with Antoine's agent, the idea of him playing for us has been running around my head. A few weeks ago when this was mentioned, I was very much against it. It just did not seem logical. However, the more and more I bat it around, I like it that much more. I do not know which side of this relationship most of the interest is coming from, but I think it is genuine and he could be a possibility. I have finally made up my mind however, and I think that adding Antoine is about the best thing we could do this offseason. I like Swift and SAR but would much rather have Walker. This team is not versatile and really only has 2 scoring options, both in the halfcourt. Walker gives us a third in the halfcourt and could help to form the fast break which in reality does not exist. I think his mentality would definetly need to be curbed, but I think Antoine has always been underappreciated and wants to win. Whether playing with him at the 4 or the 3, which Mcgrady on the floor or without, he would make our offense a lot more generally dangerous than it is now. I think that if we get Antoine, we need to get a cheap rebounder also. But by adding Antoine, Rebounder, any maybe Davis or Simmons, we become a contender. We need another guy who can score almost at will, it is not Mike James, but Antoine as a third wheel is solid.
I would love to get Antoine because of his versatility. He is a good player..3rd option yes. Walker and Simmons would just be awesome.
Walker is one streakiest shooters in the game... plays great plays horrible... i do believe he has heart though. that comback game a few years ago in the playoffs was amazing. he was the guy rallying his team back.. it was inspiring to watch, but sometimes i get annoyed by his selfish ways. Then again, he's never played with a McGrady before...or a Yao.... only Pierce and Dirk.
I'd rather just trade for Joe Smith than sign Walker. Smith is only a year older than 'Toine, he understands his role on offense, plays marginally better defense, and by trading for him we could spend the MLE elsewhere. I think JVG thinks that he sees some Anthony Mason in Antoine Walker.
If we acquired Walker, I really think it would be a hit-or-miss type deal. We would either be getting the pre-1st trade Walker that was capable of carrying a team on his back, changing the game in all aspects and playing relatively smart... ---OR--- The Dallas Maverick Walker. I really don't think there would be an in-between since if things go bad, neither party will be happy and this will blow up in our faces. BUT, there's the chance that we could get the controllable, hungry and wanting to win version of Walker and if that's the case, a chance to acquire an all-around, All-Star talent like that at the price of the MLE is done deal for us.
I want my power foward to average at least 45% shooting. 40% just won't cut it. That is why I do not want Walker. That and he takes shots away from Yao and TMAC.
walker is a throater, why would we need him with sura, wesley, and ryan bowen, how many throaters can one team get
There has been times in his career when he has only gotten 14 shots and was still very effective. Understand that Walker is far more talented than Stro, or SAR for that matther, we need talent. Role Players make shots and thats it, We need more than just T-Mac and Yao, we need a few guys with game.
Here's Why 'Toine Walker Fits the Rockets It's easy to dis and hate the possibility of 'Toine. He jacks 3s, when he should be posting up. He plays matador defense. He can't shoot free throws anymore. His stats are not efficient offensively (too many shots relative to the points he scores). He's single handedly has costed me 2 fantasy league championships because of his horrible shooting %, but we'll save that for another time. Most of all, I've never liked him because of that shake and shimmy he does. Just to be clear, if I had my choice of the perfect PF to go with Yao and Tracy, I'd take Elton Brand anyday. However, of the PFs that are available for next year, 'Toine is clearly the best for the following reasons: (For one second, put the shooting issues aside when looking at these other qualities) Veteran Leadership - Yea, 'Toine has been a punk the last few years, but look at the teams he's played on. Celtics where he had carte blanche to jack shots at will. Atlanta, same goes. When he played in Dallas, he actually became more efficient of a player offensively, played less minutes and didn't complain. This to me shows he has the ability to play team ball and listen to the coach and this was Don "I haven't coached for the last 10 years" Nelson. There's no such thing as "uncertain terms" under JVG. Passing - 'Toine can pass the rock. Look at his assists totals. Toine's assists to TO ratio is above average. He's not a proto PF, because he can handle and pass. He would immediately become the best post passer on the Rockets. Let me say that again, Antoine Walker would feed Yao better than anyone the Rockets currently have, Tracy Mcgrady included. Who's the best player to defend a center in the post? The PF of the opposing team. If 'Toine's dumping the ball in to Yao, go ahead and double. I'll take a wide open Toine three any day in our offense. Energy/Intangibles - It's Toine who energized Boston, not Pierce. Again, shooting aside, his decision making is good and he's got something to prove to all the haters. Remember, this is a blue chip player who almost single handedly willed his team to the finals not too long ago with a no defense playing, me-first player in Paul Pierce. He can add some swagger and attitude to an awfully nice Rocket squad. Versatility - Because Toine can handle the ball, you can play Yao, Juwan AND Tmac on the same floor. He can handle the ball up the court and in the half court. This to me is invalueable to the Rocket offense. The ability for a big to shoot from beyond 18 feet, slash to the hoop or make a pass or catch downlow in the halfcourt and also trigger the break with 2-4 dribbles without turning the ball over. This would add a whole new dimension to the moribund Rocket offense. Summary - Yea, Toine needs a 101course in shot selection. I have no doubt this is something that's fixable, especially playing for JVG. He can also learn to rebound and at least try on defense. He certainly has the body for it. Teaching Toine how todo the mother and apple pie activities of a power forward is certainly better than teaching a young Stromile Swift the idiocyncracies of half court offense (how to think the game), passing or shooting beyond 8 feet. Stro is tantalizing for his athleticism, shot blocking ability and I wouldn't be disappointed with his POTENTIAL on the team, but JVG is looking for playmakers that don't turn the ball over in crunch time. Who would YOU trust if you were playing SA in the WC Finals or Detroit in game 7 of the Finals at the 4? Stro or Toine? P.S. As for the others, 'Reef is nice, but we have Juwan. I'd like to see the team do a sign and trade for Toine with the expiring contracts and sign Donyell to play 3/4 and maybe Jaric or Tony Daniels with the MLE.
I just can't figure out where I stand on 'Toine. He seems like the ultimate gamble. If he doesn't work, we've likely got an albatross contract at the PF again, we'd have to give up some pieces to get him, and he could stunt the growth of Yao/T-Mac's duo as well as disrupt the chemistry of the entire team. On other other hand, if he can fit in and play to his potential, we're adding another all-star caliber player to our roster. Of course he'd not actually make the all-star team though with KG and Duncan to compete with, but you get the idea. A well-implemented 'Toine adds a whole new dimension to our offense. We'll have to see about the defense though I guess we should go after Swift and Marshall and if they can't be had, bring on 'Toine.
The one thing that i keep telling people even though i didn't like the idea at first... I really think if JVG really likes this guy then there is something behind it. These past 2 years we have all questioned JVG and his moves. But the 1 thing they all had in common. They ALL worked. David Wesley, John Barry, Mike James. All the other ones were all good for the team and they worked fine. I think there is something JVG sees and wants him. He wouldn't bring someone if he thought he couldn't control his shooting etc.
Hello everyone, this is my first post this offseason... still recovering from the 40pt blowout in round 1 lol I too raised my eyebrow when i heard we had our crosshair on Walker.. but after a few posts in here I have come to the conclusion that getting antoine for the MLE would be a steal. Yes, he has weaknesses and habits that have been detrimental to the progress of whatever team he was on but this is where JVG and the Rockets organization comes in. Walker will come to a situation he likely has never been in before. Dallas was close but he had to share with other rotation Pfs here he will be the primary PF but not the Primary or even secondary scorer. The thing that is really intriging is his ball handling and passing skills. Walker will make Yao and Tmac's job a lot easier in the overall sense. We would now have another post entry passer for yao and another ball handler to free up tmac of some of his ball handling duties. The positives should outweigh the negatives and all the "negatives" conflict with JVGs style anyway, he wouldn't give walker a chance if Walker has no plans in changing his approach to the game and accepting the role the staff places him in. I hope we get Walker, if not Walker then Swift's potential is definately something we have to try.
totally agree. if we end up with walker than you can be for certain that there was extensive analysis by jvg. he knows his strengths and weaknesses far better than anyone here and walker should be well aware of jvg's rep. if two seemingly total opposites come together particularly in a critical offseason for the rockets, it's a good bet that walker has agreed to sacrifice some aspects of his game.
I haven't posted in a forum besides the Hangout since the season ended - for obvious reasons (mainly because the season ended ). However, this was a great post by tranmerica34. Whenever I've seen Walker's name mentioned, I've just immediatly thought no. He's a pretty good player but exactly what the Rockets didn't need. You made me get past that, though, with a lot of great points. Solid post man, I never thought about the things you brought up. I'm not sold on Walker on all, but Stack24 made a great point also. I totally support everything JVG does - ALWAYS HAVE - so if 'Toine is the guy he gets, then I'll be happy with him.
Toine helped a crap Boston team to the playoffs, so I think he'll be good with us. I think when he was in Dallas, that offensive had too many of the same position players. We needa PF big time to shoot open shots, and Toine isnt afraid to shoot. Maybe he'll shoot too much which means Tmac and Yao will work harder to get their own shots. Why we lost to Dallas: 1. No PFs who can shoot the ball answer- Toine 2. No Gs quick enough to help on Dallas answer- Head
"Learn to rebound?" He's an excellent rebounder already... Not to mention Dikembe... he's worked out even more notably well than those 3, amazingly.
I actually have no problems with Toine's 3 point shooting. Everyone keeps bringing up his stats from 3 years ago when he led the league in 3 pt attempts. Remember that he played in Jim O'brien's system: O'brien pretty much told Pierce and Walker to play extremely hard on defense and they were free on offense, that team had 2 options on offense: Pierce one on one, and the 3 pointers. O'brien benched people for slacking on defense, but forgave the bad shot selection. Antoine Walker in his 2nd go around with the Celts was the same player in a different system. Rivers asked him to go to the block, rebound, run, and not take the 3 unless open and Toine pretty much did what his coach told him to do. I didn't have any problems with the 3's he shot, most of them were open and you assume he's going to miss anyway. I have 2 complaints with Antoine's actual game on the floor: 1) He does not have the 20 ft. jump shot; Antoine is either behind the 3 point line, or going to the hoop. 2) He will miss a ton of easy layups; Toine makes some hard shots look easy, but he defintely makes easy shots look impossible sometimes. Toine's biggest strength is his will to win. On the day he first came back to Boston he had a huge smile on his face and buried his problems with Danny Ainge. He was completely miserable losing in ATL. If he goes to Houston Toine will have no problems being the 3rd option. This is a guy that voluntarily gave way to Paul Pierce when he had been on the team longer. In conclusion, Toine is a guy that is good at doing most things on a court (except freethrows) but great at very few things (great hands, passing for a pf). I think about what would happen if the Rockets played the Spurs in the playoffs, and Toine has to go against TD. Defensively I think he'd do better than expected. Toine's favorite defensive move is to strip the ball before the shot is taken, his timing is very good (I remember this tactic bothering Duncan alot when Karl Malone used it in 04). Offensively Toine's contributions would be limited to offensive rebounds, 3 point shots, and transition. An added bonus would be his ability to bring the ball up and initiate the offense. I would project Antoine's numbers to be something like 15pts, 8 boards, on 40% shooting (The numbers would be less if he has to cover for Yao in transition instead of offensive rebounding), perfectly acceptable for a #3 option. So let's sign up Antoine and get ready for the wiggle!! P.S. If he comes for the MLE it will be an incredible bargain, Rajah Bell just got most of the MLE from phoenix. Even if Antoine doesn't workout we can always trade the guy to Isaiah Thomas.
Let's sign him! We will always have NYK to solve our problem and u know JVG loves to trade for Knicks players.
