Are they the best perimeter defenders in the league? better than kobe? better than wade? i believe that they're the best duo but as far as top 5, when they need to turn it on the defensive side of the court, are they the best?
LOL... Kobe and DWade are nowhere near close to being the best defenders in the league. or LeBron for that matter. Ron and Shane aren't as good as they used to be, but they still are very good defenders- especially shane. And yes, they both are better than the 'superstars'.... at defense.
Kobe is good at denying the ball, lebron and wade are great help defenders, shane and ron are some of the best on the ball defenders in the league.
when kobe turns it on that side of the court, he is one of the best defenders in the league, very athletic and relentless. wade just had a article written about his defense, a good read. just asking, do you think they are the best 2 perimeter defenders in the league? if so, we should definitely have top 3 defenses in the league, especially with Yao and Scolandry clogging up the lane.
Good thread. IMO, Shane and Artest cannot be compared to Kobe so easily. IMO, Kobe can be very good when he goes all out on defense but he does not concentrate on D all the time. He saves some energy for his O. I don't believe that a person is a very good defender just because he showed flashes of it or he just turns it up anytime he wants to. If that was the criteria, then they be many players in the NBA who has the potential to be great defenders. But unfortunately, many just don't. Probably due to coaching, game strategies, personal etc. A great defender is being able to show defense every single game. Consistency is the word. Kobe is really good but cmon, he does not do it all the time. Lebron can be a beast one day but i doubt he be an elite defender because he needs the energy for offense. I believe Shane is one of the best, if not the best Wing defender in the game. Having both strength and smarts is a deadly combo. Why is he so good? It's because he is needed mainly for defense and not for offense. Not only is he a smart defender, it is pretty easy when your main job is only to neutralize the opposing wing player.
A "good defender" is very over-rated... opponent simply run a pick-n-roll to get the so called good defender off... that's why ron and shane can't do too much to Roy.. i do think Kobe and Wade are good defenders... the thing is a good defensive guard can't make his team good defensively(pick-n-roll)... a good defensive big man can change the game much more... think about garnnet, even his old Timberwolves team had suffocating defense, he brought that to celtics single handedly
Here the ranking of the most "ferocious" defender according to Sean Deveney (Sporting News). 1. Ron Artest, SF, Rockets 2. Kevin Garnett, PF, Celtics (when healthy) 3. Kobe Bryant, SG, Lakers 4. LeBron James, SF, Cavaliers 5. Bruce Bowen, SG, Spurs http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AhYn671nrmP0iJyfSi2kNsC8vLYF?
there is no way Wade is a top perimeter defender he may get a lot of steals, but that's just because he gambles so much more than ordinary players who know they would get yelled at by their coach if they gambled
not saying that he is, but he is very capable of being one, but does expend a lot of energy on the other side of the court while shane does it on the other. RonRon does it on both sides of the court, and plays a lot of minutes. he's a money ball player.
I hate when people put LeBron in front of Artest in perimeter defense. LeBron doesn't move his feet as well as Artest does, and LeBron doesn't guard the other teams best player for the whole game.
i put lebron as a top 3 perimeter defender right now. he has slowed down "a ton of guys." considering the help defense he provided, i wouldn't have been shocked if he won DPOY next yr as his defense has skyrocketed every year
it's hard to compare, a lot of superstars dont go all out on D, if they just played D and no O they'd be up there....Wade may not be seen as a great perimeter defender, but the guy can shut someone down if the occasion calls for it
Certainly the best pair of wing defenders on any team. When you get to the upper echelon of the Bowens, Bryants, Battiers, Artests(and coming soon Ronnie Brewer) you have this pinnacle of on ball defense that is only rivaled by others at that level. Wade and James are very good help defenders.
but are they the top 2 individually??? i know shane's up there this year, has artest's defense fallen off in the past few years???
Those superstars mentioned are good ONE to TWO posession defenders. By good I mean, AWESOME. But, playing 45 minutes of defense? HELL NO! That's where Ron and Shane excel. Also a part of the reason why they get burned at critical moments so much. It's because they're guarding the elite offensive player for the entire game.
We're not concerned with why they don't play 48 minutes of tough D. if they don't do it, they don't do it, and that excludes them from being the best.
I don't see what you are arguing about? If you play offense and aren't able to compete on the defensive end, should you be given credit for defense? No one said these superstars weren't leading the offense for their respective teams. The question was about defense.
RonRon plays both sides of the court 110%, does this make him more valuable than kobe, lebron, and wade because they exert most of their energy on the offensive side of the court?
