What personnel should a team built around Francis have? Shooters or slashers in the backcourt? Do the Rockets still need a post-up player that commands a double team after Hakeem retites? What players on the current team do you see being long-term contributors? What players on the trading block, potential draftees, or free agents do you feel would be good fits for the team?
One thing about NBA basketball is that most of the teams that had two superstar players had one in the frontcourt and one in the backcourt... Cousey/Russel West/Chamberlain Magic/Kareem Stockton/Malone Jordan/Pippen There are exceptions, of course. Last year, San Antonio won a title with Robinson and Duncan, and the Parish/McHale/Bird trio is often regarded as "the greatest frontcourt in NBA history", although Bird could play multiple positions on the court Generally, though, if you're going to have two star players on your team, you want to get a fontcourt/backcourt combination. If you have two guys with similar skills that both want the ball on every play, then they usually don't work well together because if you shut one down, then shutting the other one down becomes easier. Because a frontcourt player and a backcourt player's playing styles are so different, you need to have two different strategies to stop both of them. Take a look at the Juwan Howard/Chris Webber combination and the Iverson/Stackhouse experiement in Philly, and you'll see that those two situations didn't work out very well When you have excellent frontcourt and backcourt players, however, their games tend to compliment each other. The guard penetrates, draws the defense, and dishes it to the center/forward for the short range jumper or dunk. The center/foreward draws the double team in the post and kicks it out to the guard for a jumper or a drive to the bucket. So, if I were a general manager, I would either go after a big man through the draft or free agency, or develop Kato into a better scorer and shot blocker [This message has been edited by A-Train (edited January 06, 2000).]
Francis and Mobley should be the backcourt. I'm not really too happy with Anderson's production to this point. With a Francis and Mobley backcourt, I think we're about to see a 180 degree shift in methodology. Whereas much of the scoring in the past has come from the frontcourt, it'll come from the backcourt and the SF position (if we can get somebody that'll score for us there; maybe Rogers?). We have our center barring any trades simply because of the salary our center gets : Kelvin Cato. He's adequate, and appears to be getting better. He'll rarely command a double-team with Francis and Mobley on the court. We don't need a dominant center in this offense (but it'd be nice if we had one, wouldn't it?! ). With the way this team is running, we needed a center that is at least a threat to score from the post and Cato can be exactly that. What's needed next? A PF? Is Rogers that PF? Not sure, but maybe. There could be some type of platoon situation here. I'll leave the potential draftees and signees to others. It's too early. But I'd like a Kenyon Martin or a Terrance Morris... would that be too much to ask? Also consider that around this time last year if someone had told you that we could have the #2 draft pick and the best point guard/arguably the best player in the draft later that year, you would have laughed. I'm waiting to see what Rudy does this year. For right now, Cuttino, Francis, Cato, and possibly Anderson are excellent building blocks with which to begin. ------------------ Rocket fuel pumps through these veins...
I agree that it seems like Francis and Mobley are our backcourt of the future, which is great, but it also brings up the redundancy point that A-Train brought up. Mobley seems like a lesser man’s Francis. He’s real strong at his game, since he’s commanding double teams on the perimeter, but at the same time Francis does the same thing. If the same principles apply to double teams in the backcourt as to the frontcourt, which we have had since God knows when, I would think it would be wise to have some shooters on the floor to spot up. The only team I can think of whose PG was their highest scorer was Detroit with Isiah Thomas. His running mate Dumars was more of a shooter than a ball demanding scorer – I didn’t watch much back then, so I may be wrong. Can y’all think of any backcourts that Francis and Mobley might be comparable too and if they had much success leading their teams in the playoffs? Furthermore, if Francis and Mobley are the starting backcourt, what’s Anderson’s role. It seems like he would be right back in the role he was in Utah. Yet, he is consistently listed as one of the key players to build around. As far as small forwards go, what type of small forward would best fit our team vision - bigger or quicker, shooter or scorer? I was thinking of maybe a defensive-minded role player who could shoot the ball. Sort of like the old Robert Horry. I definitely agree that it’s ideal to have a scorer in the backcourt and the frontcourt. Thomas has some nice inside moves. Is it wishful thinking to think that he could develop into a consistent scorer in the post? Some interesting names have been thrown out as being on the trading block on the BBS – Mo Taylor, Antawn Jameson, Olawakandi. I like Olawakandi, but if Cato can’t play PF, that rules Kandi out. As far as the draft goes, I don’t get a chance to watch much college ball, but have looked over some of the draft pages. The only guy whose description really peaked my interest was Chris Porter out of Auburn. They compared him to Chris Webber or a taller, quicker Charles Barkley. He’s listed as a SF at 6-7 and 220. Sounds like he may be a tweener, but he is listed as a top draft prospect I’m sure most of y’all know more about him than me. [This message has been edited by oakdogg (edited January 07, 2000).]
I too am of the front-court/back-court philosophy. Francis is entrenched and Cato is as well -- well maybe. I'd like to keep Cato there anyhow. But he's not our front-court star, he doesn't have the offense for it. So I think we need to get a star-caliber PF in the draft to be Francis' partner. Cato can be the Otis Thorpe in the tandem, except from the C position: getting boards, playing solid D and picking up garbage points (incidentally, if we had him instead of the Heat last night, he'd have played 40 minutes instead of being listed as DNP -- Coach's decision).
RocketRiver, It's a stretch of a comparison. Francis and anderson = BackCourt It is more of a Isiah and Dumars thing than Francis and mobley Yeah, but anderson doesn't equate in any way to either Dumars or Isiah. He's not the scorer either one are or at least he has yet to show it. Mobley would be our Vinnie Johnson Ok, I'll give you that, although I'd much rather have a Vinnie Johnson than a 38% bricker. (I like Mobes, so lay off! ) Kenny Johnson = Bill Lambeir. A Decent Rebounder with a nice outside shot Not sure who Kenny Johnson is, but I'll assume you mean Kenny Thomas. If so, no way in heck. Laimbeer was an enforcer in the middle. Kenny Thomas has grown fond of the 3 while at the same time his 3 appears to be leaving him. Laimbeer was a threat from the outside when needed. Thomas looks like he wants to live out there sometimes. Cato = Rick Mahorn - If he can get grittier and meaner around them board. Um... I guess. But I'd much rather have a healthy Mahorn. If we had Barkley, he'd be our Mahorn. Los = Rodman + scoring [back then Rodman was not a head case Rogers a Rodman? No way. Rodman was a demonic defender which Carlos isn't. Rodman wasn't so offensive minded as Rogers. Rodman throughout his career (as if this will be a shock to you) was a MUCH better rebounder. bringing in a nice Small forward is what we need READ: Adrian Dantley/ Aguirre type [not really but I'm keeping with the analogy] Yes, bring in a "nice" small forward and we'll still be losing. We need a lot more than simply a small forward. In essence you've stated we have certain resemblances to the old Piston teams, but we have nowhere the team they had. Isiah was one of the best PG's to ever play the game, Rodman was one of the best defenders to ever play the game, and Dumars, as I've always said was one of the most under-rated two-guards ever to play (along with Mitch Richmond). ------------------ Rocket fuel pumps through these veins...
I agree; poor analagy. Let's work on making the playoffs before we start comparing ourselves to one of the greatest teams in league history. We are a long way from being the 89-90 Pistons. we are closer to being the 85 Nuggets. Now if only we can get Bryce Drew to guard Shaq we'll be in business. Of course we'd still be eliminated in the second round.
Rockets Comparison: DETROIT Francis and anderson = BackCourt It is more of a Isiah and Dumars thing than Francis and mobley Mobley would be our Vinnie Johnson Kenny Johnson = Bill Lambeir. A Decent Rebounder with a nice outside shot Cato = Rick Mahorn - If he can get grittier and meaner around them board. Los = Rodman + scoring [back then Rodman was not a head case] bringing in a nice Small forward is what we need READ: Adrian Dantley/ Aguirre type [not really but I'm keeping with the analogy] Rocket River not a bad bunch
No argument here that it’s going to take some time for this team to challenge for a title. I just started this thread out of curiousity as to what blueprint the team’s following or should be following for building a team around Francis. The comparisons between some of the 89-90 Pistons players and the current Rockets may have been a bit of a stretch, but it’s interesting in that it provides a blueprint of a team that won the whole thing a couple of times with their point guard leading the team in scoring. I didn’t watch them much, but would I be correct if I said the Pistons surrounded Thomas with essentially a group of guys who played killer D and who could knock down open shots. One could kind of say the same thing about the ’94 Rockets. They won with Hakeem and a group of guys that played killer D (except for Kenny Smith) and could knock down open shots. This also seems to be the way Larry Brown is building around Iverson. Am I correct? It would still be great to have a frontcourt player who could draw double teams as has been mentioned previously. It would be even better than great if one of our players developed into that sort of player. In my opinion, Thomas shows the best potential of our frontcourt on offense. He’s kind of short, but Clarence Weatherspoon got the job done at the same height. Barkley did a lot more, but of course he’s a different story. It’d be cool if we got a guy to do the job in the draft, but I don’t think it’s that easy to find a great post player at our position in the draft even if it is at six. Of course, Rudy found Othella at 30. Rocket River: I’m particularly interested in the Vinny Johnson - Cuttino Mobley comparison. Do they actually have similar games, i.e. do they complement their star point guards’ games in a similar manner? Possibly more importantly, would a young, supposedly budding star like Mobley want to be the Vinny Johnson of the team instead of the Michael Jordan (that question should possibly be asked about Anderson or Drew as well, since Mobley seems to have the inside track on Dumars’ kind of minutes under Rudy)? Also, since I didn’t see much of the 89-90 Pistons, I was wondering if you could compare Adrian Dantley or Aguire to a modern player to give me a better idea of the kind of small forward you see fitting the Rockets. Additionally, do you see Walt Williams having any long term role on the team? I don’t think he’s as bad as some people on the BBS think? At the very least, he can provide some real offense off the bench.
