Tod...point well taken. I don't believe we would get a deal like the Toronto one, but I also think we could do better than Howard. When I think of him, I think of the word "headcase". The Wizards seem to be prime for dealing people, but what other teams can we think of that are also in a dealing mood.... ------------------ Bring It!!
NO! 1. Loyalty - I know u say it's crap but I feel it is the Reason Shandon Came here. 2. Juwan cost too much 3. I like Hakeem's influence on the team both calming and as a teacher. [Show Cato a move or two] 4. When Hakeem retires I expect to see him sitting next to Rudy and Chuck. 5. Juwan cost too much 6. Juwan cost too much for too little. 7. We can do better. Rocket River
Shana, when the Astros win three championships in four years, then you can say that their style of doing business is the right way of doing business (as opposed to the way that the Yankees do business). I love the Astros, but the Astros have never won a post-season series, much less a world championship. The championships have nothing to do with their style of business. The Astros are dollar-for-dollar the most efficient team in baseball. With a salary cap in the NBA, that matters. In the MLB, NYY wins because they simply can outspend everyone. Place them both under a cap, and the Astros will win every time. Granted, NYY would then change their way of doing business, but the point is that efficiency is created by developing youth and getting maximum value from minimum dollars.. Not adding expensive stars, especially overpaid expensive stars. I like Rogers, Thomas and Cato, but I don't know if any of them are going to become the dominant frontcourt player that the Rockets are going to need to win a championship. Well, we are never going to find out if we don't let them develop. For the past 5 years, we've probably had more total players fly through the Rockets than any team in the NBA. Every year, more than half our team is gone. We finally have an incredible young, talented nucleus. We need to stop making trades and let these guys develop for a while... Just this season, we've seen how much they've improved in 40 games... How good can they be if we leave them together for a few years? I'm not opposed to getting more talent, but adding a $15M 20pt/10rb guy when you have a $1M 15pt/8rb guy in Kenny Thomas just isn't worth it. I think we have more than enough pure talent right now. We just need to let it develop both individually and in terms of chemistry.
I thought that the reason why you play the game and the reason why you do business is to win championships. Maybe I'm wrong. Oh, yeah, I forgot, winning isn't the only thing. Maybe that's the case in little league. In the NBA as well as in major league baseball, that isn't true. Winning is the only thing. Yes the NBA plays under a salary cap. And right now the Rockets have a huge salary cap albatross who plays for them -- his name is Hakeem Olajuwon. What I am suggesting is a way for the Rockets to get rid of that player for a person who can actually contribute to the team. The Rockets would not be abandoning their youth movement. They would be complementing their young players with a proven veteran who, in fact, is only 27 yrs. old. Yes he is making a lot of money, but he matches up with what Olajuwon is getting and then we only have him for one or two more years after that. My proposed starting lineup next year would be Cato (c), Rogers (pf), Howard (sf), Anderson (sf), and Francis (pg), with Thomas being the first forward off the bench and Mobely being the first guard off the bench. It seems to me that this trade will not shake up the team the way that you think will happen. Plus we have two first round picks to try getting a true power forward and a center. Substituting Howard for Olajuwon does nothing to the Rocket's salary cap except to the extent that the Rockets will not be able to go out and sign other free agents (which the Rockets wouldn't be able to do next year anyway if they keep Olajuwon). [This message has been edited by tod the bod (edited February 02, 2000).]
Yeah, DreamStillKills, I would have never traded him to the Raptors so that we could have picked up Wally. Not at all. I would also take Dream over Shaq as well.
I thought that the reason why you play the game and the reason why you do business is to win championships. Maybe I'm wrong. Oh, yeah, I forgot, winning isn't the only thing. Maybe that's the case in little league. In the NBA as well as in major league baseball, that isn't true. Winning is the only thing. If you actually read the entire paragraph instead of taking a quote out of context, you'd know that I believe NYY wins not because of their style of business, but because they simply have more money. The NYY does not work in the NBA because of a salary cap. The Astros strategy does. Therefore, I'd prefer the Rockets try to function as the Astros do, not NYY. Yes the NBA plays under a salary cap. And right now the Rockets have a huge salary cap albatross who plays for them -- his name is Hakeem Olajuwon. What I am suggesting is a way for the Rockets to get rid of that player for a person who can actually contribute to the team. You're talking about replacing a $10-$12M player who we are stuck with for one year with a $15-$20M (remember, end of contract salaries are higher than the beginning) player for 4 years. You're talking about doubling our cap cost for a player who sucks: Walt Williams (per 48min): 19.2points, 7.5rb, 3.8assists, 1.25blocks, 1.25steals Juwan Howard (per 48min): 21.4points, 7.1rb, 3.7assists, 0.4blocks, 1.27steals And Howard is the centerpiece of Washington's offense. Do you really think paying Howard to be an $18M Walt Williams is worth it? And being stuck with that taking half of our entire cap room for 4 more years? Hakeem's numbers per minute are even better than both of those. Yes he is making a lot of money, but he matches up with what Olajuwon is getting and then we only have him for one or two more years after that. He makes more money, for several more years, and produces relatively lower numbers, even being the go-to guy for Washington...
Shana: Let's just say that we disagree as to what type of strategy works in the NBA. Let me point out a few facts, however. First, Walt Williams is not Juwan Howard. He will never be Juwan Howard. Your comparison of the two players is silly. Walt has had a few good games in a row but he has never been a consistent player. Howard has scored between 18-20 points a game for five years. Second, Juwan Howard is far from being the centerpiece of the Wizards' offense this year. Howard only takes around 13 shots per game in the Wizards offense. Mitch Ritchmond takes a lot of shots, Rod Strickland takes a lot of shots. Third, I don't know the specifics of Howard's salary or how the money is spread out. Indeed, a lot of the money may be deferred and I have no idea how that impacts the salary cap. If you know, then you have a lot better sources than I do. What I do know is that the New York times said today that Howard is currently in the fifth year of a seven year contract. That means that we would have two more seasons after this season with Howard on our team. We currently have one more year of Olajuwon. Therefore, the Rockets would only gain one more year of a big salary if we trade for Howard.
If I'd had a dog ever since he was a puppy, and he had been my pet for 15 years, and wasn't the same as he used to be......maybe he couldn't fetch as good as he used to, or maybe he just craps in the wrong place more now than he did when he was younger, or maybe he just plain gets in the way sometimes......maybe it's just not worth it anymore for me to have this pet.....chances are I'd still want him to be my pet for as long as I possibly could before I traded him in for another puppy. Hell, he's been my dog for 15 years and he's been the best pet I've ever had, maybe the best pet ever, period...loyal to me through thick and thin....the least I could do is let him live out his last days with me before replacing him. Just because it takes more work to take care of him now, and all his medical bills are hurting my finances a little, I should discard him? After all he's done for me? If he looked like he just wasn't happy with me anymore and would rather be in another place, that'd be a different story. Just looking in his eyes, though, you can tell he still wants to be with me. Yeah, I think I'd like to keep that old dog around for just a little bit longer. [This message has been edited by TheFreak (edited February 02, 2000).]
Shana: Let's just say that we disagree as to what type of strategy works in the NBA. Fair enough. Let me point out a few facts, however. First, Walt Williams is not Juwan Howard. He will never be Juwan Howard. Your comparison of the two players is silly. Walt has had a few good games in a row but he has never been a consistent player. Howard has scored between 18-20 points a game for five years. No, they are not the same player... But it says something that Walt Williams -- even with his horrendous start this season -- is providing the same numbers as Juwan Howard. It says that Howard isn't that good. And it's not as though Howard provides any intangibles... He's never won anything in the NBA, he's never been considered a positive clubhouse presence, players don't respect him as they do an Olajuwon, etc. I just don't see the need to spend superstar money (actually now MORE than superstar money since his contract is higher than any free agent can sign) for non-superstar talent. Second, Juwan Howard is far from being the centerpiece of the Wizards' offense this year. Howard only takes around 13 shots per game in the Wizards offense. Mitch Ritchmond takes a lot of shots, Rod Strickland takes a lot of shots. Then I stand corrected here. Nevertheless, he's putting up Walt Williams-like numbers... Third, I don't know the specifics of Howard's salary or how the money is spread out. Indeed, a lot of the money may be deferred and I have no idea how that impacts the salary cap. If you know, then you have a lot better sources than I do. All NBA salaries escalate per-year, and they all increase the max [with a few exceptions]. Teams are allowed something like a 15% increase in salary each year. At 7yrs/$100M, he's averaging about $15M per year, so the 4th year would be ~$15M, 5th = $17M, 6th=$19M, 7th=$22M. These numbers are a bit high because the 4th year wouldn't really be the $15M average, but you get the point. Not only would be getting an expensive Howard, we'd be getting the most expensive portion of the contract. What I do know is that the New York times said today that Howard is currently in the fifth year of a seven year contract. If this is true, then I guess we only get him for two years, but it's still a bad deal. He costs what Tim Duncan and Grant Hill combined will cost next year....
Freak your analogy is ridiculous but you've got one thing right, Olajuwon is a dog at this point in his career. Second, contrary to your assertions, Olajuwon has not always been loyal to this organization. Early in his career, he was a real jerk and he even faked injury. Third, you are comparing a family pet to a player for a sports organization. Olajuwon was a great player, but I'm not putting him to sleep, I'm just saying that his time is over. The Rockets were first round casualties two years in an row and this year, they probably won't make the playoffs this year. Can we say the championship run is over? Its time to rebuild. Its time to start fresh. We don't need one more year of Hakeem. And here is the worst part of your analogy, at least your dog, when you play with him, shows heart. I don't remember the last time I saw Olajuwon play with any heart. He has two championships, his place in history is set, I don't think he cares any more. Loyalty only goes so far.
I don't want Howard for his contract. However, I wouldn't mind trading Dream and Walt to the Lakers for Rice and Green plus cap fillers. Then we do not have to resign Rice and Green (or cap fillers) and really get into the free agent market. Thus Dream can win another ring playing PF for the Lakers (and for those in the #'s game, he will still be 2 ahead of Shaq, Duncan and Robinson). Also, we can do something nice for Dream by letting him go out on top and not having that monster pound on him anymore except in practice.
You guys are all ignoring the issue that nobody would want Dream anymore . The deal with Toronto would have been great... but I'm glad we rejected it. But seriously, who wants a $14 million dollar center who doesn't play well for more than 10 minutes per game? As a GM for another team, you couldn't *give* me Hakeem.
"Yeah, I think I'd like to keep that old dog around for just a little bit longer." What if you're in the Security WatchDog business?
NO, for sentimental reasons and also because I don't like Howard. I don't see much fire in his play. Yes, Dream has not been displaying the same fire that he once had in the championship years, but he is like family. I will take crap from family but not from an outsider. The most important thing I see though is that Dream had said before that he would retire if he was traded to another team. Why would any team want to trade for a player who is going to retire? Ok, you can use the arguement that "to free up salary". However, from what I've heard, NBA is not going to put up with such crappy type of trade (ala Derek Harper) to allow a team to free up money. I just don't see any type of trade happening with Dream. I believe he is content in retiring as a Rocket.
Hakeem is due roughly 15 million next season not 10 Now do the nuber comparison with money between Howard and Hakeem. Don't get me wrong, I don't want Howard either. Ive seen him play. His head aint in it anymore. Maybe a change would do him good, maybe not. But Im understanding what Tod is saying. If Juwon only has one more year on top of Hakeems contract, with the money being roughly the same. Its worth looking into.
Well, if I was the manager of this 'Watchdog' business, and this dog was the only reason I even had a job in the first place, let alone the reason I was regarded as one of the best watchdog managers in the business, or responsible for me living in a big house in a fancy neighborhood and being financially set for life, or the reason people even recognize me in public, along with the fact that I already had a bunch of younger dogs there to cover his mistakes, and most importantly the vast majority of my customers still felt comfortable with him around, I think I'd cut him a tremendous amount of slack, and definitely think twice before trading my old friend in, even if by some slim chance my business took a small hit for a year.
There are people who show their emotion on the outside and there are others who keep it inside and Hakeem is one of those players. If you ask me he has more heart than anyone in the league. Look at him give up his minutes and stats to let some of these other players get a chance. He wants to make the whole team better and soon he will start playing better ball than anyone in this league. I am sure of that. (Admin Note: "ease up, rook") [Note: This message has been edited by Administrator]
Freak: When you talk about the manager of the business, are you talking about Rudy T. who, IMHO, would be nothing if it wasn't for Hakeem. I definitely understand why Rudy loves Hakeem. Hakeem, almost by himself, gave Rudy T. legitimacy as a coach. People in Houston will forgive all of Rudy's sins because of the two championships even if he is not deserving of it.
Loyalty is something peaple are liable to forget. Pippen became Quitten since he don't have loyalty to this team anymore,not because of lack of skill. We could trade Dream in case we want damage the loyalty in our young star's heart, we know loyalty is mutual.Without it, CB wouldn't played for us for less money, so doesn't Anderson. It is the time for Rockets to show the loyalty to it's player, if we failed to do it on the case of Kevin Willis, we shouldn't make a mistake this time. Loyalty is one of the essential factors for championship. Agree?
