<i>Fourth, I care who plays point guard for us next year. The point guard will be critical in improving our turnover stat next year. We don't handle the ball near well enough and this is a critical area of improvement next year. </i> Exactly who do you think could possibly handle the ball worse than Francis has? If your worry is about improving our turnovers, then almost any PG would be an improvement. <i>Secondly, I think the Laker role players have key roles in making the Lakers a championship caliber team. Kareem Rush and Derek Fisher were absolutely instrumental in winning key games for the Lakers. So its not all about the superstars and should be illustrative that depth is critical in the construction of a contending team.</i> You need both star players and role players. Now, which do you think is easier to do 1) Find Superstars to complement your role players or 2) find role players to complement your Superstar? Have you ever noticed how free agents tend to want to go play with superstars? <i>First of all the Rox are not that far away from contending using the nucleus of this current team. Compare the Rox performance against other teams that played the likely winner of the NBA championship, the LA Lakers. We lasted 5 games and were a couple of shots of taking the Lakers to 6 or 7 games not much worse than the Spurs or the Wolves. We don't need to dismantle this team.</i> Our performance against the Lakers doesn't prove that we're on the level of the Spurs. It only shows that we match up well with the Lakers. We've matched up well with them for the last few years and we did this regular season. Conversly, if we'd played the Spurs or Kings then it would have been a bad matchup for us. <i>Thirdly, Mcgrady is not a messiah. You can think of good and bad scenarios in constructing a trade for McGrady. Trading McGrady straight up for Steve F. would be a great trade for the Rox but trading Steve F. plus Cato might not be a net positive. Sports is replete with teams that mortgaged their futures to get a superstar player to the competitive detriment of the team</i> Steve for TMac is a great trade, but including Cato makes it go from great to a negative? Are we talking about Kelvin Cato here?
We're far from contending. We we were ousted in 5 games in the first round of the playoffs. We lost the games that we did in that series due to the same mistakes that have plagued us for 5 years now. The only reason the series was even as close as it was (if you can call 4-1 close) is because we've always matched up well with L.A. The Lakers don't pack the lane in like almost every other team and Gary Payton is a fossil, both contributing to Steve Francis' unusually productive playoff performance. I'll be the first one to admit that Steve played well and played his heart out, but he just couldn't do that against other defenses as the regular season proved. The zone defense has killed Steve Francis and we're far from contending. I completely agree. I never said you don't need role players to win championships. The point I've been attempting to get across is that these players can be found later. George, Rush, and Fisher were all late Laker first round picks. It's much more difficult to acquire a star player of McGrady's caliber. Look at how that Laker team was built. They got Shaq and Kobe and tried the experiment with Van Excel, Campbell, Ceballos, and Eddie Jones. Over the years, they traded role players as they realized Kobe was becoming a superstar. My point is that role players can always be found. How so? Even if this was true, see my above point. Role players can be replaced. A general rule of thumb in the NBA is that the team that receives the best player in the trade almost always wins the trade. [quoteFourth, I care who plays point guard for us next year. The point guard will be critical in improving our turnover stat next year. We don't handle the ball near well enough and this is a critical area of improvement next year.[/QUOTE] 1) Again, why is this important at all? Are we contending next year? Is there a closing window of opportunity? By trading for McGrady, we would be laying the groundwork for a long term goal. Not making this trade because of the fear that you won't have a point guard next year is short-sighted thinking. 2) Like Aelliot said, if you're worried about turnovers, Eldridge Recasner and Matt Maloney are improvements over Steve Francis. You'de be hard pressed to find a worse point guard (not player) than Steve Francis.
THIS IS A BLANKET STATEMENT TO ALL WHO POST IN ANY BBS IN ANY COUNTRY IN ANY TIME ZONE ABOUT ANYTHING REGARDING THE FOLLOWING - "First of all the Rox are not that far away from contending using the nucleus of this current team. " ...please stop. I scream my pain and my ears bleed from this torture. (passes out)
Already there. I was just revived by life flight an hour ago and i come back and only to find 2 more threads about other trades.
wow this thread is like a car wreck...i know i shouldn't but i cant help but slow down and contribute to the spectacle First of all I think change is desperately needed for the Rox if there is any hope of them contending in the future. With that said i can *sorta* sympathize with those who have the undying man crush on sf3. The guy has been the heart for this team for the past few seasons. If and hopefully WHEN we trade for TMAC the main question i will have is not whether the man can come in and put numbers on the scoreboard...but rather whether or not he can be as fiery and passionate as steve was. I would hate for us to become a team that can put up tons of points on the scoreboard but still looses games because its a soft as a marshmellow.
Wow, tbui, thanks for starting this one. You got the big boys to come out and play with you....and I loooooove reading them.
Sort of accurate, although it was not without cause; It was the first example of what has now become the norm for Carter: the Knicks ( admitedly) keyed on Carter and double/triple teamed him, with pounding, on virtually every play. What was sad for Raptors fans was that, even as young as he was, McGrady showed that he would make teams pay for that practice in the future if it continued...but we never him do it again. He benefited from the extreme attention Carter got, but there's no doubting that, even back then, he steppid it up in the playoffs.
Again, I would only do this for a straight up trade for SF... Otherwise, it wouldn't make any sense... Having said that, I would be happy if SF stayed, but something has to change to make us go deeper into the playoffs...
How good is McGrady? First, he can win the league scoring title. Second if Duncan is the overall best player, and Shaq is the most dominant at a position, then McGrady is th emost talented player and the best pure scorer. If I am the Rockets I would trade anyone and anything but Yao for McGrady. And I would even consider Yao, just for this lineup: Cato MoTaylor McGrady Francis Mobley
Hmm ... let's take that a step further. ... so, those of you who say you'd never trade Yao at any price, would you trade Yao/Taylor/Spoon/A.Griffin/2nd pick for McGrady/Gooden/Stephenson/Hunter/#1/both 2nd picks? If we then took either Okafor or Howard, and picked up Ha Seung-Jin and Chris Duhon in the second round, we'd have a deep team. We could even trade Gooden for Lewis. This would give us a lineup of: Cato/Hunter/Ha Seung-Jin Gooden/(Okafor)/Padget JJ/Boki/(Howard)/Stephenson McGrady/Mobely/Pike Francis/Duhon I'm not saying that Orlando would do this. I'm not saying I'd accept it. I'm playing devil's advocate, and wondering if you think we would go to the championship with this team? Yes, we'd go further in the playoffs, and on paper be a better team. I wouldn't. We'd be Dallas or Sacramento, not like the last 4 champions, LA, SA, HOU, CHI. I think the possibility of Yao being a top 3 player is greater than Okafor or Howard. And, no matter what else comes with that, you hold onto the better player. More is not better. Better is better. Good can be enemy of the best.
if we moved to the East sure...but since we're in the west...nope. Yao, although 'soft' and 'isn't that good', is still an intimidating force.
That's a nice line-up. Orlando may seriously consider this offer. Yao/Howard Oakfor/Howard Gooden Pat Garrity Lue? That's a team full of potential. Their front court will dominate the east.
Quickly speaking I know its fun to Dangle possibilities, but A player mouthing off a comment where he wants to go "if" it doesnt' work out doesn't hold enough water. The media is so off-playoff story happy, they will print anything to get the attention of the fans in the cities out of the playoffs or pondering the offseason. Right now McGrady is on a Team that needs an Overhaul, but they have a lot of collaterel to work with, the no 1 draft pick, Juwan Howard, etc.....which can intice McGrady to stay. And what of the Magic and Rockets organizations, neither which have commented or shown any speculation on such a trade. McGrady is a cash cow with the fan base as is Francis. The economics need to pass by the GMs first, then the coaching staff, and then whomever has say on both sides, and not just Mr. Grady's word of mouth. Sure there is Free Agency, but we are talking trade and he isn't a free agent right now. Besides Yao what makes you think they would take steve, if they did, what else would we give up? It would take more than we want deal with and it might take us a step back....remember if he gets here doesnt' mean he will stay and with the way free agency has changed, if he doesn't win fast enough, don't be suprised if he flees....bottom line: Too Early to truly speculate, Don't know if he will fit the coaching scheme & finally in ironic contrast of players voicing their opinion: "I will never play in Dallas for Bill Parcells" -- Keyshawn Johnson Dallas Cowboys
Thats just a lil too many egos one one team. Tmac and Francis on the same team? I can see the drama coming miles away. Motay, Tmac, Francis, Mobley would have the worst team chemistry in the league. THe biggest reason why tmac would come here is yao, not to play with SF.
Can one of the McGrady lovers make me feel better about his back? I've watched bad backs in basketball and outside of basketball, and I've never seen them get better with age. In fact, I've only really seen intense physical therapy (and/or intense yoga practice) ever improve someone's back. I'm just too damned scared of seeing the Rox trade half the team for a bad back that ends up playing fewer games in a Rox uniform than Glen Rice did.
