Everyone on this board is saying that we have to keep Shandon, draft Moiso, and sign Croshere. That leaves us with one superstar. Mobley will be an all-star, but no superstar. Is Stevie enough to win a championship? I don't think so. A team with a bunch of solid players and one superstar will simply never compete with the Combo in LA. Phoenix also has two superstars, not to mention a budding star in Shawn Marion. Toronto may have two superstars. San Antonio also. Just a few of many teams that the proposed future Rocket roster would have no chance competing with. This is why I say, TRADE UP OR FOR A SUPERSTAR, even if means dumping KT, Cato, Walt, the #9, or even Shandon. ------------------
A team with a bunch of solid players and one superstar will simply never compete with the Combo in LA. Phoenix also has two superstars, not to mention a budding star in Shawn Marion. Toronto may have two superstars. San Antonio also. San Antonio does not have 2 superstars. Robinson no longer qualifies as a "superstar". What the hell is a superstar anyway? There can only be a couple of superstars in this league I think, the rest are all-stars, and good players. Superstars are players who are developed and have reached a near pinnacle in their careers. like Shaq, Mourning, Hill, Webber, maybe Duncan, Payton, and a few others. All stars are like very good players that just need some more development or are missing something to reach superstar status. Guys like Vince Carter, Eddie Jones, Iverson, etc. Plus Shawn Marion is not gonna be a "superstar", maybe an all star, just like Mobley is gonna be. No, STevie is not enough, but he has a good supporting cast. Mobley will become either a very good player or an allstar, so a combo of Franchise and Mobes would be pretty effective, considering that both improve every year. La can be beaten. Remember Portland beat them, until they made the biggest choke ever. Teams just aren't going to give up their superstars... plus losing 4 or 5 players for a superstar would result in a big hole in our roster. You don't have to have 2 superstars to win a championship. You need more than 1 superstar, but a superstar and an allstar + a decent supporting cast is good enuff. Beatin La is gonna be tough, but the right matchups and a good defensive scheme should be good. Besides Shaq's gonna be aging by the time we're ready to win. ------------------ treasurer of the moochie norris fan club
I agree with AlaskanSnowman. Alaskansnowman- Nice Signature. ------------------ President of the Moochie Norris FAN CLUB
I think the Rockets do need more than Francis. They need a player in the frontcourt that can be a fourth qtr type option in the low block. This adds more variation to the offensive scheme as you have guards that can cause mismatches and then a frontcourt player also. Ideally, a long, athletic PF that can blend into this team would a good player to go with the guards imho. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
The Rockets won a title with ONE superstar in 1994, with a solid corps of players surrounding him. ------------------ HOOP-T Hey Shaq, Acme called, and they want their bricks back!
No,he is not enough. However, we have to accumulate a few more quality players before we can do any big trade. ------------------ Fuggetabout it
MManal- You really want Stromile Swift huh? ------------------ President of the Moochie Norris FAN CLUB
With San Antonio, I was referring to the rumor that Hill and Duncan may both play there. Also, there are more than 5 superstars in this league, anyone who consistently takes over ballgames is a superstar. There are also many who will be superstars, such as McGrady and Rose. So, in this free agent group, you have 5 superstars. And in this draft, you have 2 or maybe 3, Swift, Martin, and potentially Miles. Giving up half the team to land one will not be bad, as long as Francis and Mobley are not included. We aren't going to compete for a championship next year anyway, so by the time we become legitimate title contenders, the depth will figure itself out. With a great city and a players' coach, we should be able to get players for the exceptions that will come off the bench in key roles. I didn't say Marion would be a superstar, I think he will be a lot like Mobley. But they have Kidd and Hardaway, who are far away better than Francis and I guess you could say Shandon. Yes, Portland did almost beat them, but a team of Kelvin Cato, Austin Croshere, Cuttino Mobley, Shandon Anderson, Kenny Thomas, Jerome Moiso, and Steve Francis is nowhere near the level of Portland, and won't be in five years either. Even when Shaq is aging, he'll be one of the best centers in the league, and then Kobe won't be inexperienced, he will be in his prime. Better than he is now. We won a title with one superstar, but that was the most perfect situation where everyone fit the offense how you would draw it up on paper. Also, our one superstar was far and away the best player in the league. Not to mention he was a center. It is much easier for a center to take over games, unless the guard's name is something like Jordan. Finally, there were no teams with two superstars that year. Payton wasn't yet a dominant player, but I guess he could qualify as a superstar. Kemp was not at that level though. In today's game, it takes two superstars to win a championship. ------------------
IMHO Steve does need another player (apart from Cat) that can be counted on and is not afraid of taking the last second shot , this player should definetly be in the frontcourt as our backcourt is pretty much set up for yrs to come (as long as cat signs). Think about what a dominant Center of PF would do for us ( I wish Hakeem would be like 32y/o right now) it would create havoc for any oposing team .. who do they guard ? basically it would be "pick your poison " type of situation for any oposing team ... so yes, we do need another dominating type player , one that has that "IT" thing another thread talked about. ------------------ It's all about marketing !
DaFranchise--"We won a title with one superstar, but that was the most perfect situation where everyone fit the offense how you would draw it up on paper. Also, our one superstar was far and away the best player in the league. Not to mention he was a center. It is much easier for a center to take over games, unless the guard's name is something like Jordan. Finally, there were no teams with two superstars that year. Payton wasn't yet a dominant player, but I guess he could qualify as a superstar. Kemp was not at that level though. " Actually, Isaiah Thomas only had Dumars (was he really a superstar?) and a SOLID post. And you're right about the first championship Rockets, although again there was a balance with Vernon (who helped win the Phoenix series that year with a 30 point 2nd half) and Cassell. To win with Francis the Rockets need a serious complement on the front court. However, with the speed of Cuttino and Shandon, I don't necessarily believe the front court requires a superstar, just defense, outside shooting, fire and speed to round out the lineup. ------------------ BRR
This is a good thread. I would argue that you can only have 1 superstar, since there is only 1 basketball. Look at the champions from the last decade or so... San Antonio...1 Superstar- and good role players Chicago....1 Superstar...good role players Houston....1 Superstar...good role players Detroit....1 Superstar....Good role players There can be only 1....yes you can have stars as complimentary players...ala Pippen and Drexler..Dumars...etc. There can be only 1 superstar.....that is all you need.. The most important things..are trust and chemistry. DaDakota ------------------
I had a feeling this would be a good thread, I had a great debate going on a few weeks ago at another message board. Detroit had only Isaiah, but Joe D is a sure HOF'er, something you can't assume will happen with any Rocket except Steve and Dream. Detroit also had the Rodman, the rebounding champ(Kenny will never be that) and a real bruiser in Bill Laimbeer(twice the player Cato will be if he refuses to show some heart). Throw in Vinnie Johnson and that's a great team. The Rockets first championship had one superstar, but read my earlier post as to why that was successful. Scottie Pippen isn't a superstar, but he played like one with Jordan. Alone, he isn't even an all-star, but with Jordan, he is one of the 50 Greatest hands down. The Rockets second championship came with two superstars, Clyde qualifies as one with his rejuvenated play after the trade. The Spurs won a championship in a shortened year that was also the beginning of the post-Jordan era. It was a crazy season, and when Duncan played like the best player in the league(like I said a dominant center is better than any other position), there was no stopping the Spurs. The Rockets don't have the pieces to win a championship yet, it will take the landing of a superstar through either trade, free agency, or the draft. ------------------
San Antonio...1 Superstar- and good role players Chicago....1 Superstar...good role players Houston....1 Superstar...good role players Detroit....1 Superstar....Good role players Check the #2 options on those teams though, David Robinson, Scottie Pippen, Clyde Drexler and Joe Dumars. Aside from that one Houston championship team in 1994, these are are some major major #2 guys to go with the superstar. The Rockets do not have that as Cuttino Mobley is not going to reach that kind of level imho. They need an option of that caliber in the frontcourt that can rebound, block shots, score in the post etc. I dont feel that Austin Croshere is of that level either. Also, yup Francis3, Swift would be ideal, too bad he wont be a Rocket. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net [This message has been edited by MManal (edited June 14, 2000).]
OH, I agree we need better players, but we are so young, one of them might develop into that type of player. Cuttino could be the next Dumars. Whomever we draft at 9 or pickup in Free agency is very important to this. I think that the Rockets do not need another superstar, but need many GOOD players. DaDakota ------------------
Though I disagree that we don't need another superstar, I think it's funny that everyone is comparing Francis and Mobley to Isaiah and Dumars because Mobley made that exact same comparison earlier in the season. ------------------
DaFranchise, exactly, it amazes me that Cuttino Mobley and Joe Dumars are even mentioned in the same sentence. I think people are forgetting exactly how good Joe Dumars was. Thats comparing a HOF type player to someone who hasnt even proven himself more than a really good 6th man. For this team to really make a move, I think they need to pick well at 9 or get someone better or with more upside than Croshere in a deal for it. Then if they can find a way to sign Croshere for a reasonable amount go for it. Dont deal a top 10 pick and commit serious cap room for a role player. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net [This message has been edited by MManal (edited June 14, 2000).]
I am positively sure that both Iseah Thomas and Dumars were thought of as good players when they were just in their 2nd yr. but look what they turned out to be .. I think the same can be applied to our guys , Francis already has many people around the league convinced that he is the real thing , Mobley might have to work a little bit harder to get that kind of recognition because he was not a 1st rounder but who is to say that 3 to 5 yrs down the road they won't be compared to Detroit's back court through out the league .. All am going to say that if this duo can be given a chance for the long run .......Wachale pinche NBA ------------------ "Why can't we just get along"...quote from a scientist in Half-life 2nd edition.
I think that Mobley can be that complimentary player to Francis that we need. All good teams have 2 really good players. IMO, 1 is a superstar and the other one is an all star. With that said, Francis will of course be the superstar, and Mobley will be the other all star. Have you all forgotten the times that Mobley pulled us through in the final seconds? I remember one game(though I forgot against who), Mobley just made like 3 or 4 straight baskets in the final minutes. Plus dont forget the couple of game winning shots that he's had, not to mention all of the other clutch shots that he's hit. Mobley's got all the tools needed to reach an all star status, and even if he doesnt "officially" become an all star by the ballots, he will still be a very good player capable of being the "dumars" in this combination. Remember how much he improved from last season to this season. Really, right now, all he needs is more experience. ------------------ treasurer of the moochie norris fan club
I totally agree w/you Alaskan one... think about this though.... Steve did great for his 1st yr. in the NBA .. can you imagine him 5 yrs from now ????? (barring any injuries) ... It's all about giving them time and w/time comes experience ! also, lets not forget S.Anderson , we all saw the kind of player we have in him , every championship team has at least one guy that will do what Anderson does for us , score when asked upon or defend when ask to do so , can he also be an "all star" ?? definetly !!. ------------------ "Why can't we just get along"...quote from a scientist in Half-life 2nd edition.
