No deal in business is done, till the contract is signed. And if the contract calls for a 72 hours void agreement, then Les is in the good. If I go buy a car and put my name down, but i have 72 hours to bring it back (per the contract) if I find a fault, and I do find a fault, I have a right to take back the contract. Now if I say throw me in a new set of tires, I'm just rewriting the contract. Besides, this is no different that what Anderson/Fagen did to us two years ago, making us, the jazz and (was it seattle) wait for them to decide.
The original deal was for Hill and a rehabilitated Rice. Now Hill is gone and Rice is saying he will 'try' to play thru it. So now there is a chance that all we get out of this deal is an injured player with a 9 mil cap hit. No thanks!! I think this posturing is completely legit. Why take that chance without some sort of compensation? Go get em, Les!!!
BY THE WAY- Mike Kahn was born and bred in NY, has been a new orker his whole life, and is a big NY sports fan. He is just blowing off some steam because Les is worried Rice will get injured when the Knicks KNOW Rice will get injured.
Obviously this is a severely biased board (and I've got no problem with that you are fans of Houston after all) as shown by the near total committment to the sentiment Rice's injuries were nothing and everyone knew about them at the beginning of the deal to the near unanimous idea that Rice's injury was some sort of surprise now. Everything was fine, press conferences were held and everyone said the deal was done and everyone said there wasn't a problem, then Houston tries to squeeze for something more. If Houston had concerns they should have had them built into the original deal instead of trying to screw everyone after it's near completed and everyone else is in an awkward situation. There is no question Houston will lose some credibility around the league because of this.
Maybe with Dallas and NY, but why would any other team care? Has Toronto lost credibility elsewhere after leaking the Stoudamire deal a few years back? The main person affected is Fegan, who is the agent of Shandon, Eisley and Bogues. Fegan will probably never bring another client to Houston, and may cause Moochie to leave, but I'm guessing the feeling is mutual. It's not like this is the first (or last) trade to be rescinded based on a physical. CD, Alexander, and Rudy have every right to be concerned. This is the last time we'll have significant cap room for a long time. If its screwed up by a bad foot, it hurts us significantly more than if we were over the cap.
Houston makes big deals almost every year. People have shown a desire to play for the Rockets, and I can't think of any player who left and then bashed managment (except maybe Hakeem). Now everybody is purporting that the rockets are a classless organization who noone will deal with.. I see no problem w/ insuring against a 7 million dollar a year player who could easily spend his rocket career limping badly. This discussion is all ****e. Hakeem's departure was ego..other than that sad turn of events...where have the rockets been pissing people off.
With a comment like that, you must support a different team other than the Rockets. It would not happen to be NY would it?
The Rockets are doing the right thing period. If Rice himself comes out and say that 6 weeks of soft cast didn't help with the pain, then there is a problem. Question, did the Sean Elliot no-deal hurt Houston's reputation? If it did, I guess no team would trade with the Rockets after that right. No Drexler, Barkley, Pippen, Francis or Giffin trade would have happened because of the Sean Elliot fiasco. I believe that if the Rockets void the trade, their reputation will be intack. Besides, anyone in their right mind would ask for compensation for damaged goods. If you go to any store and fine a defect on an item, the store will either not sell it or give you a discount for buying it. The Rockets "found" Rice's foot isn't healing as expected. They want a discount (conditional pick) or a refund. simple. And if these moves by the Rockets mess with Fagan's mind, well, that alone is whole the effort! Go Les.
LOL If the Rockets do fail Rice and break up the trade, the Knicks should thank us for saving them from giving Shandon crazy money
Dennis, no I'm not a fan of NY or of Dallas. As for why anyone besides NY or Dallas would care, they won't unless they want to or have to deal with the Rockets. Even if this isn't an underhanded trick to blackmail a couple teams by the Rockets it seems that way because of the way it was handled. Just my opinion, of course, and for further ammunition for you all, I never would have traded for Rice anyway (because of his known injuries, declining play, contract and perceived attitude problems).
I completely disgree Hobbs about Houston's standing among teams being hurt. Toronto did far worse, in their dealings, actually leaking information (and everybody knew they had leaked it) about the Stoudamire trade to Houston, and not only did that NOT hurt Toronto's standing with the other NBA teams, it didn't hurt them with Houston, who have made 2 different deals with Toronto since then. The Lakers were accused of tampering in signing Shaq by the Magic, it didn't hurt the Lakers. Philly was accused of leaking info by the Heat in the ill-fated Mashburn/Hughes deal and THAT didn't hurt Philly. I bet teams would make deals with Minnesota if the Wolves have somebody someone wants, even though the NBA dropped the hammer on them. Trust me, the NBA is all about business, and things like this have little, if any effects. I bet New York and Houston would make another deal with each other if it helped the franchises.
Yea, but we'll still have an extra draft pick or two. New Yorkers are just pissed off because they are the ones getting fleeced instead. They should be grateful, because we're taking a player off their hands that they couldn't give away. They're a bunch of ungrateful ingrates. Besides, the trade has already been altered because of Hill signing overseas. Why should we accept less than what was originally negotiated?
This is so silly. No GM is going to pass on a deal with the Rockets because they wanted 'future considerations' for Rice. The simple fact is that a GM's livelihood is based on acquiring talent and shipping out the old, the injured, the tired, and the Barely Cares. Anytime a GM gets the opportunity to do that, he will. Regardless of past dealings. Also, to say it was not an honorable move makes the ridiculous assumption that the process ends when CD agrees to the trade. IN FACT, the process is not done unless LES decides its done, and THEN it is not done until the conditions of the agreement are met, and THEN it is not done until the NBA approves. If there is any change in the material conditions of the contract or in the willingness of the parties to go through with the conditions of the contract, then the contract can be declared void (just as Les let NY and Dallas know he would do). If Les had overstepped his LEGAL authority to get future considerations (as per the contract), you can bet your whining ass that Big Dick Stern would have pushed the trade through as is. To assume that these contracts are sealed on a handshake and a cocktail napkin is extremely naive. These are complex agreements and for someone to pretend the Knicks and Cablevision's (Dolan) lawyers are getting unfairly taken advantage of is laughable. And if there was going to be such a drop in credibility in dealing with the Rockets, why didn't the Knicks pull out and refuse to deal with such a dishonorable crew?
If you're not cheating you're not trying. If Les can get cash and draft picks thrown into the deal then he's to be commended. This is a bidness not some honor roll call! Great job Les!
Hobbs I don't like the trade either- better to let Anderson go free with no compensation and keep the cap room than trade for an over - rated non- moving-over the hill- whining player -past his prime since '96. Other posters have valid points that other teams have questionable ethics. I think in the long term this does not hurt the Rockets. If anything Les Alexander should be respected for scrutinizing the deal to his team's benefit. This is a very good owner- remember how bad it was with Charlie Thomas-General Manager Steve Patterson. Looking forward to a good season. No disrespect intended to Hobbs....
Just as you think it's naive (or silly if you prefer) to think there will be any repercussions, I think it's naive to assume there won't be any. Trades are not technically done until a certain point, but I think someone would be hard pressed to find a player, an agent or a GM who didn't think agreements and trades so finalized that coaches talk in press conferences about their new player mean nothing. There clearly was a deal, Houston for some reason balked after everything had been agreed to (with at least some knowledge they were getting an injured player) and attempted to alter the trade to their advantage while the other teams were in a poor situation. If Houston had problems or questions about Rice, they could have/should have done their homework before it got to the point it did. Doing what they did when they did it does take some of the lustre off Houston's star and I think they will find it slightly more difficult, costly or time consuming in their dealings in the near future. What I am not saying is no one will trade with Houston or that Houston is the pariah of the NBA. The NBA is certainly a business and teams will do what they must to win. They just aren't walking away from the mud wrestling pit without getting any dirt on them. And in the immortal words of Forest Gump, "That's all I have to say about that."
It hasn't taken any of the "luster" off of the Lakers star. After being accused of tampering, they were able to make numerous trades to help their team, including getting Horace Grant. It also didn't hurt Toronto. The Stoudamire debacle obviously didn't hurt them, they were able to trade for Antonio Davis, Jerome Williams, Hakeem Olajuwon, Vince Carter, Charles Oakley and sign Mark Jackson. I don't think Houston holding up the trade and asking for considerations will effect their standing at all. What do you think NBA owners consider more offensive, leaking information or asking for a draft pick?
Boy, nixing the Horry for Elliott trade in 93 or 94 for health reasons really bit us in the behind (not). The "conditional compensation" probably worked out is depending on whether Rice can fully participate next year. Since the Rockets were taking on a currently injured/recovering player, such conditions are rather normal and understandable. Hobbs you are making way to much of this, at the most NY, Dallas and agents are a little pissed (mostly because of the 3 days of insecurity, not the end result), but that will fade quickly.
