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Yao needs more face up game.

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by MrButtocks, Jun 14, 2006.

  1. MrButtocks

    MrButtocks Contributing Member

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    Duncan dominated the same Dallas frontline that's shutting shaq down. It wasn't because he was stronger or that the mavs weren't trying to stop him. It's because he could get the ball within 15 feet and put it on the floor, taking advantage of the same rules that make it a crime to breathe on a star guard. He beats Dampier and Diop by a half-step and it's a foul. They do have to play him from the outside because he's got a jumpshot they respect. Shaq tries to back it in over and over, but Dampier and Diop are pretty strong and Dirk comes over to help out. It's an ineffective approach. Maybe Shaq just doesn't have the agility he once had.

    Whether or not the refs will give Yao calls like Duncan is one thing. But whether he can play like Duncan does is the bigger question. His jumpshot is an option and he's got pretty good handles. JVG is trying to mold Yao's game after Shaq's and Ewing's, pounding it in and depending on guards to get him the ball down low.

    Yao can certainly do that, but I still think we should mix in more face up game in lieu of a constant back-to-the-basket. In fact, in the playoffs it should be the preferred option. Backing it up and getting mauled will be overlooked. But if Yao can drive to the hoop, he'll foul out any opposing frontline and get over 10ft's a game, guaranteed. Yao can overpower, now he has to blow by any center that tries to muscle him.

    Seriously, just think about what Dream would do to Eric Dampier in his heyday. It would be murder. Yao can do it too.
     
  2. dream2franchise

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    It would also be useful because he can see over any double teams and dump the ball into cutters.

    He has lots of trouble putting the ball on the floor in traffic though, he will have to keep his dribble very low due to his height, because otherwise guys will just be swiping at the ball. He's also not the quickest or most athletic guy in the league, i don't think blowing by guys is an option, but he's done it before maybe he can work on it in the offseason.

    Maybe he can start off facing up but then turn his back to his defender like Dirk does. This allows him to get close to the basket and hopefully beat double teams.

    No matter what Yao does, teams will adjust, we just need the necessary talent to make teams think twice about doubling.

    I think making his turnaround hook automatic and maybe one or two pull up moves would help immensly. Otherwise, its all there.
     
  3. m_cable

    m_cable Contributing Member

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    All Yao needs to do is to get comfortable posting up two steps below the elbow. It's hard to front from that position because you'd be giving up an easy angle to lob the ball from the top of the key which avoids weakside cheating. If he gets the ball with the guy on his back, it's just a one dribble jumpstop to a jumphook, or a dropstep away from a 10 foot fadeaway. Mix in that pump-fake, drive left that he likes to use on the right box, and that's a lethal combination of post moves.

    And that last bit is a part of his (limited but effective) face up game. It only goes out to 10 feet, but Yao can either shoot over the top of you or drive left, take two dribbles and lay it up at the basket. It's not inconceivable that he can push it out to 15 feet, and develop that one handed floating bankshot that Duncan uses.
     
  4. dream2franchise

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    But hopefully Yao never loses the desire to improve his game every
    off-season. Its what made Hakeem the greatest.
     
  5. TriCkz

    TriCkz Member

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    I guess him scoring 30+ points at the end of the season just isn't good enough..
     
  6. shsu33

    shsu33 Member

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    I was hoping someone had already said it! Letz just see if he can consistantly play like he did at the end of last season, with a healthy T-MAC, and see where we are. Then we can figure out if/what we need to change in anyones game.
     
  7. TriCkz

    TriCkz Member

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    Thank you.


    There is no need to change Yao or Tmacs game.. we all know what they can do.

    As for Yao.. isn't he doing what we asked for him to do ever since he was a rookie? I mean I know some still want him to be Shaq like but lets face it he's not.. Even Shaq had more time to develop than Yao.

    Tmac will be ready at the start of the season.. that's all I can say.

    The only things you people need to rag on are the REST OF THE ROCKETS.

    But for now...
    The YAO ISSUE IS OVER. (UNTIL WE SEE HIS NEXT GAME)
     
  8. compucomp

    compucomp Member

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    There is room for improvement in almost every player's game. If Lebron and Wade can say that there are elements of their game that needs work (perimeter shooting), I don't think we should say that Yao couldn't use improvement. You can't sit on your laurels because of previous performance.
     
  9. Rockets Dynasty

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    hmm let's see after the toe surgery averages 27 and 12 (minus the Utah game where he broke his foot and played 8 minutes).............


    shot I think about 56 percent from the field and 88 from the foul line during that stretch.

    I really don't see how you would mess with this to face him up like Duncan.

    Watch Duncan against the Mavs. now Shaq, and it's pretty clear Yao IS the only real dominant low post big.

    And he isn't 50 percent soft like Duncan. Granted Duncan may still be the best player in the league, but that's only until we see Yao in the playoffs next year.

    Your 7-6 310 pound with skills has no business facing up especially if you can put some shooters around him, and when he can shoot FT's like Yao can.
     
  10. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    Count me in the group that says Yao should continue to focus on dominating down low with his back to the basket. His face up game now is mainly jumpshots or turning into spin moves. I don't see that changing much. Doesn't really need to. Yao's speed prevents him from doing much damage putting the ball on the floor. The less he dribbles the better because Yao+dribble=many turnovers. I still say he should just get better at knocking his man off the block to get in scoring position. Yao isn't Shaq, Duncan or Dream.
     
  11. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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    Duncan would disagree. This is not an all or nothing suggestion. just something to throw into the mix. Remember when we drafted Yao he was all outside game and we were all concerned about his back-to-the-basket game?
     
  12. Old Man Rock

    Old Man Rock Contributing Member

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    Yao is the best center in the league and arguably the best player in the league right now. Every year he figures out how to get better, let's leave it to him to decide what he needs to improve for next year. Of course you are free to decide what is best for Yao in this forum but somehow I think Yao will figure out what will make him the most dominant MVP of the league on his own.
     
  13. roxfan123

    roxfan123 Member

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    Can't agree with your "best player in the league" statement.
     
  14. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    how can yao develop a face up game when he can't put the ball on the floor like duncan?
     
  15. rocket3forlife2

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    I agree he does..he needs to get quicker as well.
     
  16. MrButtocks

    MrButtocks Contributing Member

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    Hey, I love Yao's post game. Love it. I realize that he's dominant down low. But we don't have those shooters and probably can't get them all in one offseason.

    Duncan is as skilled as any big man in history, yet he chose to put the ball on the floor in the mavs series. He didn't do it because he's soft, he did it as a tactical choice against large centers. Did you see what happened when he saw Dirk on him? He went straight to the low block and punished him, just pure abuse. It only happened like four times the entire series, but I'm pretty sure he scored every time. He can impose his will on a frontline and score against any defender thrown against him. Around strong centers and straight through weaker ones. That's what we all want for Yao.

    We've all seen what Yao's face up moves are limited to: pump fake drive and the shanghai shake. I think they're really effective and I want to see more. They certainly torch guys that try to get right up in Yao's jersey.

    Go to mysynergysports(.com?) and review the highlights of Yao's last game against Orlando. He was unusually mobile, scoring from ten feet out, spinning around tony battie, using pump fake drives, getting the ball from the FT line while moving and driving it in for the and1. He scored less than he did against Indiana, where he was purely old school post up, but he didn't get brutalized and it looked rather easy. More importantly, he got EVERY foul call against Orlando. Mobility is the key to getting those calls these days. I want Yao to foul out those frontlines.

    The big question is whether he can handle the ball like Duncan without turning it over. He doesn't have to blow by Bruce Bowen, but I think his handles are good enough to get a half step on the Dampier's and Mark Jackson's of the league and that's enough. Just mix it up, you know? hakeem never stopped expanding his game, why should Yao?
     
  17. m_cable

    m_cable Contributing Member

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    Luckily for Rocket fans, Yao is showing no signs that he's done expanding his game.
     
  18. verse

    verse Contributing Member

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    why do you want a 7'6" 320+ lbs player attempting to face up and go AROUND a smaller, quicker, player??? :confused:
     
    #18 verse, Jun 14, 2006
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2006
  19. TriCkz

    TriCkz Member

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    I agree every single player in this league needs to improve.. BUT.. For the Rockets right now they need to focus on getting better players to fill around Yao and Mcgrady.. Yao will get better over the summer you can count on that like he's done every summer.


    Lets say Yao does get a face up game or whatever the hell you guys want him to do.. if we don't have any other players besides Yao and Mcgrady were NOT GOING TO WIN. We might be a great season team but come playoff time were done for.
     
  20. verse

    verse Contributing Member

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    really, if you want yao to work on different things in his game, here's a suggestion or five:

    1. work on making his left hand just as proficient as his right
    2. work on making his initial move quicker
    3. rediscover the baseline spin
    4. work on gaining greater separation in the post
    5. work on making an absolutely automatic 10-15 ft faceup jumper (not dribble drive)

    as for facing up, there is absolutely no time i want to see yao face up a shorter, quicker, less talented center and try to take him off the dribble. that doesn't make sense. i have no problem with him facing up a center shooting over him, but breaking him down off the dribble negates his NUMBER ONE advantage...his size and height.

    down the line, once yao has mastered the post (which he has not), sure, go ahead. work on your dribble drive. that's no different than what rasheed wallace does in practices - shooting left handed threes and half court threes. however, for now, i want to see yao work on those things listed above.

    utilize what you have!
     

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