I wonder for Americans who are generally prosperous... what would actually frustrate you so much that you would physically go out and protest your state or national representatives? I'm talking about you in specific. When it comes down to it, there are realities which can be considered at least somewhat inescapable. You have to consider that if you actually want to force a change and it amazingly ended up successful in the context of some kind of mass movement, that means there are things at stake. Nothing is for sure, and most of the time nothing happens. At times in your country's recent history, hundreds of thousands protested and nothing happened. In other countries, sometimes millions protest and nothing happens. There are things at stake. Some people want to get rich. There are goals and dreams. You might be getting a promotion soon or having a child. Maybe you just bought a house. You have a family and/or kids. Friends. Savings. Assets. A job. At the most basic level, you probably have to ditch work to go out and physically make a statement. You might have a mortgage and a job and if you're really frustrated, then chances are jobs are not easy to come by around that time. Historically, physical protest generally succeeds poor economic conditions but what is "poor" economic conditions is relative and the definition of poor economic conditions tends to morph over generations. A prime example, imo, is the economic condition of the people in the bottom 30-40% income level in America. In real terms and in comparison with the rest of the country, they are at maybe a 70 year low right now. At least a 40 year low. But I take it most people on this board are not in that bracket because we have time to post on a message board and read news and the hangout seems to suggest we're more in the first world problems bracket. But there's a threshold. I want to understand what it is that the government could do that could make you act. Mind you, this has to be something that you can realistically prove happened given state secrets, confidentiality, backdoor business deals, etc. What can happen that you can identify and verify that would push you to say "what I own right now doesn't anymore outweigh what I could lose if _______ is true". What's that line for you? Does it have to be something that is being done to you, or is there something that can happen to non-Americans that would make you act? Where is your line?
Probably if my country were to exploit foreign workers like slaves, and had really discriminatory laws. Kind of like this here: http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/commentators/johann-hari/the-dark-side-of-dubai-1664368.html Oh wait, some people chose to work for such governments. And then post anti-American stuff on an American message board.
Not always poor people. For example, the Tea Party or the End the Fed folks. Also, Vietnamese and Taiwanese folks here in Houston are pretty vocal against China. I'm more likely to vote, donate to a cause, or contact my rep.
Yeah that's pretty obviously most everyone's solution. But what would it take? What if the problem was the rep and due to the problem they have rendered "causes" toothless? What is the point at which you will go outside and stand there till something happens and risk your income and assets and dear family? Sure, the advent of iphones and google glass has made it impossible for me and you to even imagine a step back in standard of living, but there is a threshold. At some point, you become a mushroom cloud laying mother****er, mother****er.
You know how the tin foil hat come talk about the gubmint taking their 401ks one day? If for some crazy reason that ever happened I would be in full on riot mode.
Most of America is prosperous compared to the rest of the world. Even Americans in poverty are better off than the middle class in many parts of the world. It is all relative though, poor Americans compare themselves to the wealthy Americans. When did hundreds of thousands of Americans recently protest and have nothing happen? You do realize that there are roughly 325,000,000 Americans correct? Even if there are hundreds of thousands of protesters, it is a small percentage of the American population. Sometimes when you are not a member of a community or a country, you get a skewed view. Most of America is not protesting, most of America watches Ferguson or Baltimore on television when they get home from work and shakes their head prior to doing something else. Why would jobs be any harder to get at that point in time, than at any other point? You seem to think that there is this country wide unrest and desire to protest or cause change. While there are certainly a number of people that do want change, it isn't the majority for good or bad. Yeah... if you really believe that it is that simple, then you are mistaken. There was even more murder and violence in the bottom 30-40% of Americans in the past. Gangs and drugs were even a bigger issue. Everything is relative and poverty is no different. The difference now is mass media and the ability to communicate and learn instantly. Make the country a theocracy. Please give recent examples of where there was such widespread protests, taking the street involving conditions in another nation, that caused massive and long term change? Apartheid? Not that simple. Slavery? No. People act in their own self interest. The USA is no better or worse.
On weekdays? Nothing, gotta go to work. Might protest on Saturdays if the rights of large groups of people related to me in some way are grossly violated.
I don't remember calling him a star before. Why don't you head back to your Lin containment thread, you post there significantly more than I ever did
They don't already? News to me. We both know which group will never study hard enough to be 80% of Harvard but they'll blame someone else instead.
Honestly...I don't think there would be anything on a large scale.. It's probably a combination of me being fortunate to live a fairly comfortable life as well as the relative comfort of living in the US compared to other places around the world. The things I would protest against have such a small chance of ever being acceptable in the United States, that it's not even worth entertaining the notion. Also, I'm pessimistic that some general large scale protest really has much affect anymore...especially when it just consists of shouting slogans that simplify complex problems while offering no solutions. I think if protests asked for incremental tangible things rather than just a smorgasbord of cliches it could potentially go a long way. But yeah, if anything it would probably be some lame thing on a smaller scale in my local community. Like tearing down a nature preserve for a cookie cutter housing development. NIMBY type stuff. I think those are the type of protests that are more likely to be heard and actually directly affect me.
I would have to believe it would actually make a difference. Elected officials couldn't care less about a bunch of people protesting something as long as they're still getting their "contributions" and getting re-elected.
I think you think I'm talking about Ferguson or Baltimore or something. I was referring to the protests against the Iraq war. Btw the biggest protests in the history of the world consist of a small percentage of te population. That's just how protests work. All it takes is a few % outside to show that everyone is furious inside. I'm not really trying to state a opinion here and I feel you're picking at me personally. I'm just asking you what would infuriate you to the point where you would go outside and protest your reps. I'm curious what that line is for you. My curiosity is based on the fact that I look at a country where the citizens are ultra rich and no matter how bad things get, an iphone and a nice car is easy to distract people from absence of rights. I wonder if that's fickle or if people consider that a reasonable position.
But there's never in history been a successful protest where people knew it would make a difference to begin with. Seems like an unreasonable expectation - if it would actually make a difference before you go, then you're either not needed out there or part of the problem maybe?
