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Lights Off? Albers sent down, Nieve called up

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by rocketfat, Aug 5, 2006.

  1. rocketfat

    rocketfat Member

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    could be it for lidge in the closers role folks. Long Relief Lidge? :D
     
  2. RocketFan007

    RocketFan007 Contributing Member

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    I doubt this has anything to do with Lidge since we now only have 4 starters on the team. Nieve will go into the rotation.
     
  3. rocketfat

    rocketfat Member

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    no chance. he was sent down to practice closing, and apparently he's been nasty. he will be closing.

    i'm guessing hirsh gets called up when the 5 spot in the rotation comes up.
     
  4. today

    today Contributing Member

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    I'd love to see what Nieve's got as a closer, been wanting to see for two months now...
     
  5. Rox Addict

    Rox Addict Contributing Member
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    So why do we have Chris 1 hitter Sampson for ?
     
  6. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    We don't... I thought he was sent down when Ensberg came up (and btw, it was a 3-hitter... over 7 innings... against the Cubs of all teams).
     
  7. leroy

    leroy Contributing Member

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    Garner has gotten smart about how to use Lidge. He's pulling him once he gets into trouble. Nieve will not close, yet. He might be the 6th or 7th inning guy for the immediate future, just as Lidge was with Dotel and Wagner in front of him. I don't think we need a 5th starter for the rest of this next week. I'd bet that Sampson gets called back up when we do.
     
  8. The Real Shady

    The Real Shady Contributing Member

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    You're right. You can see when Lidge is about to melt down when he has no control and Garner is now yanking him.
     
  9. superden

    superden Contributing Member

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    *sigh* This is the end of Lidge as we know it.
     
  10. glad_ken

    glad_ken Contributing Member

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    Send Lidge to the minors to work on his stuff. He's not helping the team closing at all this year....
     
  11. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    Are you guys even watching the games?

    Last night, his stuff was all there... up till he faced Stephen Drew.

    He had the good fastball (98+), and the good slider (late-breaking)... contrary to earlier in the year where he really didn't know where the ball was going with his fastball, and the slider was routinely bouncing in the dirt.

    Connor Jackson gets a hold of a 2 strike 97 mph fastball that's up and in (probably wasn't even a strike). Estrada flies out weakly to CF. Shawn Green strikes out on a 95 mph fastball after nastier sliders and fastballs had him missing. Then, Hudson came up to bat...

    Lidge had him down 0-2... and made his pitch on the 1-2 count (outside fastball) that could have been called a strike (borderline). Either way, he put the ball where he wanted to. Credit Hudson for fighting off a couple more tough pitches... he's one of the D-backs better hitters, and Lidge obviously didn't want to throw one right down the middle to him (with the tying run on base).

    After the walk happened, Lidge lost it (both phyiscally, and mentally)... and there's really no excuse for that. Maybe it was fatigue, maybe it was mechanical, or maybe he just didn't want to make a game-losing mistake... either way, those 4 pitches were nowhere near the zone.

    So, in the end, Lidge has an outing that had a little bit of everything... but the key is that he does have the good stuff within him. Its also important that Garner now has a grasp of when Lidge "doesn't have it", versus when he just gets beat by a batter putting up a fight (as Hudson did)... its a very fine line, and batters no longer get themselves out against Lidge as they used to (because they all believe they can hit him now).
     
  12. leroy

    leroy Contributing Member

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    Problem is, he's more effective around 95. When he's hitting 98+, it typically means that he's overthrowing.
     
  13. ak47

    ak47 Member

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    When will we bring up Jason Hirsh???
     
  14. Nick

    Nick Contributing Member

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    Not last night (or the previous successful save against the D-backs). He was throwing 98 in the strike zone. And that is on par with what he's been over his career.

    When he throws it 95, he has to nibble... he can't afford to make mistakes over the middle of the plate (as most pitchers can't). You get away with a little more at higher speeds... but MLB hitters can catch up to stuff they see repeatedly (just see how many HR's Wagner has allowed, even when he throws 98-100mph).

    When he loses it, as he did against Drew and earlier this year, it doesn't matter how fast he's throwing... he's just compltely out of sync mentally and physically. As I said before, the only good thing about this is that Garner now has a pretty good grasp of when Lidge has it, and doesn't... and he won't leave him in to lose the game just because "he's the closer, and he's going to win it or lose it no matter what."
     
  15. rrj_gamz

    rrj_gamz Contributing Member

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    As much as I want to throw in the towel on Lidge, Not yet...
     
  16. rezdawg

    rezdawg Contributing Member

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    I just cannot root for Lidge...I said last week I was done with him and nothing has changed my stance on that. In some twisted way, I kinda hope he royal screws up every time he hits the mound so that we get rid of him. I just have zero confidence in what he can do, despite some wicked pitches here and there...he just doesnt have what he used to.
     
  17. Stack24

    Stack24 Contributing Member

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    Only down side being we won't be able to get anything for him if he continues to be that bad.
     
  18. Major

    Major Member

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    So you want him to suck to prove that he sucks so we'll get rid of him? :confused:
     
  19. JunkyardDwg

    JunkyardDwg Contributing Member

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    If he screws up that means the team most likely loses. So you want the team to lose?

    I agree w/ Nick...Lidge's stuff was there last night but after the walk he lost his focus and loaded the bases. Garner was smart to pull him right there. It's not the end for him yet. I think now it really does seem to be just a mental thing. You could see it last night. He just needs to trust his stuff.
     
  20. rezdawg

    rezdawg Contributing Member

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    If it was up to me, he wouldnt make it to the mound to begin with...therefore, I see it as a problem that he continues to get the chances...either take him out of the closer role or send him down. So no, I dont want the Astros to lose...I want them to get smart.
     

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