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What's the big deal with banning abortion in non rape cases?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Senator, Oct 12, 2020.

  1. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    I didn't realize rape was an option for you. Every woman I've been with had the option to say No. Glad to hear you're Pro-Life except in cases of rape.

    It's really that simple.
     
  2. ElPigto

    ElPigto Member
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    I know you are a smart individual and know exactly what I mean, but if you want to steer the conversation in a stupid direction, I won't be part of it.
     
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  3. Mr.Scarface

    Mr.Scarface Member

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    What's the big deal about banning Assault-style Rifles? Or having Universal Background checks? No one needs an AK or AR-15 for hunting purposes.
     
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  4. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    I'm not clear I follow your argument and the reasoning that got you from discussing limiting abortion to advocating for fathers to renounce babies.

    Correct me if I'm wrong here. Is your argument that since women can end a pregnancy then fathers should be able to renounce any tie the pregnancy so whether the women carries to term or not the father would have no responsibility if they chose to?
     
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  5. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    Your whole argument is based on that premise.

    You are the one talking about the man and woman's financial responsibilities.

    That's the post I responded to, how is that cherry picking?
     
  6. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    Let me first state that I am not opposed to any current abortion laws, but I am not well versed in every law or every situation.

    Even most conservatives understand the incest, rape, deformities, underage and concern for the physical health of the mother angle. Im not going to engage with anyone who does not respect these choices.

    When it comes to the choice of not ready to be a mother, whatever the reason, I do think a father should be allowed that option too. (and im not advocating the father should force the mother to have an abortion). I acknowledge the crippling effect parenthood can bring if its not planned. I do think its a double standard. Im not suggesting fathers can change their mind at anytime after the pregnancy.
     
  7. Rashmon

    Rashmon Contributing Member

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    end debate
     
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  8. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Hard disagree, because you're putting the life and health of the woman in his hands equally. That's BS.

    We do know that some abortions are because of the health of the mother, and that mother, that woman...that has her own life and dreams and goals, should not be forced to risk her life because a man wants her to do so.

    The woman also has her right to life and if the baby threatens that right to life it should be her decision to make that risk or sacrifice.

    I understand that you'd agree, that in those cases (Correct me if I'm wrong) you'd support the woman's choice. But saying it's not only a women's issue and that he has just as much of a right, just disagree there.

    All a man does is donate his DNA, the woman has to actually carry that baby for 9 months. Maybe in the future we can have artificial wombs and the man can claim his baby without the woman having to go through pregnancy, until that point comes though the final decision should be on the mother.
     
  9. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Contributing Member

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    There was a pretty good discourse from an abortion thread on here more than a decade ago. I'm getting old.

    One thing that always bothered me was the "rape" or "incest" exception. It's deeply tragic and in most of the two cases, against the woman's will, but I thought the core and pressing issue was about the innocence of the new life over the will of the mother?

    Potential baby doesn't know it's the product of rape or incest. Defects from incest usually explode two incestuous generations down the line, so that fear is more eugenicist paranoia than anything real.

    So why those two circumstances labeled as the exception instead of the mother being a "physical abuse survivor", "suffers extreme depression", or even "too poor and doing indecent things to pay rent"?

    Bit too arbitrary and paternalistic on what's "acceptable" and what isn't...as if those two are beyond terrible that it's okay to snuff out the unborn when it was previously Commanded that it wasn't.


    More arbitrary lines - What's good for the tanned goose is...
    Antiabortion groups say they stand behind Trump's use of a drug tested on cells derived from an aborted fetus because the president 'was not involved with that abortion'
    • An antibody cocktail President Trump received for his COVID-19 treatment was tested using stem cells derived from a fetus that was aborted in 1972 in the Netherlands.
    • Antiabortion organizations have spoken out against the use of these stem cells, which have been lab-engineered and duplicated, to test vaccines. Trump has also restricted use of these stem cells in research.
    • Three leaders of antiabortion organizations told Insider that though the testing wasn't ethical, they stood behind Trump's decision.
    • One said Trump has been "sensational on the life issues."
    Antiabortion groups told Insider they took no issue with the fact that one of President Donald Trump's COVID-19 treatments — which he is now vowing to make available to all Americans — was tested using cells that originally came from an abortion.

    It is a research practice Trump has severely restricted during his presidency and one pro-life groups have vehemently opposed.

    To treat Trump, doctors gave him supplemental oxygen and treatments including a steroid typically used in severe COVID-19 cases and an experimental antibody cocktail created by the US biotech company Regeneron.

    To test the antibody cocktail's effectiveness, Regeneron used an "immortalized epithelial cell line," or cells that were altered in a lab so they could last forever when they otherwise would not. These cells, now called HEK 293T cells, were derived from the kidneys of a fetus that was aborted in 1972 in the Netherlands.

    When Insider asked three antiabortion organizations — the Heritage Foundation, Texas Alliance for Life, and Pro-Life Action League — about the origin of Trump's COVID-19 treatment, they demurred.

    In the past, antiabortion advocates have spoken out against medical treatments that use components derived from aborted fetal tissue at any point in the creation and testing processes, including experimental coronavirus vaccines.

    However, each group told Insider they would not engage in this controversy — some because they said they believed the cells used in testing bore little connection to the 1972 abortion and others because the antibody cocktail itself didn't contain traces of fetal tissue.

    One organization's executive director told Insider they had no criticism of Trump and supported him because he opposes abortion and has vowed to overturn Roe v. Wade, which would remove Americans' automatic right to abortion.
     
    #49 Invisible Fan, Oct 13, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2020
  10. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    What I'm not clear is you seemed to come into this thread for more restrictions on abortion and I think that is the impression that most posters are getting. Is that not what you intended and you are overall fine with not restricting abortion anymore than it is currently?
     
  11. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    The argument of why rape and incest are exceptions that even those who don't support in general is because of the sense that the product of such conception may be tainted in some way. While not exactly rational I think it falls into deep seated discomfort over those issues. Further I think it is an acknowledgement that an embryo isn't a person as a person born who was conceived from a rape or incest couldn't be killed.

    It's more rationalization and compromise from those who are claiming they are against moral ambiguity.
     
  12. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    What does birth control have to do with the legality of abortion? What? Nobody is forcing women to take birth control.
     
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  13. malakas

    malakas Member

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    All the reasons posted here shouldn't be even up to debate but how about something more simple:

    I like sex and I hate kids.

    Why should I be parasitised for 9 months because of an accident?
    Who are you to tell me that I must have children?
     
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  14. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Use a condom, protective sheaths have been used historically for centuries. If you don't like kids, get a hysterectomy or something reversible after you decide you do want them. Lots of people like all kinds of things , but life is about exercising moderation and control.
     
  15. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    So pro-lifers are free to use drugs that were developed using aborted fetal cells, but not pro-choice people.
     
  16. malakas

    malakas Member

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    Accidents happen and condoms break and pills dont work. Thank god for abortions then!

    Hysterectomy? LMAO
    Why would we ? Nah we are good with all our organs intact.
    What are you the CCP or the Nazis and demand that women sterilise themselves?
     
  17. Master Baiter

    Master Baiter Contributing Member

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    That’s, like, your opinion man. If you want to live that way, good on you but it isn’t your place to dictate how everyone else does.
     
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  18. Senator

    Senator Member

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    Then you take actions as an adult, deal with those actions. I can't go around eating 5 cakes a day and expecting to be healthy, then complaining about a big doctor's bill. You can also open an onlyfans for when you want attention and condoms, birth control, abstinence etc are beneath you, you will not get pregnant from it.
     
  19. Master Baiter

    Master Baiter Contributing Member

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    Hey stupid, getting an abortion is taking actions as an adult. You just want to dictate what people can and cannot do because you personally don’t like it. Newsflash. It’s none of your business.
     
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