Waller County: 'Illegal' Lane Change leads to Death

I've never had an officer have me step out of the car to sign a ticket.

I've smoked cigarettes throughout the process of traffic stops.

I have certainly never had an officer threaten to drag me out of a car because I wouldn't put out my cigarette.

You're lying to yourself if you actually believe the officer acted in a professional way during that traffic stop. You are completely deluded if you believe that anything she did before he literally threatened to "drag you out of that car" and tase her should have led to an arrest.

 

I agree, that part does get buried in the nonsense, but prisoners with a history of depression and suicide attempts have to be treated differently than normal prisoners. You can't put them somewhere that has things they can use to kill themselves.

She admitted to at least one suicide attempt in the last year...that's pretty serious. It's impossible to fully suicide-proof a cell, but bags strong enough to hang yourself with probably shouldn't be accessible to prisoners with a history of depression and suicide attempts.

I don't blame the prison for her suicide, but I would hope they learn from this and prevent further incidents.

 

Then you are fortunate.

I've had officers get me out of my car before during routine traffic stops.

I've had officers make me put out a cigarette on more than one occasion.

Before he threatened to "drag her out" of the car, he had lawfully ordered her to get out of the car, her refusal is grounds to be arrested. I'm sorry if you don't know that, but that is just how it is.

I've dealt with legitimately awful cops before and I'd have taken this cop over them ANY DAY.

 

The officer was not professional and will face reprimand. I will say that being asked to get out of the car is not uncommon. When I was a prosecutor, there were some officers that made a majority of those they stopped get out of the vehicle. I heard different feelings on this. Some cops made the driver get out of the car if there were multiple passengers. Some officers made males exit the vehicle. We never had a single issue with an officer commanding someone out of the vehicle. The closest was a pregnant woman being forced out of the vehicle in the middle of summer for 45 minutes waiting for a female officer to come to the scene. Ultimately a gun was found in the rear seat.

Mostly officers would get in trouble with illegal searches and the interpretation of probably suspicion. Also there were issues with officers picking up prostitutes and sleeping with them or taking their money in exchange for not arresting them. The prostitution issue was very common, came up 1-2 times every year.

 

This is the crux of the problem. The officer was unprofessional and escalated the situation.

 

They both played a large part in the altercation. They didn't like each other before they ever even met. The officer gets more heat (or should) because he is a professional. The narrative that either side was free of blame is false.

If either one of them would have taken a second and had empathy for the other, this never would have happened.

 

Cops see multiple minor traffic violations every day, why do they pull over some and not others?

 

Dare i say it could it be because of profiling i would hope not because that would be so wrong.

 

She was weaving in and out of traffic without signalling while having three prior license suspensions. That alone warrants being thrown in jail. Wreck less drivers ruin so many other lives and it is serious problem.

 

She changed lanes twice without signaling and it looks like she may have ran a red light towards the beginning of the tape.

This also isn't her first rodeo, she has had her license suspended a number of times.

There is no evidence that the stop was improper or a result of profiling....none.

The negligence of the office occurred after the stop.

 

I agree with you that Bland shares much of the blame that said I find it hard to believe that LEO acted properly. If the LEO had suspicions he should've stated those and acted on those right away rather than have a conversation with her. If he wanted to check her for a possible DUI or search the car that should've been stated clearly. He doesn't and instead repeatedly says he was going to let her off with a warning after he arrest her. Why would he say that if he had a valid suspicion?

The whole sequence points to an LEO getting irrate at a rude person, that he doesn't ask her to get out of the car until after she answers honestly why she is irritated and refuse to put out her cigarette and then never states why he was asking her to in the first place. At the minimum it is unprofessional of the LEO at worst it is an abuse of power.

I agree that LE should be treated with respect but as I stated earlier I am very troubled that people just accept that unless one is polite and complete submits to LE the consequence is jail, getting shot or death. That is what we think of in police states not what we should think of in the US.

 

This is exactly the main point right here. I agree there shouldn't have to be a strategy that people have to employ in order to hope and pray the cop acts professionally and you don't get arrested or killed.

The law enforcement officials should just behave professionally no matter what. From a layman standpoint, I get it that people get upset when they feel folks are rude to them. But that needs to be put aside in a professional situation.

Cops should not be the brutal overlords that folks feel they have to bow down to in order not to be shot or arrested. That isn't the role set out for law enforcement in this nation. Great post Rocketsjudoka.

 

I think the main point is that some view following the law, being in control of your emotions, not being an *******, and not attacking a police officer as some sort of "strategy" rather than just something that naturally occurs is the problem. I can understand children and immature teens and young adults possibly struggling with that, but fully grown adults shouldn't have a problem with it.

When you are pulled over by a cop or when in court, you have to act like a civilized adult....is that really so much to ask? Does that really equal a "police state"?

 

Thanks and back at ya FB.

Having worked with LE I understand they have a very difficult and dangerous job. I personally treat them with respect but I try to treat everyone with respect. LE is a very necessary part of our society but I don't think that means that an LEO is deserving of respect than say a building inspector. If someone is rude to a building inspector I don't think most of us would approve of that building inspector then shutting down there business and/or declaring their home unlivable even though that is within the power of the building inspector.

Regarding police here are two personal stories of the differences between the US and other countries and why I think this is important.

One time in Indonesia I rented a motorbike and got pulled over by some Indonesian LEO. They said they knew I was a foreigner by how I was dressed and then asked for my driver's license. I showed them my US one and my passport and then they said they were going to take me in and impound the motorbike because I didn't have an Indonesian license or an international license. I was unfailing polite and referred to them as "sir" and didn't question whether they were right to pull me over or not. They kept me at their police box on the side of the road for about an hour and finally they asked me for a bribe which I paid without question and they let me go.

One time in Minneapolis I made a left turn from a two way street onto another two way street and go pulled over by a MPD LEO. He stated that he pulled me over because the light had turned red when I turned. I calmly stated to him that my car was already in the intersection and that per the law a car already in the intersection has the right of way to proceed rather than block the intersection. He ran my license and let me go.

While I was polite in both cases the difference though is that in the US I felt safe enough to challenge the LEO because in the US we don't fear that they will abuse us. In Indonesia though it is expected that the LE are corrupt, will abuse people in their custody and should be feared. Too many people just seem to accept the idea that LE in US aren't much different in Indonesia that they should be feared.

 

I think it's a troubling problem with our law enforcement. They have all the power in these situations, and they are constantly phishing for incriminating suspicion to exert their authority.

All legal experts agree that a citizen's best course of action is to comply with a LEO's orders, whether you feel it's justified or not. If not, you have to settle it in court. If, for whatever reason, you don't comply with an order because you are not legally required to, a LEO will take that as a challenge to his authority and will not act as courteous or polite to you.

Now, I understand that traffic stops have led to arrests of fugitives, suspects, drug busts, etc., so there's a fine line where there's greater good from a traffic stop. But that line more often that not gets abused to where citizens are subject to invasions of their privacy and rights.

LEOs need an attitude change. They should show more professionalism, courtesy, and be transparent in their actions instead of treating everyone as a dangerous criminal.

 

The scale is heavily weight to one side. That's the problem and society has accepted it up as a norm. It needs to be more balance. Perhaps that famous quote do apply here.

“Those who surrender freedom for security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one"

 

We are in a police state. The police have no legal obligation to protect citizens... That has been proven in the supreme court (example: Warren vs DC) and in other situations. "Protect and Serve" is just a PR slogan.