...and my simple point is every time I wander in is- Dragic isn't getting traded to the Rockets. And every time I I do post, I try to give supporting evidence why he's not getting traded. Sorry that if my input rubs you guys wrong.
If you want to build a case that Phoenix would never trade Dragic, the last GM you should mention is Morey. Starters the Rockets have traded under Morey once they began their post-Yao rebuilding. Brooks Lowry Patterson KMart Lee Budinger Battier Asik Lin Scola (if you count the failed CP3 trade) Ariza That's basically more than 2 starters traded per year. Morey's thing wasn't building assets, it's recycling assets. The idea is to trade players right before their value drops, due to age or expected pay-raise. Guess whose value is about to drop? Goran Dragic once he gets his new contract.
I'm not saying they're a bad team but the deals McDonough have given out hardly makes his players worth trading for. Going back to what you said about Dragic...okay so if the Suns keeps him past the trade deadline and he bolts in the summer via free agency Phoenix just opened up more cap room. That's sound logic and it looks like a win-win scenario but why wouldn't Phoenix just trade Dragic and get back expiring contracts and/or draft picks instead? You can't tell me that if Phoenix is content with Dragic leaving (I'm saying that because you seem nonchalant regarding his departure and how that turns into a bigger cap room) then why don't they move him for assets they can package together with the assets they already have for a bigger fish? Your logic is sound but it doesn't give Phoenix the BEST options of rebuilding the team by accepting that Dragic can walk and saying that's okay because his departure generates more cap room. TL;DR: Dragic leaving via free agency in the summer = cap room Trading Dragic for expiring contract and draft pick = cap room and valuable asset that can be used to build the team
You are too funny. First you are not "from the inside." Second I like your entirely arbitrary 75-80% chance Dragic resigns with the Suns. Dragic doesn't like playing off the ball in Phoenix, he will get high money offers from other teams and the Rockets are one deal away from having the cap space to get Dragic. So this 75-80% chance he resigns with Phoenix is silly. Also you do know there is this thing called salary allocation, and dumping half your cap space on 3 point guards isn't going to lead to anything except an 8-9th place finish year after year. The Suns need a star player, a genuine star. It is unlikely they get one to sign with them (there won't be cap space anyway if they keep Dragic), so they have deal for one. Which means as many assets as possible... You know like some like DMO or the Pelicans pick or other like pieces... Which the Suns would get for losing a player they aren't likely to resign anyway for cap reasons. I don't know if Dragic is dealt, the Suns management seems to like to fight windmills and hope their inevitable slide to 9th or 10th doesn't happen... but your premise is bull****... Especially for someone "on the inside."
Just curious, you do not believe that Dragic is heading to a near max contract this summer? would it not make more sense to trade Thomas?
I'm ...and I'm pretty sure the Suns FO are very confident Goran is going to resign this summer. That's the foundation for everything "Dragic-Suns" I'm positing. Like a late maturing/long prime Ginobili type the Suns want him for the long haul. Dragic made a statement in October that he would opt out and then quickly resign with the Suns...since, he's made statements that he will have an "open free agency". His agent (smartly) has had him "open" up his futures. Only time will tell, but McDonough, Babby and most importantly owner Sarver want Dragic back. And they know he's been put into a sacrificing position this year as asset Isaiah Thomas is kept on display. The FO knows how good the Dragon is despite the numbers this year. IT will get moved relatively soon. Bledsoe could be the chip that helps bring the Suns a star. Tyler Ennis is probably the Suns PG for the (maybe near) future. Goran Dragic is Manu 2.0 for PHX until the 2020s
The thing about the Suns is that their assets aren't that desirable to begin with. We lucked out...yes LUCKED OUT on getting Harden. Everyone knows this. Hell, at the time the trade was made most people thought Morey got fleeced because he traded a number of quality assets at face value for a player that, while had a high ceiling, wasn't pegged to be an elite player. That being said, how is McDonough going to convince other GMs that a package of low ceiling players (Morris Twins), a ball-dominant point guard (Thomas), stiffs at center so far in their careers (Plumlee and Len) and mid-round draft picks are worth trading an elite player for? Presti got a borderline All-Star (Martin), a rookie prospect that did well in the Summer League (Lamb), and a #12 pick for Harden. That was great value back then. What can Phoenix offer in terms of trade to get an elite player? A package of mid-level players on so-so contract extensions that don't have superstar potential?
Not an insider for sure...just having some fun due to all the quote insiders you have around here. In short, I'll be shocked if Dragic is traded before the deadline, and I think there's a very high (insert percentage??) chance he will be a Sun next year. So are you arguing that I'm going to be wrong about Dragic? Are that the Suns are going to do what I predict and they are wrong?
Thomas can and should be dealt but who are the potential buyers for a small point guard that shoots in the low 40s, have low assists numbers, and really can't run an offense? I'd imagine it's a relatively small, minute group. If you're going to use Bledsoe as a trade chip for a star player then the bin you're most likely shopping out of includes Deron Williams, Carmelo Anthony, Joe Johnson, etc. because no one is going to give up great, young talent for Bledsoe. I can respect that the Suns FO would like to keep Dragic but with the moves they made (bringing in Thomas, giving Bledsoe the max, drafting Ennis) and non-moves they made (not addressing their need at SG, not replacing Channing Frye, not getting solid front court help) leads me to believe that either have no idea what they're long term strategy is and is just waiting around for a GM to have a brain aneurysm and offer up an elite player for the privilege of having a set of twins and an undersized one-dimensional point guard on their roster.
I agree if IT gets moves things improve a lot for Phoenix re dragic. I'm sure the intent is to get an asset for IT. But if he's not traded Pho has a problem because the 4 pgs is too much. Dragic has made a LOT of noise about leaving, and his comments are very similar to those made by free agents looking to leave. People intending to stay don't say half that stuff, because they cause concern to the fans who turn on you. I consider all the things that dragic has said to be "trade IT or else". It's up to pho to do that which I unfortunately think can be done fairly easily. The main remaining issue is - will starved give him a max contract for 5 years? Bc that's what he's getting to stay, I think. Given the increase in the salary cap the following year his agent will demand the max. If pho doesn't give that he'll go somewhere to get it. Not sure he deserves it, but I think he'll be within 5-10% of it.
Can't counter your arguments against the quality of Suns assets much, but have to say Len is not a "stiff". Young guys Warren, Ennis, Bullock, Goodwin, Zoki and stashed Bogdanovich? Their trade values when not getting PT? This is going to be tough for the Suns FO. It'll take some time for sure...and luck.
I'll agree to disagree with you regarding Len but you just pointed out another reason why I don't think the FO in Phoenix really have a plan other than to hope an elite free agent falls into their laps this summer: the lack of PT and exposure for their young players. If you don't play your young guys how are you going to build up their trade value?
They signed Thomas because 4/28 (decreasing over time) for him is a quality contract. It's 3/20 next year...somebody will bite eventually in a package. Last summer they tried to hit home runs with a dual LeBron and Bosh signing, but after that (far-fetched) pipe dream evaporated, there wasn't a good FA deal out there. There wasn't a legit Frye replacement...so they gave Toliver a cheap flyer. Didn't panick...didn't force. There wasn't a FA SG that represented a long term quality signing prospect. Didn't force a fit. No need. Bottomline, they weren't going to spend money just to spend money/time is on their side...no need to rush. Be cool. This next summer, the heat will get turned up some more. But this new FO (only in place for 21 months) seems quite alright with taking a gradual glidepath, and accepting that it might be 2 or 3 years before talk of contention is legit.
that harden trade was one of the worst trades of all time, haha And the circumstances won't be repeated, at least not until the salary cap slows back down, stars that get traded are expiring and they only get traded to places they want to go.
Maybe Suns go for Tobias Harris. That's the only "similar" situation to Harden. Other than that Len is good but the Morri are one step out of ending up in jail IT is a dwarf with no defence and Bledsoe has serious injury concerns.
Chris in Arizona is correct in what he is saying IMO. The Suns are not going to trade Goran short of getting a really special player back and currently I don't think the Rockets have one of those they are willing to trade. Most if not all of the Goran trade talk has been generated from the desperate fan base right here IMO. If you are going to give Goran the max salary, this is the summer you want to do it not the summer of 2016 when the cap jumps up to such a large number. If the Suns owner or any owner wants to tie up their star player at a reasonable price for the next several years then do it the summer before the cap makes a giant increase. What I find funny is that everyone on this board is willing to give Goran the max this summer if we trade for him but none of you guys thinks that the the Suns owner would do the same thing. I seem to remember this kind of talk when Morey offered Marc Gasol a nice contract, so many here thought the Memphis owner would be too cheap to resign him but we saw how that turned out. I would love to get Goran back in Houston but it's not happening anytime soon. We had him and we let him walk because we didn't want to give him a player option. Sad.
Goran doesn't want to play against wings (you know, like how he ends up on Ariza against us and Barnes against Golden State and other derpy derp matchups), he doesn't want to be continually matched up on people bigger than him, he's bad at it, he's so bad at it, that Jeremy Lin has been more of a positive than he has this year, and he knows this and complains about it.. all the time. So unless Phoenix get rid of Bledsoe and Thomas, he will go elsewhere, to some team who will let him match up against the little guys where he can use his size to advantage like he has through basically every part of his career where he was good. He made an all nba 3rd team for playing solo pg during Bledsoe's injury last year, so his team showed him faith in him by paying Bledsoe 70m, trading for and paying Thomas 28m, drafting another point guard in Tyler Ennis (not to mention drafting a shooting guard in Archie Goodwin they won't discuss in trades) all to play his position. If you're convinced Phoenix want to max him out, you're also probably convinced that Houston will target Shooting guards in the offseason, Cleveland are looking at small forwards and Portland are looking at power forwards. It doesn't mean they won't, they might really be that stupid though, Sarver hasn't got the rep of most hated owner through his charm and wit.
I disagree with you, Period. I absolutely think Goran likes playing in Phoenix and I don't think you have a clue what you are talking about. I won't address your mindless dribble about shooting guards and small forwards. By the way: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/b...open-playing-knicks-jackson-article-1.2052143 That quote was from December.
But unless they get a Durant type player back why would Phoenix trade away their best and only prospect at center? And a team is not going to trade for markieff without thinking about being obligated to pick up his brother too.
