Okay, but the point was that Obama could have changed things if he wanted to. The fact that he later took credit for removing the troops from Iraq rather than giving that credit to Bush says that he wanted them out.
He tried to "defuse the timer," but there were two parties necessary for that to happen. The Iraqi government decided against it. Should we have overthown the government again at that point in order to keep a residual force in Iraq?
No, he couldn't have. Iraq didn't want American troops there, the situation is on Bush, Maliki, and the Iraqi government.
ISIS leader flees to Syria fearing US airstrikes: Kurdish official Erbil, Asharq Al-Awsat—Leader of the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) and self-proclaimed caliph Abu-Bakr Al-Baghdadi fled the northern city of Mosul to return to Syrian territory after the US authorized airstrikes on ISIS positions in Iraq, a Kurdish official said. In comments to Asharq Al-Awsat, Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP) spokesman Saeed Mamo Zinni said: “Caliph of the Islamic State Abu-Bakr Al-Baghdadi left Mosul for Syria a few days ago.” “According to our intelligence sources, Abu-Bakr Al-Baghdadi traveled to Syria as part of a convoy of 30 Hummer vehicles after fearing being targeted by US airstrikes,” Zinni said. He added that Kurdish Peshmerga forces have been able to kill a number of ISIS senior leaders... ...ISIS continued its attack on Iraqi Yazidis on Wednesday despite US airstrikes. An informed source in Mosul, speaking to Asharq Al-Awsat on condition of anonymity, said that ISIS had killed all Yazidi men in the villages it had besieged around Sinjar after a deadline for them to convert to Islam expired. “[ISIS fighters also] raped the women and girls, and took the children to Mosul,” he added. http://www.aawsat.net/2014/08/article55335468 Nothing to see here, the Yezidis are safe according to Dear Leader. Good to know the Head A$$hole is safe in Syria, too, far beyond the reach of the hamstrung US military. Everything is kosher.
Here is an informative timeline and background compilation by CNN on ISIS for the many factually challenged posters we have here: ISIS Fast Facts By CNN Library http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/08/world/isis-fast-facts/index.html If you're bored and want to learn something it's worth a click.
So since he couldn't "defuse the timer" instead he decided to take credit for it as if it was his doing till it ended up being a negative thing? Is that about right?
Not that anyone cares about Al Qaeda anymore, and of course these guys are still just a bunch of JV fudds, but... U.S. official: ISIS 'credible alternative to al Qaeda' The Islamic State terror group is now "a credible alternative to al Qaeda" that is "expanding its presence" with foreign fighters returning from Syria, and possibly Iraq, to their home countries, a U.S. intelligence official said Thursday. The official, who declined to be identified due to the sensitive nature of the information, has direct knowledge of the latest intelligence on the group, also known as ISIS or ISIL. According to an assessment, the group has grown in size since the spring and its takeover of Mosul in northern Iraq as more fighters from around the world have mainly traveled to Syria to join its ranks. The United States believes that while the group remains largely focused on its brutal takeover of large areas of Iraq, there is also an "expansion of its external terrorist ambitions." Some foreign fighters are returning to their home countries with orders to "start new cells" of terrorist activity, the official said. What to know about ISIS While some members may have a desire to attack the United States, the group's leadership is still focused on establishing an Islamic caliphate. Still, they "see conflict with the United States as inevitable," the official said. Full Story: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/08/14/world/isis-terror-threat-al-qaeda/index.html Nothing to see here, keep moving.
Oops, sorry to interrupt your argument with all of those red lines... Looked to me like you were talking to yourself.
Ok...I was one of the biggest opponents to the Gulf War 1 & 2. The first one was somewhat justified, the second one was criminal. I hated George Bush with a passion. Everyone who knows the region knew this is what would happen without Saddam in a power. That being said, if his son Qusay took over the country would have been run by a guy that belonged in the insane asylum. Once Saddam was eliminated & the USA decided to implement democracy to a people who's religious leaders believe that democracy is anti-Islamic (but many in Iraq who were moderates welcomed the opportunity to vote), the power struggles, suicide bombings & chaos ensued. This was Bush's mess. Iraq needed more than training. It needed protection from its neighbours that were at the ready to strike once 'Big Brother' USA left. The Kurds wanted an autonomous state, the Shia & Sunni wanted to divide the land & the minorities (Assyrians & Yezidi) wanted either a safe haven or the same rights that were given to the Kurds. All these groups hate each other. Obama decided to pull out the troops from Iraq assuming that it was ready to stand on its own two feet. Wrong. Obama decided to support the Muslim Brotherhood & help orchestrate the overthrow of other 'dictators' & destabilise the leadership in other Islamic countries...leading to the chaos that is raging now in since the 'Arab Spring.' Obama decided to arm radical terrorists that he called 'freedom fighters' that are now spreading terror across not only Syria, but Northern Iraq. The situation in Iraq is like giving a gun to a child, showing the child the basics on how to use the gun, then sitting back and watching as a bully comes into the home, steals the gun & slowly executed the child's family. Obama sits back & watches the eradication & displacement of entire ethnic and religious groups by the Animals he helped, directly or indirectly, fund & arm. He could quite easily use drone strikes to take out most of, if not all of ISIS...but he chooses to sit back, watch & not get involved? If it's a question of economics, Iraq can easily pay for the cost of the war with oil. So yes, Bush stated this mess. The Iraq war was his mess. But the chaos that you see right now is Obama's mess. Bush might have spilt the milk, but Obama is slaughtering the cow...leaving a trail of destruction where ever he implements his 'foreign policy'. You might think that I live to trash the left, but when Obama was elected I marvelled at his speech, I was so excited that America had finally got a black president, I was happy that Bush was gone & a new era was beginning in World Leadership...but now when I look at Obama I shake my head. He had tarnished the worlds view of America. At least Bush, even Clinton had the backbone to do something when he saw someone in trouble. What we are seeing today is Obama's mess. He has a lot of blood on his hands. The history books will show that he supported those that wanted to overthrow stable governments & establish a caliphate...an 'Islamic style Soviet Union' if you will. Typical of a Leftie socialist...we have them in Australia too, thank God we voted them out of power. So continue to throw you personal insults and blindly support your Obama as hundreds & thousands of people continue to get slaughtered in the name of 'Change.'
It appears that we might be engaged in a fight for Mosul Dam. I mentioned this as a critical area a wile back. We've GOT to recapture it. US launches airstrikes near Irbil, Mosul Dam Kurdish forces backed by U.S. airstrikes on Saturday were attempting to regain control of the strategic Mosul Dam from insurgents in northern Iraq. Islamic State militants meanwhile killed around 100 Yazidi men near the northern Iraqi town of Sinjar, after they refused to convert to Islam. The men were killed on Friday, while women and children were detained and taken to an unknown place, surviving residents told dpa. The United States launched airstrikes with jets and drones against Islamic State targets in northern Iraq, striking targets near the Mosul Dam and the city of Irbil, the U.S. military said. Full Story: http://www.thehindu.com/news/international/world/us-launches-airstrikes-near-irbil-mosul-dam-islamic-state-militants-massacre-yazidis/article6325382.ece Islamic fighters kill scores of Yazidi men in Iraq Islamic extremists shot scores of Yazidi men to death in Iraq, lining them up in small groups and opening fire with assault rifles before abducting their wives and children, according to an eyewitness, government officials and people who live in the area... Meanwhile, warplanes targeted insurgents around a large dam that was captured by the Islamic State extremist group earlier this month, nearby residents said... ...Elsewhere in northern Iraq, residents living near the Mosul Dam told the AP that the area was being targeted by airstrikes. The extremist group seized the dam on the Tigris River on Aug. 7. Residents living near the dam, which is Iraq's largest, say the airstrikes killed militants, but that could not immediately be confirmed. The residents spoke on condition of anonymity out of fears for their safety. Full Story: http://news.yahoo.com/iraqi-officials-islamic-state-group-kills-80-men-085635455.html Here's to hoping they're realy careful using air power around that dam. I'd be extremely worried that it could break the damned thing, and cause what we are trying to prevent. Ah... They know what they're doing. Hopefully. Probably...
Read what I posted instead of always trying to shoot the messenger...& the name is Izak (Issac - as in Issac Hayes 'The Chef').
No, they didn't. We're you even reading yet 14 years ago? much less analysing the future socio-political scenarios of of a multicultural democracy in Iraq.
all you said was Obama decided to arm the rebels... IIRC wasn't Obama criticized for NOT sending weapons to the Syrian rebels? I remember McCain on sunday talk show asking for this weekly.
It was a big mistake getting involved with Syrian rebels & The Arab spring IMO. I never supported arming the Syrian rebels or helping The Muslim Brotherhood... But that's just me. ...and to Dubious. Yes I was reading 14 years ago, in fact I was reading during the first Gulf War too. My mother's family is from Iraq & we had a fair idea that without a 'Saddam' like figure ruling in Iraq , once the US army left the Shia & Sunni would reignite their centuries old conflict...if we knew this, I'm pretty sure the highly paid intelligence agencies around the world also knew it. All I can do now is pray that some sort of stability returns to the region. That the killing of innocent Christians, Muslims & other minorities stops, and that peace will prevail.
No. They're not. ISIS is much, much more competent. Years of running from the American military means that a lot of the cultural weaknesses of Arab militaries ( excessive deference to superiors, viewing maintenance as a "Western devil magic" thing) have been forced out of them in a process of natural selection.
Ok, I guess you don't like David - kinda like Hussein right? Still, I wasted my time re-reading your post - you didn't explain how Obama armed the ISIS. Shoot the messenger? Yes, because the messenger is just making stuff up.
